Lance Armstrong accepts lifetime ban, loss of Tour de France

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Sparky

Trad climber

vagabond movin on

Aug 25, 2012 - 06:26pm PT

The best explanation of the whole doping mess I have seen.

http://nyvelocity.com/content/interviews/2009/michael-ashenden

A pretty good explanation of how they avoid detection.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/biol...ndis-seriously

Argon

climber

North Bay, CA

Aug 25, 2012 - 07:39pm PT

Agree with rottenjohnny - and after USADA is finished with Eddie Mercxk and Greg Lemond, maybe they can go after the Steeler offensive line from the 1970's. Rumor has it that Mike Webster, Jon Kolb and some of the boys liked to dabble in anabolics. And rumor is all that USADA seems to need. They can head down to Heinz Field and confiscate those Lombardi trophies and then they can get Chuck Noll kicked out of the hall of fame. And then maybe they can try to clean up baseball's "greenies" era and strip Cincinnati's Big Red Machine and other teams of their world series titles.

D.Eubanks

climber

Aug 25, 2012 - 08:02pm PT

Seems like all of the USADA need to find something to justify their jobs... losers.

Chaz

Trad climber

greater Boss Angeles area

Aug 25, 2012 - 08:23pm PT

This is why actual crimes have statutes of limitation attached to them. ( except for murder and maybe child molestation ) It's to keep prosecuting bodies from holding un-proven accusations against someone for several years without ever having to make their case..

At some point - long ago, in my opinion - the sh#t-or-get-off-the-pot principle applied here.

TGT

Social climber

So Cal

Aug 25, 2012 - 09:13pm PT

Did anyone bother to read the Federal judge's ruling?

he basically said that while there was no Federal jurisdiction, Armstrong was facing a kangaroo court with no chance for due process.

tradmanclimbs

Ice climber

Pomfert VT

Aug 25, 2012 - 09:27pm PT

There is no such thing as clean pro rider so why even bother....

WBraun

climber

Aug 25, 2012 - 09:42pm PT

They never bathe?

zBrown

Ice climber

chingadero de chula vista

Aug 25, 2012 - 10:04pm PT

^Why would they do that? Also, is drinking one's own bath water considered good, bad, ugly, a form of doping, an enlightening experience ...

Now I know there are cultures in the world wherein one's own urine is consumed and as I recall, it is a means of getting high and they are not known to participate in bicycling.

Lastly,
Isn't the USADA the same group that approves all the tainted meat for sale up in the central valley? I'd like to see the drug profile and some o' them cows.

monolith

climber

albany,ca

Aug 25, 2012 - 10:10pm PT

hehe, USDA = US Department of Agriculture, although they might as well be the dairy association considering how much subsidies dairy gets.

zBrown

Ice climber

chingadero de chula vista

Aug 25, 2012 - 10:14pm PT

USADA, USDA (type I and type II) and throw in the ADA (Americans for Democratic Action) and FPCC*

I'd advocate combining all these; agriculture, diary, anti-doping, political provacateurs into a super agency and put them in charge of patents and telecommunications.

Someone has got to bring Apple under control.

I do wonder who broke into Steve Jobs house recently. I hope it wasnt' Daniel Ellsburg or that guy who debated Tim Leary.

*for the un- or mis- informed - Fair Play for Cuba Committee

Among its twenty-nine early notable supporters were William Appleman Williams, Norman Mailer, Truman Capote, James Baldwin, Jean-Paul Sartre, Allen Ginsberg and Lawrence Ferlinghetti, as well as Latin Americans Waldo Frank and Carleton Beals

WBraun

climber

Aug 25, 2012 - 10:22pm PT

Well ......

According to the conclusion drawn from this thread and it's inhabitants.

Lance Armstrong needs to bathe .... !!!!!!!

beef supreme

climber

the west

Aug 25, 2012 - 10:24pm PT

regardless of what side of the issue you're on- gotta admit- sure is a whole lotta bullsh!t about seeing who can ride a bike the fastest. pretty simple idea- gone to hell.

zBrown

Ice climber

chingadero de chula vista

Aug 25, 2012 - 11:36pm PT

^^Wade in the Water children.

zBrown

Ice climber

chingadero de chula vista

Aug 25, 2012 - 11:54pm PT

Armstrong refused arbitration, nothing else.

USADA can prevent him from competing professionally on U.S. turf.

Only the UCI can nullify his tour victories.

Only the UCI can nullify his tour victories. It won’t because it would lead to the nullification of all race results in which competitors could be suspected based on testimony of others, not to mention riders who actually tested positive at some time during their careers. That would include Merckx, Riis, Ullrich, Zabel, David Millar, Valverde and Pereiro, who ended up in first place at the tour after Floyd Landis’ positive test in 2006. The list is long and the motivation of those who have an ax to grind against someone is potentially endless. It would set a precedent for unsubstantiated accusations to change legitimate race results on a grand scale.

Srbphoto

climber

Kennewick wa

Aug 26, 2012 - 12:51am PT

From cyclingnews...

