Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 11:06am PT
|
I have no idea what actually happened or not. I'd like to hear from the climber(s) in question. But they either are not talking, or they aren't aware of this thread.
I've therefore started emailing each of Kinder's sponsors this message:
Hello, I live and climb in California. In the last few days I've become aware of an issue/question involving a climber I think you sponsor: Joe Kinder. The controversy is playing out on the discussion forum of a very popular web site called "Supertopo." Here's a link to the discussion:
http://www.supertopo.com/climbers-forum/2249896/Joe-Kinder-Ethan-Pringle-tree-incident
I have no idea if what is claimed to have occurred actually happened or not. If what is claimed is true, namely that your sponsored climber cut down a tree to facilitate a photo shoot, then maybe you should consider having a little talk with him about his conduct and his relationship with your company.
But who knows whether it is true or not? Perhaps you could take a more critical step, and ask your sponsored climber to respond publicly about what happened (or didn't happen) so that rumors and innuendo can be replaced by fact.
I respect and patronize your company. I hope and expect that you consider your own image when you're considering which climbers to sponsor and not.
Yours Sincerely,
Brad Young, Twain Harte California
It seems like if these two climbers are aware of what's being said, and aware of this thread, that they could shed some light here very quickly.
|
|
klk
Trad climber
cali
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 11:06am PT
|
that picture looks pretty bad. if that is actually un-retouched, and the p/k team did the cutting, that's pretty bad. not crime of the century, indeed, but not going to help with relations with land managers and other stakeholders.
it's not like the jillionth yellow pine in some over-populated generic chunk of conifers.
|
|
Deekaid
climber
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 11:10am PT
|
They will now forever be Joe Kindling and Ethan Pringletree
|
|
Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 11:20am PT
|
I've repeatedly emailed both parties directly. They are very aware of the thread. The alleged accomplice denies involvement. Alleged chopper unresponsive. I suspect in 'taking the fifth' mode.
|
|
Kalimon
Social climber
Ridgway, CO
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 11:27am PT
|
Oh and, eat a choad fluffer.
Nice comeback . . . haven't heard that c-word since jr. high.
|
|
mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 11:42am PT
|
I'd like to hear from him/them. If what appears to be true is true, I'd like to hear it directly. If it isn't, I'd take their word for it.
If he/they did this, I will have lost a lot of respect for them.
But on the other hand if they come forward with the truth, and maybe some recognition that they made a mistake (if it is true), then most of that respect would be restored.
|
|
mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 11:57am PT
|
And then the actual cop posts up at the end.
hahahaaa... like an "actual cop" would/could hike up there! hahahaaaaa
I was serious about a natural resource conservation/ecology/outdoor ethics class for sponsored climbers. It could help avoid this kind of sh#t before it happens, would look good to land managers, and could help the sponsoring companies avoid dealing with this negative image.
Plant identification
Sensitive community identification
Erosion potential
Soil impacts
Plus cool stuff like geomorphology and geology
I think it would be pretty easy to get a handful of grad students at major universities with good natural resource departments (CSU, NAU, UCD, SUNY ESF, etc etc) to throw something together addressing some of the major concerns in local areas. They could even have Rong teach tree ID... if anyone ever wanted to climb in Woodrows.
(that tree ain't 1K yrs old, but several hundreds for sure)
|
|
j-tree
Big Wall climber
Classroom to crag to summer camp
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 11:57am PT
|
Fair direction to go with things imo Brad.
|
|
Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 12:46pm PT
|
from FB
Joe Kinder is one of the most influential rock climbers in America today. Whether reaching out to people through his popular blog, or meeting climbers in person at crags Joe embodies his ALWAYS PSYCHED motto.
Hey Joe, Psyched about reaching out on your blog and using your position as 'one of the most influential climbers in America today' to comment on these allegations?
|
|
basecamper
Mountain climber
South Lake Tahoe
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 01:25pm PT
|
In my experience with Western Juniper, you can count the annular rings on the stumps. These rings are so close together they are invisible. It is likely these was a very old tree. People love old trees.
Somebody knows what happened. Rather than keep this under wraps, let's talk about how to represent climbing in the best light, as good stewards of the resources we use. I will keep your information confidential.
Click on my name "basecamper" and a button appears "email basecamper" then I'll give you my official contact info.
USFS Law Enforcement Officer
LTBMU
35 College Way
South Lake Tahoe, CA
|
|
karodrinker
Trad climber
San Jose, CA
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 01:28pm PT
|
that photo explains it. those roots were cutting in to their route. like a tree too close to a pool, it just has to go. (sarcasm)
|
|
Michelle
Social climber
1187 Hunterwasser
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 01:29pm PT
|
good one Brad!
|
|
Michelle
Social climber
1187 Hunterwasser
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 01:49pm PT
|
Hey, good job Russ!
|
|
PSP also PP
Trad climber
Berkeley
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 02:17pm PT
|
Someone has to come clean especially if one of them is not guilty.
|
|
crunch
Social climber
CO
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 02:34pm PT
|
Interesting.
basecamper has posted two photos. They are two entirely different stumps.
|
|
mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 02:34pm PT
|
I still don't believe basecamper is LEO. Why would they hike up there, place a draw and cam next to the stump and take a pic, then stack a rope next to the stump and take another pic? And why is that rope all chopped to bits? And why are the stumps different? The one with the rope seems to fit the tree better. Where there multiple trees cut?
I sure as hell hope this crag doesn't get shut down...
|
|
Deekaid
climber
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 03:05pm PT
|
the more this unfolds or fails to unfold the weirder this gets
|
|
i'm gumby dammit
Sport climber
da ow
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 03:26pm PT
|
As soon as i saw the rock behind the downed tree in basecamper's first pic i recognized the place. i was up there about a month ago. here is the tree still standing.
|
|
mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 03:30pm PT
|
It is a beautiful crag... one that "is not in Tahoe... I repeat, is NOT in Tahoe..."
got it?
|
|
HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2013 - 03:38pm PT
|
Brad
Well done.
It's almost certain that sponsored climbers' contracts contain "good citizenship" clauses.
Brad's direct message to the sponsors should bring some clarity. Unless of course the sponsors choose to quietly cover it up to protect their own names.
I've no doubt the USFS guy (basecamp) is real. LEOs seldom put their names in public correspondence. I look forward to his count of the tree rings.
the cutters were rookies, as that stump is crapola. arrogant poseurs and idiots are the words that come to my mind.
Almost as irresponsible as the wahoo "scout leaders" in Goblin Valley.
At least another tree might grow to the same size nearby in the next millennium or so. I suppose a lot depends on how Junipers will respond to global warming. That Goblin rock ain't growing back.....ever. A silent testimony to human stupidity.
And WTF were the tree cutting perps thinking? Whomever they were. Are they totally ignorant of climbing ethics in the US? A callous disrespect for our natural environment? Or are they above that sort of thing? Forward thinking Engineers of some sort of Climbing New World Order?
"we're demi-gods and we can screw around with the crags as if they are gym walls"?
At least they won't be forgotten soon. "Hey there go Dork and Twit. They're the retards who cut down that Juniper at Whatsit crag."
(end of rant.....at least for today)
Great pic gumby.
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!