Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 05:11pm PT
|
So among the unwritten terms of service are that your entire history here can be deleted without warning or discussion.--Khanom
Where is it unwritten, Eric?
It seems pretty ironclad to me.
Not that the management would ever chop you or me. :0)
It's great they don't have grammar/spelling police. Yet.
SuperTopo Terms of Service
Welcome! By using the SuperTopo.com website, you agree to be bound by the
following terms and conditions (the "Terms of Service").
1. WARNING!
Climbing is an inherently dangerous sport in which severe injuries or death may
occur. Relying on the information from SuperTopo guidebooks, the
SuperTopo.com on-line service, or content of any form from SuperTopo may
increase the danger. We do not guarantee the accuracy, integrity or quality of
such content or information in SuperTopo climbing guidebooks, the
SuperTopo.com on-line service, or any other form of content from SuperTopo.
2. Description of Service
SuperTopo is an interactive on-line service (the "Service") consisting of
information services and content provided by SuperTopo and other third parties.
You will be responsible for all activities occurring under your username and for
keeping your password secure. You understand and agree that the Service is
provided to you on an AS IS and AS AVAILABLE basis. SuperTopo disclaims all
responsibility and liability for the availability, timeliness, security or reliability of
the Service. SuperTopo also reserves the right to modify, suspend or discontinue
the Service with or without notice at any time and without any liability to you.
You must be at least thirteen (13) years of age to use the Service. SuperTopo
reserves the right to refuse service to anyone at any time without notice for any
reason.
|
|
Jan
Mountain climber
Colorado, Nepal & Okinawa
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 05:31pm PT
|
I always thought climbers were individualists. This whole episode smacks of the military however. Group punishment for the perceived misdeeds of one person. Discipline by group intimidation. Punishment by overkill.
So the message is clear. Start downloading the posts that you care about, because everything that's ever been posted can disappear without warning. Who knows, I may be disappeared by tomorrow morning?
|
|
Studly
Trad climber
WA
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 05:32pm PT
|
I think Dr F thought he was running the Supertopo show. Then he got flushed....Whoosh...
|
|
justthemaid
climber
Jim Henson's Basement
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 05:34pm PT
|
I'd say that CMac & co never intended the ST Forum to be a primary, daily social circle for anyone. Yet that is exactly what it is for too many of us who frequent the place.
CMac may not have intended it to end up a certain way, I suspect DR. F was somewhat more obnoxious in his "requests" than he reports, but with the "No-Moderation" policy in place you have to accept that certain personalities will attempt to dominate and they (the management) will have to deal.
My way of coping with such people is to simply ignore them. I seem to be blessed with the ability to simply gloss over posts by certain people I'm not interested in. To be honest..Df F was totally off my radar. I've probably only read a handful of his posts in all the time I have been here. He, (unlike LEB and TR for instance) seemed to confine himself to certain threads that were easy to avoid.
I repeat, that I have a major issue with destroying the integrity of existing treads, regardless of how obnoxious the contributors may have been. It really bugs me. Ex: my favorite story on this site was by Cosgrove about his ascent of Southern Belle. It is gone and this makes me profoundly sad. They could have banned him (at the time)without all the deletions. Now, one of the finest pieces of writing on this site is gone, forever.
|
|
apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 05:41pm PT
|
"He, (unlike LEB for instance) seemed to confine himself to certain threads that were easy to avoid."
Yeah, contrary to what the anti-polititards would say, F was very good about not starting a new OT polititard thread every time something caught his eye. Much, much better than many of the regulars here, that's for sure.
|
|
Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 05:51pm PT
|
But I no longer want to be the focus of hate, lies and BS. Does anyone need that?
Interesting comment, given that it comes from someone who dished out a vast quantity of hate.
I am not an angry person, I’m a happy clappy liberal.
Perhaps in his own mind he wasn't angry, but his posts were brimming over with anger. Those of you who know him say he is a bright and thoughtful guy who is a joy to spend time with. But his posting history paints a picture of an intolerant as#@&%e whose response to anyone who disagrees with anything he says, thinks, or believes is to crank the shriek volume to 11.
For what it's worth, I share most of his political/social/religious beliefs, but his rants were embarrassing. They also made meaningful dialog impossible. But perhaps that is just the way of the internet. If it wasn't Dr. F ranting, it would be someone else. If I want to have a serious conversation with someone who holds views different from mine, I guess I'll just have to go down to California and take John Elezarian out for a beer.
Time away from the forum is probably what he needs. Maybe a year from now he can come back and contribute in a positive way.
|
|
Norton
Social climber
quitcherbellyachin
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 05:52pm PT
|
SuperTopo also reserves the right to modify, suspend or discontinue
the Service with or without notice at any time and without any liability to you.
well reading that takes care of objecting to all your posts vanishing
|
|
GDavis
Social climber
SOL CAL
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 05:57pm PT
|
I view the banning of Dr. F, the removal of all of his threads and posts from Supertopo as a huge loss to this blog and everyone who follows it.
