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Curt

climber
Gold Canyon, AZ
Jan 8, 2017 - 07:42pm PT
explain why Mr Sanders was not knowledgable of the super delegate process

I never said he wasn't.

explain how Sanders chose to not use his decades of government contacts and process experience to not do exactly what Clinton did, reach out to and ask for the support of Super Delegates

My guess is that he did, but Clinton started locking these supercandidates up years before Sanders even decided to run.

even playing field, two equal government experience contestants, Bernie blew this, period.

Maybe. I think (1) the DNC supercandidate system was a colossal blunder and (2) the supercandidates themselves failed to see which way the political winds were blowing.

Curt

Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Jan 8, 2017 - 07:53pm PT
I don't think the DNC intentionally "rigged" the primaries in favor of Clinton or conspired to make sure she was the party's nominee. But, when they put in place the "superdelegate" system, the DNC afforded an insider like Clinton the opportunity to lock up those controlling delegates, basically locking out any other more viable candidate like Sanders. I think this was an unintentional consequence--but still a major mistake on the part of the DNC.

Curt, you may be right, and we have to live with that, if so.

But do remember the alternative scenario that was running in the other party----18 candidates that included some amazingly unprepared people...and this was after the previous one, that had the likes of Herman Caine, et al.

I think it was a deliberate move to try to get past the fringe candidates like Webb, allow the serious candidates to maximize air time, minimize ridiculous fights over non-policy (hand size, etc), and minimize the waste of millions upon millions to get through the primary and onto the main election, where the best thinking on both sides was that every penny would be needed to campaign.

I'm sure this all will be studied for the next 100 years, but I don't think that the concept that was being used was a bad concept----it just maybe didn't work out well with THESE candidates, with THIS election, and with TRUMP in the mix.
thebravecowboy

climber
The Good Places
Jan 8, 2017 - 07:58pm PT
Curt

climber
Gold Canyon, AZ
Jan 8, 2017 - 08:05pm PT
But do remember the alternative scenario that was running in the other party----18 candidates that included some amazingly unprepared people...and this was after the previous one, that had the likes of Herman Caine, et al.

Oh, agreed. It was a "perfect storm" of consequences that led us to President Elect Trump. Had there been a smaller slate of more qualified candidates running on the Republican ticket, I doubt Trump would have prevailed. Had there also been a Democratic candidate with less negative baggage, we also might be in a different place.

Curt
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Jan 8, 2017 - 08:13pm PT
I think this says it well:



"I am not mad at you that Clinton lost. I am unconcerned that we have different politics. And I don’t think less of you because you vote one way and I vote another.

No… I think less of you because you watched an adult mock a disabled person in front of a crowd and still supported him.

I think less of you because you saw a man spouting clear racism and backed him.

I think less of you because you listened to him advocate for war crimes, and still thought he should run this country.

I think less of you because you watched him equate a woman’s worth to her appearance and got on board.

It isn’t your politics that I find repulsive. It is your personal willingness to support racism, sexism, and cruelty.

You sided with a bully when it mattered and that is something I will never forget.

So, no… you and I won’t be “coming together” to move forward or whatever. Trump disgusts me, but it is the fact that he doesn’t disgust you that will stick with me long after this election."
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Jan 8, 2017 - 08:16pm PT
Oh, agreed. It was a "perfect storm" of consequences that led us to President Elect Trump. Had there been a smaller slate of more qualified candidates running on the Republican ticket, I doubt Trump would have prevailed. Had there also been a Democratic candidate with less negative baggage, we also might be in a different place.

With 20-20 hindsight, I'm convinced that Biden was the only alternative that could have come through. His life circumstanced caused that not to be. I do not believe that Bernie was electable in a general campaign, though I know others think he was.
Curt

climber
Gold Canyon, AZ
Jan 8, 2017 - 08:21pm PT
With 20-20 hindsight, I'm convinced that Biden was the only alternative that could have come through. His life circumstanced caused that not to be. I do not believe that Bernie was electable in a general campaign, though I know others think he was.

Well, we'll never know. I believe Bernie would have beaten Trump. The one thing they both had in common was their ability to tap into the discontent of middle-America and their very real sense disenfranchisement.

Curt
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Jan 8, 2017 - 08:30pm PT
Can you imagine Trump giving a sh*t about any of this?

[Click to View YouTube Video]

Look at how he interacts with hero John McCain. You know why he holds his arm at such a weird angle.
JC Marin

Trad climber
CA
Jan 8, 2017 - 08:32pm PT
What have progressives given us?

