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Ouch!
climber
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Jun 30, 2005 - 11:38pm PT
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Bear #46 is an NPS success story. He was originally from Montana where he raided haulbags at will until an unfortunate incident gave him hemorrhoids. A famished climber rapped off a
wall amid dreams of food and drink. he jumped for his bag, the bag wasn't there..and he stuck 6 inches in number 46 bear. Ol' #46 lit out for California, where he could get free welfare and medical for his condition and he didn't even need to speak the language. At first, the rangers thought he was just another hairy dirtbag scrounging around Camp4. They were about to kick him out when he applied for permanent residence as a bear. The rangers signed him on and now they send him out on missions to test how well climbers take steps to protect bears from the corrupting influence of haulbags.
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Khun Duen Baad
climber
Retirement
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Lois, nobody wants to answer your questions because they are kind of broad and climbers aren't real patient with normal people. I'll try, since you ask.
First of all there are many different kinds of climbing such as:
Bouldering: Just like it says these are the people you see climbing around on small boulders but doing generally very hard moves when they're not sitting around on those mattresses they carry on their backs. A bouldering route or "problem" can be as little as a few moves but I'm sure you can imagine it's not about distance and one show-stopper move is all it takes.
Sport climbing: The pansy-ass event of them all. Hardly worth mentioning as it doesn't really factor into the game. These are the people with the noisy gas-powered Ryobi hammer drills and the one who leave trash at the base, chalk all over the pretty rocks, and are generally undesirable characters with little respect for anything. You may have seen the shiny offensive bolts that they spray all over the cliff in a strange attempt to take any of the thrill, danger, or challenge that the rock naturally presents out of it. But their friends still think they are bad ass. Great crag fashion, though. It is basically climbing on a blank face with small edges and features and no natural protection, being that the bolts permanently damage the rock. If you still knwo anybody in the government that is in wilderness policy you should mention to them a few names like Rifle, Jailhouse, Logan Canyon, American Fork. I'd appreciate it.
Traditional climbing: These are the dirty apes, ogres, and oafs that you see in places like Yosemite and the desert southwest. Trad climbing utilizes natural gear that can be cleanly placed and removed leaving no evidence of your passage. Such, trad climbs tend to be cracks, dykes, and other obvious natural features that you can stick hands, fingers, and protection into. For these reasons it is a much more exclusive bunch of fvckballs that undertake the activity.
Big wall or Aid climbing: Bouldering uses no rope while trad and sport climbing use a rope in the event that climbing with the hands and feet fails. Climbing as such with the rope only as a saftey net is called "free" climbing (free climbing without a rope is free soloing). Aid climbing is when the natural features are far too small to free climb and thus a piece of gear is placed into the rock above your head, then you clip a fabric ladder in, climb up as high as you can, then repeat the process. Because the gear is so small, sometimes the size of a postage small, it can often only take body weight. Several body weight placements in a row means that you are going to fall farther if the one fails, or "timebombs" that you are on. The rating scale reflects roughly how far you are going to fall, and by extension, how mangles you are likely to get. Although this rarely happens for some odd reason, some people have sailed big though. Climbing El Cap is generally aid climbing, a route that takes most people over 2 days is called a bigwall, basically. When you solo aid climb you take the belay system (I'm not explaining this one if you don't know) and turn it upside down so that you can belay yourself as you go up. You can think of it as rappeling upwards like a high rise crane, kind of. when you get to the top you have left behind 200 feet of gear that normally your partner would clean (clibing the rope with mechanical ascenders) while you hauled up the bags (water, food, portaledge, usu. about 200 pounds-not a big deal if you are hanging on a cliff with gravity on your side) via the second rope you trailed for this purpose. When climbing alone however, you must rappel back down yourself and clean the pitch before you haul it. Basically you climb each pitch 3 times. most people spend about 5 days on el cap, but the real partiers stick it for 2 weeks. It is a party-driven activity. A lot of alcoholics and utter bizarreness. Imagine if you drove waaaay out in the desert to some remote spire of rock and out there was a bald guy, in a fur trappers leather jacket, eagle feathers for earings and he was sitting in the trunk of his Mercedes cleaning his guns and eating a can of Beefaroni. These are the characters you are working with. I was one of them. you can see me posts in the Cult of Suicidal thread. Soloing itself is not uncommon (for chicks either), it entirely depends on the climb and sometimes the condidtions. For instance it is hard to say you soloed Mt. Everest in 2005 when there are thousands of people leaving ropes and boot tracks up the mountain and you have to avoid having tea with the hundreds of other people in the same camps every night. Soloing is like any other climb, if you want to go bigger and scarier you do.
