Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
dickcilley
Social climber
Honolulu
|
|
Please donīt dumb the routes down with more bolts.Theres so many sad sport routes already.If anything,It sounds by the description of Mother Earth,there might be room for a new,Modern,route nearby.
|
|
Largo
Sport climber
Venice, Ca
|
|
I'm not particularly happy about adding bolts to Mother Earth, a route done 30 years ago in EBs (non-sticky rubber). Yet there's no indication this route (and probably Black Primo, or Black Rose, as well) will ever see any traffic with the pro as is. Maybe when the old quarter inchers get shorn up it won't be so bad. By and large the hard climbing on Mother Earth is very well protected, but some of the not-so-hard climbing (5.9 and 10a) has thin pro as I rec all. But perhaps I'm wrong about this. Clint and company wll just have to go up (top down) there an d start top roping and see what seems reasonable and take it from there.
JL
|
|
Largo
Sport climber
Venice, Ca
|
|
Another good one to rebolt would be Black Rose, aka Black Primo. Work down (climb Quicksilver or Freewheelin') from the ledge. Tha route is the shizzzat and I'll bet it hasn't had an ascent in a decade. Too bad.
JL
|
|
Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - Jul 3, 2008 - 04:46pm PT
|
John,
Black Rose (aka Black Primo), was rebolted in the 1990s, at about the same time as Jigsaw.
Apparently, the original name was Black Primo, but this was (mistakenly) thought to be a drug reference, so it was changed to Black Rose for the 1976 and 1982 Meyers guides? The name was changed back to Black Primo in the 1987 and later guides.
|
|
dickcilley
Social climber
Honolulu
|
|
Why dont the young valley hotshots repeat these routes.Maybe these threads will inspire them like they have me.Tommy??? Dean???I know where Iīd be climbing today if I was in the Valley.
|
|
Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
|
|
The Black Primo is the polished diorite on this fabulous route. Insane friction and little visible until you are right on it!
The route crosses the diorite just above my left shoulder in this photo.
|
|
Largo
Sport climber
Venice, Ca
|
|
FYI, Kevin W. placed a bolt on one of the scariest stances I ever saw on a face route, the bolt protecting the crux - and that one might have the steepest crux (a bulge, really) of any of the Middle face lines. I've long since forgotten the moves on many of those old routes but not that one.
JL
|
|
Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
|
|
How about using original stainless SMC hangers for the Mother Earth refit? The restoration concept got lost in the the rock dust and glare when I proposed original equipment for GBG.
|
|
Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - Jul 6, 2008 - 05:02pm PT
|
Steve,
I did use Petzl Coeur hangers on the Space Babble protection bolts, which are similar in size to the SMCs.
Roger is doing almost all the actual replacement on the Middle Cathedral North Face Apron, and he likes using the Fixe hangers with the ASCA stamp. They are a little larger and easier to spot. Middle Earth p2 was mostly (rusty) Leeper hangers, which were at least easy to spot because of their dark color.
|
|
Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
|
|
The SMC's have a solid performance record, match original hardware and were produced in great quantity. No such option for the Leepers is readily available beyond the ones I make but all SMC's would certainly do. No additional effort is required to install period hardware beyond sourcing the hangers.
Just have to change clips.....
|
|
Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - Jul 14, 2008 - 03:35pm PT
|
Mother Earth rebolting update:
On Saturday 7/12, Bob Steed and I went up the Gunsight with 6 of Roger's ropes, and across the North Face Traverse (with epic hauling through a tree). I replaced the first bolt on p11 (which protects free moves to an aid pitch). We then rapped from that bolt down Mother Earth, leaving fixed ropes for Roger starting near the top of p8. (I'll try to post a separate trip report on this soon).
On Sunday, Roger drove to Yosemite, and hiked up to meet us at around noon. He finished replacing the bolts on Mother Earth p2, and also replaced the bolts and anchor on p3. The rest will follow soon, I'm sure, along with the lower pitches of the Smith-Crawford, etc. Roger has replaced over 120 bolts in his first month this summer.
|
|
Largo
Sport climber
Venice, Ca
|
|
|
Jul 14, 2008 - 04:16pm PT
|
Thatīs cool that you guys are going to replace those old coffin nails in Mother Earth. Iīm sort of amazed that you could reverse pitch 8 with that traverse and all. BTW, how did that pitch look? Could you spot the leap? Itīs been so long I canīt really remember much, with all the weed we smoked back in the day.
JL
|
|
Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - Jul 14, 2008 - 06:26pm PT
|
John,
The way we rappelled from the North Face Traverse ledge was to go down 190' from the first bolt on p11. This reached a 2' x 20' flat ledge which is a little bit above the top of p8. We placed a new rappel anchor at the left end of this ledge. Normally I avoid placing a new anchor without permission ahead of time, but our original plan to reach/rappel the Smith-Crawford did not work, and we needed some way to get down and reach out left to cover the traverse. From this rappel anchor, we fixed our highest rope. We then rapped it down and left about 180' to a 6" x 4' stance/ledge with the third bolt on p7, where the rightward traverse on p7 starts. I replaced this bolt, and we fixed the next rope to it, and then easily down below it.
Here is how we did it. I can't exactly recommend this as a rappel route at present, since it uses some single bolt anchors.
