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MisterE
Trad climber
One Place or Another
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Feb 18, 2009 - 01:25am PT
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Happy people just keep being happy.
Be like the stone in the creek, let the babble flow around you but not through you
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jbar
Social climber
land of the lost
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Feb 18, 2009 - 06:01am PT
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Dude, all phones have a gps chip. After I moved back to the states it pissed me off that cell phones cost so much here and they wanted a contract and you couldn't even use them as a gps when everyone knows they all have a chip installed. Last report I read it cost $5 for the manufacturer to install. You can consider it for your safety. "I've fallen and I can't get up and I don't know where I am". When they wanted to find OJ they tracked him by his cell phone. Now you know cell phones not only give you cancer and make you sterile but can also be hacked. Better break out the tin foil suit and helmet.
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Topic Author's Reply - Feb 18, 2009 - 09:45am PT
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Only God has the right to be Omnipotent; he can handle it and he doesn't abuse that power. He gives us freedom of choice.
"The Man" on the other hand does not have this right. Any time man knows more than he should he immediatley abuses that power for evil and corrupt purposes.
All this technology can be shielded. Governments shouldn't be able to track me and know my every move. I'm a citizen of planet Earth and I have a right to my privacy. I have a right to walk the Earth without being under survelance. Only God has the right to know my thoughts, where I go, and what I do. The law should be written in our hearts.
I will dissent in my own way. I can shield my phone. I can shield my important RFID made ready cards. I can shield the new RFID passports when I get my replacement. I'm sure I won't think of it all, but I can do what I can do.
They have no right to do this. They are breaking the law, and they are shreading our Constitution and Bill of Rights, especially the 4th Admendment and I'm not going to sit idle and let let them do it without a fight. Screw them.
If we can prove the abuse, perhaps there is a massive class action lawsuit everyone can get in on. $ Cha-Ching $
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WBraun
climber
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Feb 18, 2009 - 11:38am PT
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jbar -- "Dude, all phones have a gps chip."
That's not true at all.
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Radish
Trad climber
Seki, California
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Feb 18, 2009 - 01:57pm PT
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Under the last leadership, we were a republic, not a democracy.If you ain't got nothing to worry about it shouldn't be a worry. You'll only just feel a little prick..............
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wbw
climber
'cross the great divide
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Feb 18, 2009 - 02:33pm PT
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If we all "went back" to living off the land, we wouldn't have Supertopo, and other such forums where any whackjob (such as myself) can spew any opinion they want, and get far more attention than they should be given. Just go read some of the inane drivel that goes back and forth on the Mountain Project forum and it is obvious that our shared addiction to technology in general, and the Net in particular is the real source of the problem here.
It's not that I'm unconcerned with what you're saying Klimmer. It's just that I'm so damn tired at the end of the day with the job of raising my kids in what I hope is the right way. Also, I gotta believe that whatever bad things I'm doing are trumped by the badder things others are doing. (This last sentence coincidentally, also describes my attitude about climbing.)
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Topic Author's Reply - Feb 18, 2009 - 03:24pm PT
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Rokjox,
Off doesn't necessarily mean off.
There are active RFID tags and passive RFID tags. Active use a battery, passive use no battery source. Your cell phone could be off with the battery disconnected, and if they placed a passive RFID chip in your cell phone then they can still track you. That RFID chip can be easily associated with only your phone. They are now doing this with passports (shield your passports!) RFID tags can be very minature. Perhaps they can be even microscopic in the near future if they don't have these already. RFID tags can be placed on anything or within anything. All kinds of merchandise we now buy have passive RFID tags in them. All you need is a sensor nearby within 30m or so and you can sense them remotely along with all the data they are made to contain. Sensors can be placed everywhere and they can track all your comings and goings, and you are no the wiser.
You could order a hamburger and unknowingly swallow an RFID microchip and now you are trackable for a day or 2 if someone wanted to do that. How difficult is it to place one on a car permanently? Easy.
The possibilites of this nightmare are endless, and "they" are agressively pushing all of this technology full steam ahead.
The mark of the beast will not be a printed UPC, it will be a RFID imbedded chip. You will not be able to buy or sell without one. Don't tell me that isn't going to happen --- it already is starting to happen! You need to read the wikipedia link I provided on RFID chips upstream. Do you know that our USF&DA has already approved the use of imbedding of RFID chips in humans? How can a book over 2000 years ago get it so right? God only knows, and he is warning us. And you know what? I'm going to listen.
I will personally choose death over that forced evil eternal damnation. They will not do that to me or my family if I can help it. I will fight them to the bitter end. I will sacrifice my life to save the life of my family.
Screw the NWO!
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MisterE
Trad climber
One Place or Another
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Feb 18, 2009 - 03:40pm PT
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Oh, Boy! Religion AND Conspiracy! I'mm gonna go make some popcorn for this show!
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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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Feb 18, 2009 - 03:52pm PT
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I will personally choose death over that forced evil eternal damnation. They will not do that to me or my family if I can help it.
So does that mean you're going to kill your wife and kids, then kill yourself? This is how you save your family?
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WBraun
climber
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Feb 18, 2009 - 04:03pm PT
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A passive RFID chip can only be read within a few inches or at the most a couple of feet depending on the manufacturer from the device.
Do you really know what you're talking about.
You don't seem to know very little about electronics, radio frequency propagation and all it's different applications/properties.
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Topic Author's Reply - Feb 18, 2009 - 04:06pm PT
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Ghost,
Do you know how to read something in context?