(if everyone knew he was being informed, why are we just hearing about it now. Also, are there some Sky accusations in the paragraph I highlighted?)

American said to have been given time “to cover his tracks”

Lance Armstrong was “warned before all planned doping controls,” an adviser to the French anti-doping agency AFLD has said. Michel Rieu, scientific adviser to AFLD, said this was only one of the methods the American used to escape detection of his doping.

"The inspectors encountered many difficulties in making unannounced checks. Armstrong was always informed in advance, so he still had twenty minutes to cover his tracks. He could thin his blood or replace his urine. He used the EPO only in small quantities, so it was no longer there to detect. We were powerless against this way of working,” Rieu told the Le Monde newspaper.

He also claimed that Armstrong used a large network to help him with his doping, and his avoidance of positive doping controls. "Armstrong let himself be surrounded by many physiologists. Also in the logistics field, everything was possible. The rumor was that his private jet was flying blood in from the United States.”

Armstrong was on Friday given a lifetime ban by the USADA, with all his results since August 1998, disqualified, including his seven Tour de France victories. He had chosen not to challenge doping charges which the American agency had brought against him.

French attorney Thibault de Montbrial, who defended the paper in a suit filed by Armstrong against LA Confidential authors David Walsh and Pierre Ballester, thinks the cumulative pressure of authors such as these and the SCA Promotions lawsuit that followed contributed to the downfall of Armstrong.

He also believes riders are still showing suspicious signs.

"Work together with Antoine Vayer [LeMond columnist], the performance specialist, helped show the implausibility of the power generated in watts on the climbs. Moreover, it is interesting to note that the UCI has banned the publication of such real-time statistics in 2012. And we can understand why when you see that the power production by [Bradley] Wiggins and [Chris] Froome (first and second of the Tour) is comparable to the turbulent times of the late 1990s and early 2000s."Follow Cyclingnews on Twitter for the very latest coverage of events taking place in the cycling world - twitter.com/cyclingnewsfeed

knudeNoggin

climber

Falls Church, VA

Aug 26, 2012 - 02:00am PT

Trafficking, Administration to others

It seems the judicial inquisition would have nailed him here if there was evidence.

Did anybody watch these races on TV, wasn't that Armstrong peddling his ass off there,

(-: quite the ironic misspelling on that one !

Reading a Wikipedia article on the TdF, one gets the idea that *doping* has been
a long-standing practice, from amphetamines & painkillers to modern stuff.

Reading Wiki's blurb on Greg Lemond, one gets the idea that Greg greatly
objected to this doping. And for lamenting Lance's early association with
Dr.Ferrari (who wasn't known as Better Housekeeping's Top Doc, but for less
noble ventures), Greg was threatened by Lance into apology and so on. And
that's rather early in LA's career. One might wonder : why didn't Lance just
talk to Greg and explain the innocent nature of Dr.F's association and all?
--unless it wasn't, and so on . ... all speculative, but some things fit,
and some don't (such as Landis's response to Lemond's urging "come clean"
of "what good would that do?" --not what an innocent person would say!).

There seems to be some considerable *smoke* (even if not showing the
*flame* of proof) of Lance running roughshod over those who got in his
way; I'm not all so forgiving of that even if part of his way was towards
helping others w/a foundation.
.
.
.
And wheels yet churn in this battle of USADA & UCI & ... , so we can await
what becomes in the next round.

As for excitement of TdF? Geeesh, why NOT being MORExciting with tough,
enforced, FOLLOWED prohibitions against doping? How exciting is it to see
Day-N of the favored rider taking his XX-minute lead with assurance over
hill & dale and with projected slight gains, maybe loss, from some upcoming
ITT ? Damn UNexciting; maybe it's okay if you're a fanboy of whoever the
maillot jaune is, but otherwise, no --and it's not the excitement of a race,
just the eagerness of confirming a crown. Who needs that?

Of course, in the USA, if the TdF lacks a USA leader/contender,
or lots of wrecks & injuries (blood!),
or controversy (doping),
there's no press value to it. Just pop up another pic of Anna Kournikova[?] (who
never won anything), and report the latest speeding/parking/bad-hair-or-dress
violations of a local-team benchwarmer. THAT's the 4th Estate!

*kN*

micronut

Trad climber

Aug 26, 2012 - 02:41am PT

I don't like cheaters. In any sport.

And I don't like habitual liars. In life.

If there ends up proof that he cheated. Its a big deal, and it should be. And if he's any kind of a real man, he'll admit to cheating and deal with the consequences. If not, not only is he a cheater, but a liar.

But a man should be innocent until proven guilty. Not sure exactly where this puts Lance, though his riding was some of the best that's ever been done. Shame on him if he's a cheater, or a liar, or both. We may never know the full truth, but I'd like to take a man at his word. Sad its hard to do these days in sports, politics, etc....

Da_Dweeb

climber

Aug 26, 2012 - 05:04am PT

You guys think what the USADA did to Lance Armstrong was terrible? Consider what they did to Neil Armstrong.

Revoking his title as "First Man on the Moon" just because he's not alive to prove he wasn't doping?

Shameful.