Ice climbing is self explanitory I hope
Mountianeering is the Everest/K2/Mt. Rainier kind of stuff.
Ratings
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grade_(climbing);
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WBraun
climber
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Khun Duen
What happened to you to have so much hate in your heart? Your underlining tone has become so negative towards life? In one way that is very good but I hope you do not become attached to your body as the source of your frustration and suffering.
Pain and suffering is good for seeking liberation from our perils ……… the "real climb" is now starting for you?
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Hi Lois
I'll try to cover quickly what Singha Missed.
1. I have been reading all the comments about “Solo Dave.” Does this mean that a man is (or has) literally scaled the entire mountain alone - literally as in someone has carried all that food, water, tent, climbing gear, etc on his back. How can one person possibly carry enough calories and water to do something that strenuous. It seems too incredible to be true. I could see a team doing it but one person?
Yes he climbed El Cap by himself. It's a little more than twice the effort of doing it with a partner, not to mention the psychological challenge. He hauled the gear with a pully in a bag, not on his back. One person can strenuously haul a 160 pound bag and if he needs to be up a long time, he can haul another 160 pound bag with a second haul rope if he chooses.
2. If #1 really is correct, how rare is this event? Is this something which occurs several times a season? Every few years? Almost never? How long does it typically take or an individual or a team to summit? Is it more common for teams of men
(versus an individual) to go up to the summit? Do (or have) women ever done it?
During the main wall season, there is frequently one or two folks soloing EL Cap. Women have done it. It has been done in a day but a week is more common and a few have taken two weeks.
3. If #1 is possible, does such usually represent a life-time achievement event or are such persons typically motivated to go on e.g. Whitney, McKinley (Oh, excuse me - to be more politically correct “Denali”) or Everest?
Everybody is different. Some folks do it repeatedly but never get into mountaineering. Some do it once and that's all.
Hope this helps
Peace
Karl
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Ouch!
climber
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"Pain and suffering is good for seeking liberation from our perils"
Also liberation from our pleasures...if it hurts.
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Khun Duen Baad
climber
Retirement
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Werner,
I'll mail you privately. I'm don't explain myself to anybody I don't respect, so the public is out on that one.
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WBraun
climber
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Khun Duen
I read your email and your definately on a good page.
I was beginning to worry that we’ve all become unconscious. Thanks for your reply. Keep shooting those straight arrows to the target.
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cybele
Ice climber
finally, west of the Mississippi
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Jul 11, 2005 - 01:33pm PT
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Hi LEB and others on the thread...
I want to register a gentle protest at the statements against grizzlies posted earlier in the thread. I am sure that people will have examples to contradict what I am about to say, but from travels in Alberta, BC, and Alaska I learned from varied sources to be more wary of the northern black bears than the griz. All the way up the Alaska Highway and in Southeast Alaska, rangers and civilians said that black bears were the ones known to have stalked and murdered humans (and they had examples), whereas grizzlies want more just to be left alone and are very dangerous specifically when startled or bothered. "Insane bear" episodes were inevitably blacks. Black bears become habituated and prowl lower elevation campsites and human areas, whereas the grizzlies prefer to stay up higher, avoiding human contact. Grizzlies, if you play dead when confronted, will in the fascinating words of an old BC resident, "maul you a little, take a sh#t right on you, cover you with leaves, and then leave." Black bears, however, just might kill you and eat you. Hence, the bear books recommend fighting back as a last resort with blacks (9 of 10 bear charges are false charges) and playing dead only with the griz. Then I come to the US west and hear how horrible the grizzly is. From seeing the very different attitudes of people and bear behavior in states like Colorado and California, I realize black bears in Canada and north are much less habituated to humans, hence wilder, more dangerous, and much less "cute."
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Brian in SLC
Social climber
Salt Lake City, UT
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Jul 11, 2005 - 06:28pm PT
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All the way up the Alaska Highway and in Southeast Alaska, rangers and civilians said that black bears were the ones known to have stalked and murdered humans (and they had examples), whereas grizzlies want more just to be left alone and are very dangerous specifically when startled or bothered. "Insane bear" episodes were inevitably blacks. Black bears become habituated and prowl lower elevation campsites and human areas, whereas the grizzlies prefer to stay up higher, avoiding human contact.
