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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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The guy's a nut. Even his own party wanted him out.
Only fellow thugs and BHO support him.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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All dictators grab power (especially in SA) by saying they're for the little man. Lenin did too.
Dude, it was a power-grab!
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Pappy
Ice climber
Warren, VT
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Dipshit wrote:
"As I recall, you're the genius who a few years ago defended the South's decision to secede in 1861. Yeah, I'll bet you have the "incontrovertible" data for your position.
And BTW, you should also write a letter to the National Academy of Sciences. I'm sure you have some profound things to inform them about with respect to global warming."
I had no clue what you were talking about and searched back through the threads. Apparently I was pretty active here in 1/05, but if you actually read the f*#kin' threads and comprehended then you would know that my bitch with the Civil War was with the resulting degradation of the the Federal system established by the Constitution, not a defense of Southern secession. But why am I not surprised that your political preconceptions would get in the way. What I find really fascinating (and more than a little creepy) is that you would remember the exchange--however poorly--four plus years later.
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dirtbag
climber
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I tend to remember kooky posts written by oddballs.
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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I agree with most of the original Pappy post until we get to the Florida election, which was about more than just spoiled ballots and was "conveniently" ruled by Bushes own brother (how central american eh?) Non-felons disqualified and studies have shown that if ALL the ballots were recounted, gore would have won.
Review method-Review of all ballots statewide (never undertaken)
• Standard as set by each county canvassing board during their survey Gore by 171
• Fully punched chad and limited marks on optical ballots Gore by 115
• Any dimples or optical mark Gore by 107
• One corner of chad detached or optical mark Gore by 60
Review of limited sets of ballots (initiated but not completed)
• Gore request for recounts of all ballots in Broward, Miami-Dade, Palm Beach, and Volusia counties Bush by 225
• Florida Supreme Court of all undervotes statewide Bush by 430
from
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida_election_recount
But no matter, it's not a dem or gop thing. Look at the Franken/Coleman recount issues if you want to flip the story around. Everybody tries to win!
Peace
Karl
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Largo
Sport climber
Venice, Ca
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Gotta go to Venezuela by way of Panama on Saturday. Maybe I'll have something to write about.
JL
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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Here's a non-editorial for Jingy...
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090701/ap_on_re_la_am_ca/lt_honduras_coup
from the link;
One of several clauses that cannot be legally altered in the Honduran constitution limits presidents to a single, 4-year term. Congress claims Zelaya, whose term ends in January, modified the ballot question at the last minute to help him eventually try to seek re-election. Chavez has used referendums in Venezuela to win the right to run repeatedly.
I wonder what some of you would think if Bush pulled that.
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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When the alternative is a dictatorship, maybe it's a good thing it wasn't done by the book.
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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We'll see what happens down the road.
It seems El Presidente Nuevo is of the same party as Presidente Viejo.
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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My impression is that this is a bit like Andrew Jackson's famous remark: "The Supreme Court has made its ruling. Now let them enforce it." If a president chooses to ignore a court order, how do you enforce it when the president also commands the armed forces? Fortunately, it never came down to that for Jackson. If there was a good thing about Nixon's Watergate conduct, it's that he respected the impeachment process enough to acquiesce to its ultimate outcome. My understanding is that the Honduran situation is essentially what would have happened if he didn't.
John
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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^^^WTF?^^^
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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I don't know from Honduran politics, but I know how I would feel if Bush had decided he didn't want to clear out back in January.
If Bush, as Commander-in-Chief of the military, decided we wouldn't be changing Presidents (C-i-C's) during the war, I'd be OK with going around the chain-of-command to eject his ass.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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The rule of law is to step down and obey the rules. What if the Supreme Court and Congress said he was breaking the law? Who then enforces the law?
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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WTF are you talking about?
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Reilly
Mountain climber
Monrovia, CA
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Since I doubt anybody here, or in the White House, has read the Honduran Constitution aren't we just blowing a lot of hot air? Furthermore, since no outside force was involved, other than Hugo Chavez trying to keep his boy in there, it's really nobody's business is it?
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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Reilly, yeah, for the most part.
The problem is that Chavez is threatening an invasion and is also convincing his other pals in the region to shut off trade to Honduras.
This is why I think our State Dept should be more supportive.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
Monrovia, CA
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Chavez doesn't have the balls or the wherewithall to invade Aruba let alone Honduras. As for him organizing a trade embargo, please! Who is going to respect that?
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ontheedgeandscaredtodeath
Trad climber
San Francisco, Ca
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Honduras does not have much oil, climbing or surf. Who cares who over throws who?
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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DMT,
I think all this thread shows is the differences in our news sources. Those I most respect say that the Honduran legislature and supreme court both said he acted illegally, and ordered his removal. The MSM says it's a coup d'etat, because the military is removing a democratically-elected president. If that is what makes for a coup, then so be it, but to my mind that definition is too broad. Nixon's resignation also removed a democratically-elected president, but it was no coup in my book.
John
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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From what I understand the Honduran supreme court issued an arrest warrant for Zelaya.
End of legality argument.
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