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survival

Big Wall climber

A Token of My Extreme

Apr 23, 2010 - 12:14am PT

Wow, you guys gotta get over yourselves.

I don't think so. If Dean wanted to stand with the old school ethic, he would.

Just for the record, jumping on the "new-school-wagon" doesn't make you younger or hipper, you're still from a different era.

What's up with this "you can't aid a free line" thinking? You can take that a step further and say "You can't free that line, it's been aided."

Unrestrained "change" doesn't make you hip or cool, it just makes you look current.

You might be current, but not necessarily relevant.

What is the true RIGHT here?

There is none, do as you please. If I drive four foot spikes all the way up a wall, it's not wrong, just new, right?

Mimi

climber

Apr 23, 2010 - 12:19am PT

Yeah, but it all comes down to protecting the rock. Hence, clean aid on a freed line concept.

Studly

Trad climber

Apr 23, 2010 - 12:21am PT

Has anyone done a second ascent of this route? Kind of like Wings of Steel...maybe somewhat questionable tactics used and everybody bitching about it but nobody getting off the couch and going for it. Its not that far of a hike...

Mimi

climber

Apr 23, 2010 - 12:24am PT

Studly, "but nobody going up it." = wrong for WOS. Plenty of people have been up it.

Not really a fair comparison of these two routes.

survival

Big Wall climber

A Token of My Extreme

Apr 23, 2010 - 12:27am PT

Yeah, but it all comes down to protecting the rock. Hence, clean aid on a freed line concept.

Southern Belle is truly more "protected" rock than Growing Up....PERIOD!

Mimi

climber

Apr 23, 2010 - 12:33am PT

Yes, technically, that is a true statement.

TripL7

Trad climber

san diego

Apr 23, 2010 - 12:40am PT

survival- "What's up with this 'You can't aid a free line' thinking?"

Perhaps Dean was being facetious when he implied that!?

As in, hey, you guys are such purist yada yada yada! Why aren't you making a huff about continuing to aid free lines?

But then again, no one continued to do the the East Face of the Column(Astro Man)as an aid route, or the Rostrum after they were successfully freed!

Not certain, but just looking at it from a couple of dif perspectives.

Brian More

climber

Rancho Palos Verdes, CA

Apr 23, 2010 - 12:45am PT

"I love him who does not hold back one drop of spirit for himself, but wants to be entirely the spirit of his virtue: thus he strides over the bridge as spirit. " I love him who makes his virtue his addiction and his catastrophe: for his virtue's sake he wants to live on and to live no longer."

One will do what one does... nothing else

I love Sean and Doug

HATRED AND NEGATIVITY= POISON

Karl Baba

Trad climber

Yosemite, Ca

Apr 23, 2010 - 01:04am PT

Chief, DR was long gone while Sean and others were still working the route. Sort of seems like a breech of trust to tell them to all break down their stuff because he was leaving dodge doesn't it? You gotta trust your partners or you shouldn't be climbing with em.

Sh#t happens... some of it is our fault, some others, some fate, some a difference of opinion.

If you insist that everyone act perfectly and not make mistakes, the universe has a way of circling that back in your face in unpleasant ways.

I know I'm a fool! I'd be scared not to be. (and still get spanked by my stuff)

Peace

Karl

tradmanclimbs

Ice climber

Pomfert VT

Apr 23, 2010 - 05:42am PT

You wankers still crying about a rout that none of you have even looked at? Go up there and climb the effin thing and then you can piss and moan about it if you still feel so inclined...

Karl Baba

Trad climber

Yosemite, Ca

Apr 23, 2010 - 09:46am PT

Coz wrote

I replaced anchors on El Cap, got popped using a power drill. It is my fault, not Kurt's or the Park Service. I tucked up, only by getting caught.

DR and Sean, can you two stop blaming others? Just be men and take fault.

So the power drill was your fault only but DR needs to take the blame for Sean's routes on Half Dome. Seems like you guys were way more equal partners on the Muir/Shaft than Dr and Sean were on HD. It was way more Sean's gig in both time and climbing chops eh? It only appears to be more of a joint effort on this thread because DR showed up and didn't minimalize his responsibility

Peace

Karl

Hawkeye

climber

State of Mine

Apr 23, 2010 - 11:58am PT

karl your argument is akin to fighting over what caliber bullet just killed all your family. it doesnt matter.