I've never heard that. And, I'll bet there's data that doesn't support this conclusion. Not that I have it...but...have spent a fair amount of time in bear country...(AK, Canada, Montana, etc).
Grizz, AK brown bears, and kodiaks (same same?) can get just as habituated and "insane", IMO, as black bears (remember jellystone in the 60's?). Only, they're much more dangerous an animal. See average and record sizes, for instance.
Grizzlies, if you play dead when confronted, will in the fascinating words of an old BC resident, "maul you a little, take a sh#t right on you, cover you with leaves, and then leave."
Not at night. Then they eat you.
Plus, mauling you a little may be enough.
Black bears, however, just might kill you and eat you. Hence, the bear books recommend fighting back as a last resort with blacks (9 of 10 bear charges are false charges) and playing dead only with the griz.
I think you fight back at night for any bear attack (not that folks will be able to tell which is what, anyhow). And, probably fight back with regard to black bears because they just don't have the disposition to fight a critter near (or bigger) their size. I've heard tell, with black bears, fighting back is the first resort. With grizzlies, especially a daylight surprise, play dead. At night, you're food.
Anyhoo, interesting...
Brian in SLC
(whose been charged at close range by a coastal AK brown bear)
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Edge
Trad climber
New Durham, NH
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Jul 12, 2005 - 08:50am PT
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Last week I saw the headline about "Couple Killed by Bear in Alaska." Well, my wife and son were in ANWR at the time, floating the Hulahula River.
I clicked the link to reassure myself that it was probably in some other distant part of the state; imagine my dread when the article began by saying that it happened on the Hulahula! It wasn't until the second paragraph that I was somewhat relieved to see that it was a couple in their late 50s/early 60s, which my wife and son decidedly are not. They were, however, only about 10 miles up river at the time.
Another boat passing the couple's campsite saw the bear mauling the tent, and when they tried to pull over to investigate, the grizzly charged them, forcing them to pull back into the river and radio authorities. When the local rescuers arrived, they located the bear when it charged them, and they shot it dead.
Of the couple, the husband was eaten on the spot, and the wife, who had been mauled to death, was dragged off and buried for a future meal. Fortunately for my wife's group, they did not see a bear the entire time until their departure from a sandbar on the arctic ocean. As their 5 seater plane was banking south, they saw a polar bear about 100 yards away, scavenging amid a pile of whale bones.
You don't even want to run into one of those fu%%ers!
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Nor Cal
Trad climber
San Mateo
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Jul 12, 2005 - 12:07pm PT
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Minerals, I was having problems with the picture appearing. I put the photo on my yahoo acct. but I think the session was timing out. I'll repost the large photo here and see what happens. Perhaps since I put the photo in my breif case not the photo album is the reasone I was having problems. I think my session is still timing out and the photo is not always appering.
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Nor Cal
Trad climber
San Mateo
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Jul 12, 2005 - 01:11pm PT
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LEB,
Do you want me to email you the original photos? the files are about 2.5 MB.
All the bears that are caught are tagged, in Yosemite. Yes I did take that photo, I've also get a few color photos of Bear 46.
They have bear patroll rangers that handle all bear issues.
But now I am not seeing the photo, does anyone else?
-Rob
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Ouch!
climber
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Jul 12, 2005 - 05:01pm PT
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There really is no bear #46. It's Werner in a bear suit. He eats really well during climbing season. By late winter his ribs are showing.
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AndyG
climber
San Diego, CA
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Jul 12, 2005 - 06:25pm PT
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Lois said: "I am not a vegetarian but I wish I were."
I know this isn't really relevant but this statement mystifies me. Why would you wish to be one but not be one? Stop eating meat! Presto, you are a vegetarian.
Once, several years ago I forgot about the 4-pack of guinness and left it in my haulbag at the base of el-cap overnight. We hung all the food about 30 ft up. Forgot the beer. Big mistake. A bear drank my guinness. I was pissed! It made quite a mess of my gear also. And everything smelled like guinness.