Speak for yourself. I hate bumping these meta posts (low-T) but I have to at least say some input as a frequenter of this site:
I screw up all the time and make people upset. I realize it when I do it and hopefully I can grow as a man and either apologize or make corrections. Despite all the evidence in the world, I have no right to make someone feel little or small or stupid because of their beliefs - that is my Ego making itself feel better by distancing itself from ideas or opinions it views as pedantic.
Groovy?
So as fun as it might be to get in arguments with people that are clearly insane, know you are playing a game and the game has rules.
I read Dr. F's post above as if I was Chris, and less than halfway down I thought to myself I'd have banned him by now. This is Chris' website, his toy. Not ours. If Chris McNamera wanted to make Supertopo solely a BASE website or just an ecommerce outlet for his books, it is his decision and I would hope he makes the one that makes him happy - if we don't like it we can always leave.
I'm not going to leave, I'm sticking around. There are a sh#t load of cool climbers here who love the culture and outlet of climbing and can behave well in a forum of a few hundred other individuals with wide-ranging beliefs. Hopefully people who want to ruin that are gotten rid of. Facebook, sports blogs, everywhere I go I see Left vs Right drivel. Do we really need it here?
|
|
i'm gumby dammit
Sport climber
da ow
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 06:04pm PT
|
kill every contribution, regardless of the author, to every thread started by a poster... seriously? this is actually done on a 10+ year old forum whose stated goal is to "record history"??? it's pretty standard when someone is banned on any forum. how would you feel if you were banned but cmac continued to make money by placing ads on thousands of pages of content you created?
|
|
zBrown
Ice climber
Brujò de la Playa
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 06:12pm PT
|
So, was Dr. F under age 13?
|
|
bvb
Social climber
flagstaff arizona
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 06:15pm PT
|
Wow. I'm just completely...nothing. I just don't care. It's the f*#king internet. Is this little fun house of manufactured drama really anything we should seriously care about? I must be doing this wrong.
|
|
Nick
climber
portland, Oregon
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 06:18pm PT
|
Reinstate Dr. F! If all you ever talk about or read is climbing you need to grow a bit. Every time you delete a user who is not afraid to voice their opinion this site looses a little color. Craig is unique and I for one will miss his input.
|
|
Nick
climber
portland, Oregon
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 06:21pm PT
|
Bob we should care, the more our voices are stifled, the less freedom we have. The internet is the modern soapbox.
|
|
nah000
climber
canuckistan
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 06:24pm PT
|
i'm gumby dammit:
if you read closer you'll see i mostly agree with you regarding the posts dr f created himself.
where i disagree is regarding deleting every post that was made to a thread he started [in the case of the religion and science thread, Jan, Largo, jgill and mikeL, to name but a very few, had contributed to, what at certain points was, a very compelling dialogue...]
so for sure, cmac should feel free to generate revenue from content that wasn't created by a banned contributor...
while dr f created his posts, he certainly wasn't responsible for the posts of the people mentioned above...
i'm not aware of another forum that does this wholesale deletion of every contribution, regardless of author, to any thread started by a certain individual...
|
|
MH2
climber
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 06:28pm PT
|
From Dr. F's statement:
So then I e-mail Chris directly and ask him, ”Will there be any moderation, can we discuss this. There are problematic posters on SuperTopo that bring it down for everyone.”
Since I had never received an e-mail from Chris yet, and Mr. B says I have to hear what Chris says, I write "No response is unacceptable"
From page 1 of Politics, God, & Religion vs. Science:
|
|
Dapper Dan
Trad climber
Menlo Park
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 06:28pm PT
|
I dunno, I got kind of sick of seeing his dumb non-climbing threads on the front page daily, with tens of thousands of posts.
x2 ...
|
|
Jingy
climber
Somewhere out there
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 06:33pm PT
|
Bob we should care, the more our voices are stifled, the less freedom we have. The internet is the modern soapbox.
 do you really think singing it to the internet is the modern soapbox?
sorry.... I don't see it.
When or where has your voice been stifled?
cheers to all
|
|
TYeary
Social climber
State of decay
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 06:33pm PT
|
Sorry to see Craig go. Not surprised. As an infrequent contributor to ST and more the occasional lurker, I have been dismayed at some of the BS that passes for liberal thinking and the ramblings of lost boys conservative dogma. But it is what it is. I suspect I will frequent even less now.
Cheers and carry on.....
TY
|
|
i'm gumby dammit
Sport climber
da ow
|
|
|
Oct 19, 2014 - 06:39pm PT
|
i'm not aware of another forum that does this wholesale deletion of every contribution, regardless of author, to any thread started by a certain individual... part of what i meant was that on most forums, when the original post in a thread is deleted, either by a mod or by the poster, the entire thread is deleted. it's not that the moderators decided 'let's delete the whole science vs religion' thread, they simply deleted Dr F. and the forum software took care of the rest.
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!