If you hang the draws, it's a pinkpoint.

I wonder what the hardest climb ever done barefoot is. Cause realistically that would be the hardest true freeclimb ever done.

You think if someone does RP the dawn wall or LA Dura dura, rock climbing mags will report it as a true redpoint and brush off those climbs as pinkpoints? ...

May 6, 2015 - 10:25pm PTSo you can never redpoint a steep route that has existing fixed chain draws. Interesting.

all first ascents that didn't place all bolts on lead and without weighting the rope must be considered aid climbs [seems to me bachar was a proponent of this one...]

I just want us to have fun.

Respect your opinion, but I believe the act of proving that it goes, with pre placed draws or whatever is the big step.

The English term "redpoint" is derived from the German Rotpunkt (point of red) coined by Kurt Albert in the mid-1970s at Frankenjura. He would paint a red X on a fixed pin that he could avoid using for a foot- or handhold. Once he was able to free-climb the entire route, he would put a red dot at the base of the route. In many ways, this was the origin of the free climbing movement that led to the development of sport climbing ten years later.

*Origin: The late German climber Kurt Albert, who, at his local Frankenjura in 1975, painted his first red circle under Adolf Rott Ged.-Weg (5.10a), on Streitberger Schild, to indicate he’d freed every move. Once he successfully linked the moves, Albert filled in the circle, hence the term rotpunkt, or “red point.” Albert, according to Lynn Hill, might have borrowed the red-circle logo of the German brand Rotpunkt, a maker of coffee carafes.