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atchafalaya
climber
California
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Nah, its all good. these threads never really go anywhere anyway. Just having fun. Cheers,
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feelio Babar
Trad climber
Sneaking up behind you...
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"Please STFU"
how polite Bill!
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Wild Bill
climber
Ca
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Really, Fattrad? You were actually there? If so, spray away!
If not, well - you'll spray anyway won't you?
Remember Dolores Huerta?
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Wild Bill
climber
Ca
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feelio -
Not very polite at all. Just frustrated. Please excuse the lapse in courtesy. You all should feel free to say whatever you want.
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Wild Bill
climber
Ca
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Riley, I have seen no reports indicating that an attack on the police caused this reaction. These other issues about "those people" taking liberties and abusing our system are for another thread, IMHO.
At a news conference, LAPD Chief Bratton said that due to all the training Los Angeles police officers go through "the attacks of yesterday shouldn't have happened."
Who do you believe? I am more inclined to listen to Bratton than Fattrad or anyone else on this board - unless you were actually there. Anyone?
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elcapfool
Big Wall climber
hiding in plain sight
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I'm so...
conflicted.
It's like Al Qaida attacking North Korea...
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Wild Bill
climber
Ca
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"It's like Al Qaida attacking North Korea..."
Hahaha! Perfect summation, counsel.
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davidji
Social climber
CA
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"The order goes out then listen to the damn police."
Exactly what kind of radical are you?
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WBraun
climber
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When the cops come I'd book it out there. Why would you want to test those guys? They're dressed for business.
And when you see that kind of dress you leave before they get to you ....
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Anyone that gets between a cop in full riot dress and the bunch that pulled one of their own of a bike and beat the crap out of him is an idiot.
Your press badge ain't gonna save ya from geting your bell rung.
They aren't the least bit interested in your desire to "get the shot" at that point.
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Shack
Big Wall climber
Reno NV
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I see it as a savy political tactic, executed perfectly, by La Raza.
Step 1: Stage a rally.
Step 2: Wait for TV Coverage.
Step 3: Incite a riot and wait for LAPD to do their thing.
Step 4: Spin as needed.
Brilliant!
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Off the Couch
Trad climber
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I never expected to find so much law and order here at the TacoStand.
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Can't we just get along?
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Fluoride
Trad climber
Hollywood, CA
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Like every station in town, I had multiple crews out at MacArthur Park covering it. None of my crews got in to it with the cops but they sure did photograph things that gave me pause. What suprised me the most is the officers actions while they were completely aware they were being videotaped right and left. That if they did something out of line, it was going to be captured for the world to see.
This lovely little event happened during my shift Tuesday. I was listening to the LAPD command scanners while watching the mess unfold from my helicopter while I had my ground crews shooting the various intersections where problems were going on. The immigration rally ended around 5:30. Shortly after 6pm they brought out Metro Division in their riot gear to do a standard crowd dispersment. Most of the protestors cleared out when told but there was a small group of anarchists who had been following the march around and intentionally were trying to mess with the PD. By 6:10 I could hear officers taking rocks and bottles at a couple of different intersections and by 6:15 officers went on the move with a skirmish line.
Now this is where it all went to hell. The anarchists (troublemakers) had all ran off and cleared out but they'd set the wheels in motion and the field officers were pretty charged up. They moved through the park and some seemed to push and shove anyone in their way. Sadly, midway through their clear out they were coming across innocent people who just simply happened to be in the park. Some of the news crews that got roughed up were ones in the path of the skirmish line. The video you saw was the line passing past the reporters and, well you all saw what happened next.
Two other news photographers had their cameras ripped from their hands and thrown to the ground. A longtime reporter and cameraman from KCBS were struck in the gut with batons witout provocation. The RTNA is all up in arms about how news crews were treated during the incident. Fortunately, my crews stayed to the sides of the skirmish line so my guys and equipment made it through in one piece. Other stations, not so lucky.
There was one image in particular that really disturbed me - there was an old man on a bicycle who happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time and they literally pulled him off his bike, threw the bike over a cement barrier and then roughly moved the old man over as well. The look of terror on that old man's face broke my heart. He had no idea what was going on and I can't fathom even with your adrenaline racing how you could treat a senior citizen with such force. Seriously, the guy was about 5 feet two and had to be at least 75 years old.
Basically, the whole reason this occured was the anarchists pushed the cops' buttons until they snapped and were forced to use force to defend themselves. Unfortunately, many bystanders took the brunt of the anarchists actions. The situation escalated VERY rapidly and from the field chatter I was listening to on the scanners, and the command chain out in the field for the cops seemed really unorganized and uncoordinated. And no one seems to know exactly who ordered the officers to start using their rubber bullets, but they did. Some were firing them off somewhat randomly, hitting a number of people who were actually following their dispersement orders.
