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John M
climber
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Feb 23, 2014 - 02:41pm PT
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the devil is in the details. How would you determine what size farm was a family farm?
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Feb 23, 2014 - 05:27pm PT
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How would you determine what size farm was a family farm?
one of the reasons i always either qualify "family farm" or use other awkward phrases-- small-scale, boutique, whatever -- is that "family farm" is widely used by california agribusiness to describe any farm that isn't a publicly traded corporation. thus boswell's jillion acre cotton empire was regularly described as a "family farm."
"family farm" or small-hold or freehold as it developed in 19th century popular and then legal terminology, was pretty well politically measured in The Homestaed Act: 160 acres. That was, in 19th century terms, the amount of decent ground required for a family of, say, 4-10, to produce a substance or even middle-class income on decent quality farmland in the ohio or upper mississippi river valleys. the key idea is a farm that is owner-occupied and run by family rather than contract labor.
But 160 acres was useless in arid climates-- most places a decent ranch would've needed at least a thousand acres to provide a similar middle-class living. On the other hand, 160 acres was way more acreage than could be managed with irrigation-- irrigation farming is generally way more labor intensive than what farmers were doing back in Indiana. Even in the early 20th century, irrigated 80 acres would've been too large for most family farmers to manage without contract lots of seasonal labor. John Wesley Powell's famous Report on the Arid Lands made that clear back in the 19th century. It also included the logical proposal that political and water districts in the arid West should be drawn along water basin boundaries rather than other random lines. He was all but tarred-and-feathered for it.
When the Newlands Reclamation Act passed, it included a clause that limited subsidized water deliveries to farms of 160 acres or less (already too large). That clause was unpopular with western growers who were already tenanting, leasing and contracting labor, so it was basically never enforced. Eventually agribusiness managed to get the limit increased to 960 acres (a bill signed by Reagan but endorsed by Jerry Brown).
But CVP hasn't even really enforced that limit. Technically, it wouldn't be difficult to impose an 80 acre limit, although you'd have a fair bit of evasion. But politically it's probably impossible.
That;s before we wade into the mess of rights and legal clusters. And the electric grid.
If this really is a mega-drought and we hit rock bottom, at some point, urban users are going to learn that they are paying 5 to 20 times for water what the Resnick's Paramount farms pays. WIth no deliveries scheduled for 2014, the next thing we're going to see, though, is a test of California's status as the principal irrigation ag state that doesn't regulate groundwater mining.
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John M
climber
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Feb 23, 2014 - 05:52pm PT
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thanks KLK. I really appreciate your explanations. If this is a mega drought, things are going to get very interesting. If not a mega drought, then I doubt much will change. We seem to need big pushes to make big changes.
I have a friend from Germany who says they still have small farms there. She says in the smaller villages you know the farmer who produced what you are eating and you can even know which cow you are buying and who raised it and who butchers it. To me that helps build integrity throughout the system. If I lived close, I would totally buy produce from Khanom.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Feb 23, 2014 - 06:29pm PT
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160 seems reasonable to me.
but I'm flexible.
I'll accept 500. Anything to exclude the 100,000 acres.
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Tvash
climber
Seattle
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Feb 23, 2014 - 06:38pm PT
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My sister and her husband run a cattle ranch in SLO. She reports that this is the worst drought the ranch has experienced in the 5 generations the family has been in the business. Their cattle are primarily grass fed - not this season, though. There isn't any grass.
As of the end of Jan, NOAA's data confirmed that this is the worst drought in over a century - ie, the worst on record.
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Topic Author's Reply - Feb 23, 2014 - 06:50pm PT
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Plenty of water here in Ireland (pissing down as usual), much of it wasted on poor infrastructure. And they still fluoridate the water here, just about the only EU country that does. And they are bringing in water meters and Ireland's richest man (though he lives as a tax exile in Malta) will be looking to gobble up water once it is privatized. Just watch, he'll do it to add to his billions.
But I digress.
Many of you have the finger on the pulse better than I do about California and water, though I know some things, having been born and raised in California. And having studied natural resources and hydrology at Columbia College (then CJC in 1974-77).
What I do know is that this thread I started is a new record for me, most of my threads die young, but this one has been flooded with responses. But the rain of information is, well, intoxicating. ;-)
And much of the information on this thread, that one hopes is accurate in one way or another, is both interesting and informative. Like a fresh spring rain.
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Tvash
climber
Seattle
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Feb 23, 2014 - 07:17pm PT
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There has been some discussion about family farms. They are alive and well in some areas - and can be far more efficient than their factory counterparts with regards to inputs v yield.
The Land Stewardship Project is a great example of an organization that fosters the growth of sustainable domestic agriculture in general, and family farming in particular - through local organization (setting up CSAs, fighting the construction of mega dairies, etc), public and farmer education, and lobbying at both the state and federal levels:
http://landstewardshipproject.org/
The variations in quality of life and health conditions for the farmers, quality of the product, and environmental impact between neighboring farms can be stark. I visited a MN dairy farm that changed its practices under this above organization's tutelage - it now makes more profit (much lower vet bills, for starters), has won more awards for this products, and loses 50 times less topsoil per storm event than its neighboring dairies.