"I will personally choose death over that forced evil eternal damnation. They will not do that to me or my family if I can help it. I will fight them to the bitter end. I will sacrifice my life to save the life of my family.
Screw the NWO!"
Should be easy but you blew it:
"I will personally choose death . . ." = doesn't mean anyone else will
"I will sacrifice my life to save the life of my family."
Shouldn't be any confussion here, but apparently you don't read, or read very well.
Don't you dare try to say anything like you said. I love my family. I would never hurt them. You are way off base.
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TradIsGood
Chalkless climber
the Gunks end of the country
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Feb 18, 2009 - 04:16pm PT
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Faraday.
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Topic Author's Reply - Feb 18, 2009 - 04:17pm PT
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WBraun,
You haven't read the articles that Wikipedia links to nor have you looked at the information that the ACLU has released through FOIA. Passive RFID chips now can be read at considerable distance, especially the new generation chips along with the proper sensors.
I'm a licensed HAM (actually studied for months the classic text "Now You're Talking" rather than fake my way through the test like so many do) and I use my radio for paragliding mostly, and I teach physics. Not an expert in RF propagation but I do know a lot about it. But the proof is in the documents that the ACLU has made available through FOIA.
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TradIsGood
Chalkless climber
the Gunks end of the country
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Feb 19, 2009 - 03:33pm PT
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RFID readable at long distances?!
Seriously, how useful would that be? Imagine going through a checkout line and every credit card within 50 feet (or pick a distance, say 3 miles! LOL) was read by the card reader.
Maybe it is time to not only brush up on your E&M, but also on thinking about the problem in terms of what it would mean practically if your assumptions were true.
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Topic Author's Reply - Feb 19, 2009 - 03:58pm PT
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Rokjox,
You said,
"On the phone thing, I was talking about phones, RFID is external, has nothing to do with phones. Turn your phone off and nobody will listen to you over the phone, is all I said."
The article that I gave a link to before says,
http://news.cnet.com/2100-1029_3-6140191.html
"Kaplan's opinion said that the eavesdropping technique "functioned whether the phone was powered on or off." Some handsets can't be fully powered down without removing the battery; for instance, some Nokia models will wake up when turned off if an alarm is set."
Yes, RFID and the cellphone issue are two different things. What I'm saying is the technology can be easily combined, so now you can have a passive RFID chip in phone so no matter what you do with it, turn it off or take the battery out, it can still function as a trackable device as long as there are RFID sensors around. And it sounds to me like they are being networked and placing sensors all over the place. This would make sense since they are putting RFID chips in passports now and they want to track peoples' movement.
You can shield your cell phone with aluminum foil. Just wrap your cell phone tightly in aluminum foil with about 3 wraps and no gaps of any kind. Dial your number from another phone and your cell phone won't ring. I tried it. Objects such as cards, passports, with RFID chips etc, can also be shielded the same way from what I understand. It at least shields them from a distance. It might not if it is right up against the RFID sensor. Several articles I have recently read about RFIDs indicate this. Lots of people out there who don't like any of this, and the more I learn about it I'm one of them.
TIG,
You're mixing up magnetic memory strips with RFIDs. Not the same technology, thankfully. Your mixing apples with oranges.
Don't make me assign you extra homework and to sweep my classroom after school!
lol
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Topic Author's Reply - Feb 19, 2009 - 05:59pm PT
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Remember, it isn't just "the good guys" who have the ability to do this and who are doing these kinds of survelance, as the ACLU has determined and who often do this now unwarranted which is completley illegal and unconstitutional. And yes they are doing this now without FISA approval and without warrants --- shreading the 4th admendment of our Constitution, our Bill of Rights, thanks to GWB signing statements, the Neocons, and their made-up war on Terror.
Isn't it really all about stealing from us our Constitutional freedoms under the guise of protecting us? That is really what this is all about. Our Constitution is disappearing before our eyes. This is sooo classic GOP bate and switch. The NWO. It's coming and it is already here in so many ways.
The danger also lies in the fact that it is "the bad guys" who care nothing about the law or our rights, and who want to steal our money, identity, or worse; those who also now have access to all of this technology, since it is all completely hackable and the technology can be purchased.
We live in a seriously screwed up world.
Maybe I should be a Ludite.
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TradIsGood
Chalkless climber
the Gunks end of the country
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Feb 19, 2009 - 08:04pm PT
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No, I am not mixing up magnetic strips. Some of the newer cards can just be placed near the reader which can read the rfid.
It is kind of funny when you do that and the teller does not know about it.
My work id badge has passive rfid in it. It must be passed by the detector well within a foot of the reader to read.
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maestro8
Trad climber
Sunnyvale, CA
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Feb 19, 2009 - 08:54pm PT
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TradIsGood: Maybe it is time to not only brush up on your E&M, but also on thinking about the problem in terms of what it would mean practically if your assumptions were true.
Great post, TiG...
Practically speaking: there's an entire infrastructure required to conduct surveillance. From procuring and installing equipment, to collecting, storing and reviewing intelligence.
The efforts of many people (and a lot of expensive equipment) are required to collect and sift through the mountains of data generated by a surveillance operation. Where on earth do these people think the resources are coming from to monitor every Tom, Dick and Klimmer in the back woods of Penn-tucky?
Furthermore, how egotistical do you have to be to believe that the NSA is interested in your every move if the most nefarious thing you've done is called GWB a good-for-nothing?
What gives?
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