I'm not saying who is wrong or right here. I'm none too pleased at how the media and bystanders were treated. Yet I have friends on the LAPD and they're good people who have a tough job to do. I even know one who was out there at the scene (he shot off a few rubber bullet rounds). When I asked him how it all went to hell so fast he basically said someone higher on the chain of command than he and his fellow officers made the order to use force/rubber bullets to quell the situation. Instead it just made things worse. So the Metro guys were doing what they were told to do. Except I think adrenaline got the better of some of the officers and being allowed to use force, well a few of the guys went too far. I have a feeling LAPD's Metro Unit is going to undergo a major overhaul after this.
Chief Bratton has actually shown a lot of contrition towards what went down. He's promised investigations and I believe him. In the days of Daryl Gates and Bernie Parks, I don't think the response would have been the same. Bratton's a no BS kind of guy and does NOT want what happened out there to reflect the department he runs. If officers were out of line, he wants to know and things will get done.
Time will tell.
Oh, and just to clarify, that video was shot by a local Fox affiliate (I hate Faux News as much as the next person, but it wasn't the big bad network but a local KTTV crew.) I know Christina (the KTTV reporter) and Patti (her camerawoman) and they were just doing their jobs, they didn't deserve what happened to them.
Well, that's my two cents from a somewhat first hand account.
It's been a long week. I cannot wait to get on the rock this weekend and flush it all from my head.
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WBraun
climber
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Thanks for sharing that 1st hand up close report of what really was going on. Nothing like hearing it from someone that was there that puts it into a more realistic perspective.
Thanks again .....
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Hootervillian
climber
the Hooterville World-Guardian
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perhaps 'Darth's Raider's' might have been a little much for the audience.
maybe next time, despite it not quite being memorial day, this would be more appropriate.
see how that plays a little better, just one guy in black. the rest seem kinda luvable♥. the perp prolly wanted to kneel just to check out the costumes.
i hear what ya'll are saying, but i didn't see 'illegal' tatooed on any of the foreheads of those fellow citizens being knocked down and shoved from public property. maybe the sound was bad. i didn't once here "Paperzzz Pleazzzze".
i for one am psyched my people can witness a scene like that on tv and take the high road of law and order. this transition to good corporate citizens won't be that hard after all.
i am going to take the advice of the more pragmatic though, and next time i see a cop, i'm running.
brian fontana style edit:
i love the anarchist terminology. of course we can't know what would have evolved without a legion of stormtroopers present, steam rolling the crowd.
anybody ever experience a reaction to a pitbull?
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Hootervillian
climber
the Hooterville World-Guardian
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Thanks for the first hand report.
yes indeed, all YOU need to know is in paragraph 6, wrapped up nicely with the first sentence of paragraph seven.
of course, with that chip on their shoulder, it's pretty easy to provoke an anarchist (you know, the troublemakers). tell 'em they can't be there goose-step style, maybe step all up in their pic-a-nic basket, maybe even shove some of the relatives they're too selfish to care anything about. works pretty good on teenagers too.
all in all, a well thought out presence.
What suprised me the most is the officers actions while they were completely aware they were being videotaped right and left. That if they did something out of line, it was going to be captured for the world to see.
could be a clue? maybe take shacks lead, but switch the 'client' some 180°.
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graniteclimber
Trad climber
Nowhere
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Topic Author's Reply - May 7, 2007 - 02:37am PT
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Action by Police at Rally Troubles Los Angeles Chief
By JENNIFER STEINHAUER and JULIA PRESTON
Published: May 4, 2007
LOS ANGELES, May 3 — Chief William J. Bratton of the Los Angeles Police Department said Thursday that the episode here in which police officers clashed with demonstrators and journalists on Tuesday at an immigration rally was the “worst incident of this type I have ever encountered in 37 years” in law enforcement.
Chief in Los Angeles Cites Police Failures
By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
Published: May 7, 2007
LOS ANGELES, May 6 (AP) — Police Chief William Bratton said Sunday that up to 60 members of an elite squad that swept into MacArthur Park and fired rubber bullets during a May Day immigration rally are no longer on the street.
Mr. Bratton said he had spent the weekend watching video of the incident. He said failures were widespread and that officers at all levels were responsible. “I’m not going to defend the indefensible,” Mr. Bratton told reporters. “Things were done that shouldn’t have been done.”
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Hootervillian
climber
the Hooterville World-Guardian
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bump for the broken knees of a twelve year old anarchist,
the efficacy of the embedded, and the critical thought of the chivalrous.
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