DR wrote the article, defended the style here and unfortunately added to the degradation of style by leaving trash lying around.

.

TwistedCrank

climber

Ideeho-dee-do-dah-day boom-chicka-boom-chicka-boom

Apr 23, 2010 - 12:10pm PT

Let he who is without sin cast the first stone. Sez so on the tee shirt.

Patrick Sawyer

climber

Originally California now Ireland

Apr 23, 2010 - 12:27pm PT

ROTFLMAO

Petty comes to mind.

Not Tom though.

Hawkeye

climber

State of Mine

Apr 23, 2010 - 12:30pm PT

you are right....very petty to spray about a rapp bolted route in the mags and leave a bunch of trash in the backcountry...no arguments there.

the Fet

climber

Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La

Apr 23, 2010 - 01:19pm PT

Stating these guys just left their trash for the man to clean up and they didn't care is inaccurate.

I have no problem taking people to task for their transgressions, but to misrepresent what they did is dishonest.

Sean and Doug have been forthcoming about the trash and accepted responsibility.

//Sean Jones
Apr 20, 2009 - 01:16am PT
All the while me and my fam were packing everything we had and moving to Vermont. Talk about being spread thin. Anyway a couple of friends at the very end absolutely promised me that I could get in the truck and head east in peace with the fam and they would get the rest.

I paid them over a thousand dollars in gear and money to do this and told them they could keep everything they took out as well. At least a thousand or more worth of perfectly good gear.

I checked in with them constantly after leaving and am fully aware that they never did the job. One excuse after the other.

I'm coming to Yosemite for 3 weeks and will be there in less than a week now....had they have done their promised part.....well I wouldn't be going up to So. Face at all.

The first thing I have to do and will be doing now is hiking back up to the pig and dragging all this down. I'm pisse about this as I paid out the ass to have this done and will now be dealing myself.//

//Buju
Big Wall climber
the range of light Apr 21, 2010 - 09:42pm PT
It has been cleaned up //

//JesseM Apr 22, 2010

Let me clarify one other thing. I issued citations for this incident (I can't divulge who received them). The two individuals felt horrible about this incident, and accepted there fines humbly without protest. I can't say I've ever had such gracious offenders. These guys, like all of us at some point, had a string of unfortunate events, and they didn't prioritize this clean-up. They tried to get others in the community to help out, and eventually that happened...only the community members happened to be wearing a uniform.//

//DR
Yes, we left some trash.
There was miscommunication between us about who was packing out what.
I am quite humiliated.
Yes, we acknowledged it to Jesse and his crew.
Tried to go up and pack it out myself, but they already had.
Yes, we were fined and we paid.//

Sean stated the first thing he was going to do when he got back was clean it up, but it had already been done.

Fire away with critisism but base it on what actually happened, don't spin it into something it's not.

On another note:

//The Chief Apr 22, 2010 - 05:07pm PT
I am still waiting for the day that he or anyone else on this project, comes clean on the true manner in which some of these bolts were drilled.//

That sounds to me like an accusation of power drilling. If so why not come right out and say it? And also say what leads you to believe this? That's a serious charge to be thrown out in such a superficial manner. Either talk to them in person if you want to keep it quiet, or state the facts as you know them so it's not vague libel.

Patrick Sawyer

climber

Originally California now Ireland

Apr 23, 2010 - 02:26pm PT

Ohhhhh, jaysus, did I step on somebody's toes? Is that a bolt you just clipped into? That's like, so unnatural, dude. Wahhhhh, somebody call the wahmbulance.

Far be it from me to judge others, but...

...lighten up (is that a verb or adjective, it couldn't be a noun, perhaps an adverb... hmmm, food for thought).

wildone

climber

GHOST TOWN

Apr 23, 2010 - 02:46pm PT

What in the hell are you talking about chief?
I got tendonitis in my elbow from hand drilling bolts. You ever drill that half dome granodiorite?
You know how many times we'd come back from being in El Portal for the weekend and find our haulbag, (which we'd fixed 15 or so feet off the ground on the first pitch), completely unpacked and spread out at the base with nothing missing?
We were being observed all the time by some anonymous ranger(s)-(I can guess who), and when we left, they went through our sh#t almost every time looking for power that didn't exist.
You wanna talk about a waste of taxpayer dollars? Those guys make 60k to 80k a year. How many days were they sitting on they shoulder of liberty cap watching us through glass and hiking in to poke through our sh#t?