Just a data point - but the link provided is a great resource for those who want to know more about family and sustainable farming today.
Ending scheduled federal farm subsidies would really help the growth of sustainable agriculture. The world isn't fair, but that really stacks the deck in the unsustainable direction.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Feb 23, 2014 - 07:35pm PT
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My sister and her husband run a cattle ranch in SLO. She reports that this is the worst drought the ranch has experienced in the 5 generations the family has been in the business. Their cattle are primarily grass fed - not this season, though. There isn't any grass.
As of the end of Jan, NOAA's data confirmed that this is the worst drought in over a century - ie, the worst on record.
prolly the worst since 1580 according to lynn ingram's calcs.
really feel for the small ranchers. if i were king, we'd be giving those folks subsidized water to water pasturage. there's rain coming this week-- hope there's enough seed for it to help. just got back from a short jog around the local bit of ranchland. just freakin grim-- there's like nothing to eat. they're running way fewer head than the textbooks say you can run on that acreage, but they're still digging down to dirt.
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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Feb 24, 2014 - 11:44am PT
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klk, I appreciate your input here. Clearly you are well informed.
One interesting thing I heard in a class long ago is that BigAg farms are the only ones who can afford to install equipment to conserve water. Is that true? I always got the feeling that instructor said some questionable stuff.
That boutique guy says he a dripper, and he's pretty small scale, right? (a little rise and shine jab for ya... just fooling around) Is there a step above drip irrigation in terms of water conservation? Direct watering to each plant's roots, rather than each plant? Specific timing of application?
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Feb 24, 2014 - 11:55am PT
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I've seen underground irrigation for lawns. No spray at all, nothing lost to evaporation. ( and the Water Cops can't tell by looking if you're watering an *even* address on an *odd* day )
Works great, until you get gophers.
Over the years, the citrus grovers here have gone from flooding the groves via a series of open ditches, letting the water run through and then down the street, to a combined drip-spray system.
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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Feb 24, 2014 - 11:58am PT
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fuking gophers (actually voles) destroyed my stream channel. vole stew is on the menu.
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Elcapinyoazz
Social climber
Joshua Tree
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Feb 24, 2014 - 12:29pm PT
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the citrus grovers here have gone from flooding the groves via a series of open ditches, letting the water run through and then down the street, to a combined drip-spray system.
I lived across the street from Redlands East Valley high for some years, pretty close to your neck of the woods. They were flooding, this was less than 4 years ago.
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Cragar
climber
MSLA - MT
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Feb 24, 2014 - 12:40pm PT
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Hey there Pat!
natural resources and hydrology at Columbia College (then CJC in 1974-77)
Did you have Ross Carkeet as an instructor? I took an enviro class from him when I was there(90-92) doing the Fire program and then classes to go to a U. Man, I loved that lil school, bouldering and Manzanita101 between classes was priceless!
Oh, and thanks for the thread, full of great info and one of the reasons I visit this zone!
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Feb 24, 2014 - 01:30pm PT
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ElCapinyoazz writes:
"I lived across the street from Redlands East Valley high for some years, pretty close to your neck of the woods. They were flooding, this was less than 4 years ago."
I see that too. It's not municipal, tap water. It's totally untreated, unfiltered water. Straight out of Big Bear. My guess is someone's flushing their irrigation system when it runs like that.
I remember once clearing the system of dozens of vertebrae bones that were plugging everything. A snake had apparently fell in upstream, and decomposed on his way down.
I've been walking around in the groves since '08, trying to archive the wind machines. And while I see remnants of the old timey concrete flumes, I haven't seen any in working order. I'll bet the switch to plastic hose / plastic emitters was more of a labor saving decision rather than one of water conservation.
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John M
climber
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Feb 24, 2014 - 02:09pm PT
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Badger Pass at the end of Feb..
come on Snow!
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scuffy b
climber
heading slowly NNW
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Feb 24, 2014 - 04:22pm PT
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Chaz, do you know how much water one of your avocado trees requires?
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Roots
Mountain climber
Tustin, CA
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Feb 24, 2014 - 05:31pm PT
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Rain is on the way : )
also,
Chaz, do you know how much water one of your avocado trees requires?
Avocado trees don't like water much.
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bergbryce
Trad climber
South Lake Tahoe, CA
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Feb 24, 2014 - 08:01pm PT
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Big precipitation event on tap for all of California this coming week. Let's hope for some big totals from San Diego to Alturas.
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Yak-Chik
Trad climber
Phoenix
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Feb 24, 2014 - 08:09pm PT
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Don't believe the forcasts. The only way to be sure it
will rain in LA is to wash and wax your ferrari and no one is allowed to do that with the drought and all.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Feb 25, 2014 - 01:34pm PT
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khanom,
Thanks for your thoughts. I was taken by your mentioning mulch. It strikes me that the use of organic mulches is much underutilized.
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