I looked briefly for your bolt at the right end of the traverse, but did not see it. After finding the bolt on the left end of the traverse and looking at the topo again, I figured it must have been well to the right of where I had been looking. Roger will probably be able to find it.
|
|
Greg Barnes
climber
|
|
|
Jul 14, 2008 - 07:16pm PT
|
Awesome! Great work everyone. And thanks for keeping Roger busy, he wore us ragged trying to fix lines fast enough for him in Tuolumne!
Steve:
"Clint- those frighteningly thin stainless steel Leeper hanger look alikes were made by Vern Clevenger. Hopefully one or two can make it into Ken's collection as they are pretty unique. Nice work on the bolting. "
My friend Joe and I just pulled one of those off the anchor for Wise Crack a few weeks ago. If Ken needs one I'll get him that one. I know I've seen some before but that anchor is sitting in my truck right now.
As far as using stainless SMCs, we would first want to make sure people are OK with that. Those hangers to have an annoying drawback as far as being able to clip two biners through the hangers (definitely a poor option for belay anchors). The only other problem with them is that they tend to bend easily when placed on overhangs, but that's not an issue here. It may be hard to come up with ones in good shape as well. If people do want those for the hangers on Mother Earth, I sorted through loads of stainless SMC hangers (most of which are 1/4" or 5/16" hole), and most of the 3/8" ones I have are pretty beat-up. Most of my nicer 3/8" hole stainless SMCs are on new routes I did 5-10 years ago. I can switch some out quickly, but a good number are not easily recovered in the summer (Owens, other warm areas). Also, I painted a lot of them tan or grey, which would not be optimal for MC runouts. It'd be nice to find someone with a stash of unused 3/8" hole ss SMCs they were willing to part with.
Anyway, if people really want stainless SMCs on that route, we should make sure Roger uses Petzl hangers since they are about the same thickness as ss SMCs, while the Fixe ones are thicker, making switching the hangers more of a problem.
|
|
LongAgo
Trad climber
|
|
|
Jul 14, 2008 - 08:04pm PT
|
Clint,
Thanks to you and partners for all your good work on Middle Cathedral north face apron. Especially good to hear Black Rose was rebolted, one of my favorites on MC. I loved the shiver of the brooding black rock, strong run outs on shady slabs, holds appearing, then disappearing, with the higher big chest of Middle leaning out over you, as if about to intone, "And just what do you think you are doing, speck of flesh!?"
I found some Yosemite giants talked, some brightly and soothingly, some in deep, deep tones of power. For me, the north face of Middle rumbled ...
Tom Higgins
LongAgo
|
|
Buju
Trad climber
A Sandbar
|
|
|
Jul 15, 2008 - 04:44pm PT
|
Kelley, Bruce, Clint, and Roger...
It was spectacular to have the oppostunity to work with you all that day. unfortunately work has me in the backcountry for the rest of the summer. this fall i would be more than happy to help out some more.
thanks again for the opportunity,
Roger Putnam
|
|
Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - Jul 15, 2008 - 04:56pm PT
|
Roger,
Thanks for the help! The high point on Quicksilver you reached with Jesse and Megan has been enough to keep Roger Brown busy for many weeks! (penduluming far left and right after I extended the high point by one last thankfully easy pitch).
Have fun in the backcountry.
Clint
|
|
Thorgon
Big Wall climber
Idaho Falls, ID
|
|
|
Jul 16, 2008 - 06:02pm PT
|
My hat is off to Roger Brown [with a back brace] and crew for a job well done. The climbing community will forever reap the rewards of your efforts! Thank you!
Thor
|
|
Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
|
|
|
Jul 17, 2008 - 01:23am PT
|
hey Clint, thanks for rebolting Wise Crack! (and all the others too!!)
my notes from 3/03: "not great bolts"
I remember using the crack near those bolts, and the bolts, and hoping my partner wouldn't wip off the 5.10a...
Also, I remember hiking down to the left instead of rapping off the route.
|
|
Roger Brown
climber
Oceano, California
|
|
|
Jul 17, 2008 - 03:18pm PT
|
Clint,
Just got home. There are only 6 more protection bolts left to replace on "Mother Earth" so I guess I blew that one hanger wise:-) I got a question so I will ask it here. From about half way up the 6th pitch there is a line of bolts (at least 1 without a hanger that kinda parallels "Mother Earth" up to where "Smith Crawford" breaks off left. Are these just off route bolts placed by the 1st ascent team as they probed their way upwards? Did the "Smith Crawford" team place these and does thier route actually have its own bolts? Did someone do a direct route from the top of 5 of "Smith Crawford to the top of 7 of "Smith Crawford"? If no one knows the story on them I will just leave them as they are. Also where "Smith Crawford" leaves "Mother Earth" it apears as if the "Smith Crawford team placed their own bolt rather than trust the "Mother Earth" bolt as there are two bolts here. I intend to pull both and only replace one and patch the other hole. The "Mother Earth" bolt will be the one replaced. Is everyone cool with that? Also there were 2 fixed pins backing up the bolt protecting the 5.11c move on the 7th pitch of "Mother Earth". I removed them after replacing the bolt yesterday. Going back on Saturday and will finish "Mother Earth" Sunday. I will leave ropes fixed to the high points to access other stuff.
Roger Brown
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!