Andy
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Bear46
Social climber
Yosemite
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Jul 12, 2005 - 09:56pm PT
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Thanks for the beer Andy. It's been awhile, but I promised myself that if I ever met the guy who left me the Guinness, I'd thank 'em. I get tired of all the C45 and OE the other climbers leave out for me, so obviously when I drank those Guinness' I was like, damn, thats good sh#t.
Your friend for life
B46
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Forest
Trad climber
Tucson, AZ
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Jul 13, 2005 - 02:32pm PT
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Read the first few posts in this thread
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Nor Cal
Trad climber
San Mateo
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Jul 13, 2005 - 03:16pm PT
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Lois,
did you get the three pics I emaild to you?
-Rob
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cybele
Ice climber
finally, west of the Mississippi
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Jul 13, 2005 - 09:35pm PT
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Hi Brian in SLC, LEB, Edge, well, maybe that stuff I heard was wrong. I was just repeating stuff I'd heard that I found interesting, I don't know. One thing that I heard an awful lot was anecdotal eveidence that bears love to harass (or worse) menstruating women, but according to a few bear books on the market several studies, statistical and experimantal (including one gem with captive bears and bloody tampons and dead fish), suggest that is not the case ... No reason to eshew the pleasures of bear coutry during "that time," just practice common sense, the conclusion was.
I'd never heard the night thing. That's interesting. Thanks for your post Brian.
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arete
Trad climber
Estes Park, Colorado
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Jul 14, 2005 - 02:44pm PT
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A couple of fun bear stories to tell at bedtime in the wilderness.....
1)In the fall of '74, I backpacked with some friends up to Little Yo Valley and we camped. We had our food well hung in trees that night (pre-cables timeframe) and since the weather was beautiful, I didn't bother to pitch my tent but decided to camp under the stars. I sacked out with my head abutting a large fallen log and had my old Kelty pack propped up against the log right next to me. In the middle of the night, I suddenly woke up. Then I began to wonder why I couldn't see any stars. In a moment I discovered the reason.... a large bear was standing over me, straddling my head in order to sniff at my pack!! My heart started beating about 50 times faster but I didn't move or make a sound (very lucky I didn't when I first woke up before I knew what was happening). There was no food in my pack, but there must have been some leftover smell -- the bear bit and tore off one of the side pockets, then stepped back over me and walked away.
2)In the summer of '75 I was camping in Couger Rock Campground up in Mt Rainer NP. It was the middle of the day and I was just hanging out and re-packing my pack for an attempt on the summit the next day. This was the same pack in the story above -- a huge old style Kelty Serac and it was entirely loaded with the ten essentials and weighed in at 80+ pounds. I had the pack leaning up against the picknick table. A very large male brown bear (up in Washington most of the ones I have seen are jet black) came waltzing through the campground and I whipped out my little SLR and took some photos and the bear left. About 1/2 hour later he came back and as I grabbed and adjusted my camera for some more picture, he started to approach me. He would take a few steps, look at me, look at my pack, snort and take a few more steps. Then it dawned on me that this bear was being very aggressive and wanted to come grab my pack right from under my nose! I had visions of a ripped open pack, destroyed gear (assuming he didn't just grab in and run and I would never even see it again) and a ruined vacation. When he was still about 25-30 feet away, I jumped up, grabbed my pack and dashed behing a huge Douglas fir (about an 8-10 foot diameter trunk -- they are HUGE up in Washington). Believe me, if the bear had gotten too close I would have let him have it, but I didn't want to give up that pack. The bear came over to the tree and casually walked around it twice while I endeavored to stay on the other side of the trunk. Then he left. I've treed many bears over the years by standing tall, raising my arms (to look large) and yelling at them. Most bears are timid enough that they will run away from such behavior. But this time I was treed by a bear~!
Bears have been aggresive in Yo and other parks for a long time. The bear "graveyard" used to be up near Turtleback Dome when I live in Yo. Don't know if they still bury the bandits there now. Its a shame that they have to die, but having litte Johnny and litte Susie carted off screaming by a bear while dad tries to get a good vacation photo would probably raise a stink in the media. What's an animal lover to do?
Don't feed the humans.
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davidji
Social climber
CA
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Jul 14, 2005 - 03:15pm PT
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"I own several cats now and such has been true of every one fo them which I have ever owned. "
Better than the cat bringing in live animals.
My only cat practiced catch (outdoors) and release (indoors).
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