A short list--

The GI Bill
Endangered Species Act
Environmental Laws
The Space Program
The Peace Corps
Americorps
The Civil Rights Movement
Earned Income Tax Credit
Family & Medical Leave Act
Consumer Product Safety Commission
Americans With Disabilities Act
Freedom of Information Act
Women's right to control their reproductive future
Allowing citizens to view their own credit records
The Brady Bill (5-day wait on handgun purchases for background checks)
Lobbying Disclosure Act
"Motor-Voter" Act
The Voting Rights Act
Unemployment Insurance
Medicare/Medicaid
Food Stamps/WIC
Social Security
Peace between Israel and Egypt
Peace between Israel and Jordan
The Department of Education
The Department of Energy
The Department of Transportation
The Department of Housing and Urban Development
Labor Laws (8 hour workday + weekend)
The Marshall Plan
Winning World War II
Food Safety Laws
Workplace Safety Laws
The Tennessee Valley Project
The Civilian Conservation Corps
The Securites and Exchange Commission
Women's Right to Vote
Universal Public Education
National Weather Service
Product Labeling Laws
Truth in Advertising Laws
Morrill Land Grant Act
Rural Electrification
Public Universities
Bank Deposit Insurance (FDIC)
Centers for Disease Control and Prevention
Public Broadcasting
The United Nations
NATO
Mark Force

Trad climber
Ashland, Oregon
Jan 8, 2017 - 08:42pm PT
Indeed. Nicely done.
patrick compton

Trad climber
van
Jan 8, 2017 - 08:44pm PT

True Patriot.
jgill

Boulder climber
The high prairie of southern Colorado
Jan 8, 2017 - 09:43pm PT
I'm convinced that Biden was the only alternative that could have come through

Probably, but my choice would have been Jim Webb - Annapolis grad, war hero, secretary of the Navy under Reagan, senator, lawyer, and novelist. Middle America would have embraced him, I would guess. But in all probability the Cintonistas saw to it that his ship was sunk early on.
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Jan 8, 2017 - 10:50pm PT
Probably, but my choice would have been Jim Webb - Annapolis grad, war hero, secretary of the Navy under Reagan, senator, lawyer, and novelist. Middle America would have embraced him, I would guess. But in all probability the Cintonistas saw to it that his ship was sunk early on.

I thought Webb was intriguing.....and then he sunk his own ship with his moment of killing bliss, where he appeared to relish committing a war crime, that made him seem unhinged. From that point on, he had nothing to say to me.

the fact is that you blame his destructiveness to Clinton, but I saw absolutely nothing said about him by anyone, except individual voters that found him (as did I) creepy. Fact is, I like him as an author.
Bob D'A

Trad climber
Taos, NM
Jan 9, 2017 - 02:28am PT
"Probably, but my choice would have been Jim Webb - Annapolis grad, war hero, secretary of the Navy under Reagan, senator, lawyer, and novelist. Middle America would have embraced him, I would guess. But in all probability the Cintonistas saw to it that his ship was sunk early on.'


You can blame climate change on her too. :-)

Amazing to me that we do know what Trump said and did, mocked a disabled reporter, grab them by the pussy, got into a penis fight with others on a debate stage, insulted Mexicans, Muslims, gays, loss a billion dollars while touting himself a great business man, asked Russia to hack a political rival and it just makes me wonder who voted to keep his (Trump) ship afloat.

Say what you want about Hillary and the people who voted for her but what type of person voted for a man like this?


dirtbag

climber
Jan 9, 2017 - 06:34am PT
Presidents don't lash out at citizens criticizing them:


In addition, Trump referred to her as “one of the most over-rated actresses in Hollywood” and “a Hillary flunky who lost big.”

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/arts-and-entertainment/wp/2017/01/08/meryl-streep-called-out-donald-trump-at-the-golden-globes-read-her-speech-here/?hpid=hp_hp-top-table-main_no-name%3Ahomepage%2Fstory&utm_term=.51c40a55919f

This guys is a thin skinned embarrassment and a bully. Our president-elect stopped maturing at 13. Wonderful.




fear

Ice climber
hartford, ct
Jan 9, 2017 - 06:56am PT
It's deeply seated insecurity moreso than simple immaturity.

Maybe something to do with the small hands and......

Still better than the murderous alternative so far.

EdwardT

Trad climber
Retired
Jan 9, 2017 - 07:04am PT
Eleven days until Trump becomes our new President.
patrick compton

Trad climber
van
Jan 9, 2017 - 07:12am PT
you can't make this $hit up anymore!!!!

http://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/2017/01/09/jenna-jameson-was-no-fan-meryl-streeps-anti-trump-speech.html

couchmaster

climber
Jan 9, 2017 - 08:35am PT


Quoted from Jgill above:
"Probably, but my choice would have been Jim Webb - Annapolis grad, war hero, secretary of the Navy under Reagan, senator, lawyer, and novelist. Middle America would have embraced him, I would guess. But in all probability the Cintonistas saw to it that his ship was sunk early on."

Me too, clearly you and I are in the minority. Big time. I thought a Webb-Paul Presidential race finale would be the best. Conversely, I thought a Clinton/Bush thing would be horrible. I'd go Bernie before Hillary any day of the week as well, he's an honorable man despite some big disagreements I have with some of his ideas. I didn't even give Trump any chance to win at the start. It defied belief. Still does. His attack on Meryl Streep yesterday, what can you even say about that... wait till Dear Leader in N Korea goes off and Trump starts up.

All you folks that were going to go to Canada, might consider actually doing it soon.
Mark Force

Trad climber
Ashland, Oregon
Jan 9, 2017 - 08:40am PT
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