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dirtbag
climber
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This is a tangent, but one thing I never understood in physics is how gravity can lock an object into orbit around another object, or be used to propel another object into space. I don't get why the orbiting object wouldn't simply be sucked into a collision with the other object.
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dirtbag
climber
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Thanks DMT for answering half of that.
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hobo
climber
PDX
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 1, 2006 - 03:44pm PT
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Juan, do you think you could post those pdf's? That would be awesome!
Thanks
Alex
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hobo
climber
PDX
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 1, 2006 - 03:53pm PT
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Dirtbag, it's actually quite similar to twirling a ball around on a string. Most of the force on the ball is directed exactly towards your hand, once you've got it going.
alex
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dirtbag
climber
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Ah, okay. Thanks, that helps.
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sandstone and sky
Trad climber
AK
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Hey Dirtbag -
Everything Dingus said, plus, in space there is no drag (air friction) to slow things down. So they can stay in orbit for a long time. But orbits can decay. Remember Skylab?
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dirtbag
climber
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I do remember Skylab. For some reason I had it in my head that orbits were perpetual, unless something altered it (which is why I was confused from the get-go). Dingus' simple bullet example makes perfect sense to me.
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Jay
Trad climber
Fort Mill, SC
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the orbital slingshot takes effect when the object you're obiting is moving as well. Think about appraoching a planet while going say 25,000 mph and say the planet is going 75,000 mph. Stay far enough away to orbit that sucker just enough to make a sharp turn in the direction the planet is going, if you escape the orbit you can catch quite a bit of speed. Even better to slingshot a moon of said planet (assuming the moon is going the same direction on the far side of the planet).
Kinda like skateboarders hitching a ride off a car. Or surfers dropping into a huge wave being towed by a jet ski.
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Batrock
Trad climber
Burbank
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The show I saw on TLC or Discovery was pretty good. The guys they had on there to say it was a hoax were hilarious. They looked like characters straight out of the Simpsons. One guy looked like Homers dad, he lived in a trailer park and kept ranting about the letter C on a rock. The other guy looked like Comic Book Guy. These were the experts?
Supposedly there is a mirror that was left on the moon. It is still in use today. Shoot a laser at it and the beam bounces back. That was the final nail in the hoax theory. You can see and still use something that was placed there by humans.
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Watched it on TV outside around a BBQ.
Jr High School teacher tried to convince us in class a couple of days later that it didn't happen.
I suppose it could have been faked, but I doubt it.
Even the Soviet scientists that examined the moon rocks said that they were't from earth (the rocks, that is). In the middle of a Cold War and your 'enemy' might be expected to not help feed your propaganda.
I think it happened. Anyway, I think The Dish is a great movie (great soundtrack) and if Sam Neill thinks it happened, then it did. ;-)
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Majid_S
Mountain climber
Bay Area
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WITH 15 mega pix cameras and a OUCH PHOTOSHOP work
You can be any where any time
PS
Did NASA had photoshop 40 years ago ?
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paganmonkeyboy
Trad climber
the blighted lands of hatu
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no way man - it was faked to provide a 'pearl harbor' to rally the people around a massive arms buildup that also funnels all the money to the very people that...oh wait -
wrong thread...;)
what was that joke in capricorn one that guy is telling himself while soloing that cliff ? something about a dog and a squirrel, chased him up on the roof...
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WoodySt
Trad climber
Riverside
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The same retort can be given to the 911 conspiritors: too many people required; too many mouths to keep shut.
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JEM
Social climber
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I remember seeing a news clip where someone confronted Armstrong, at some function he was attending, accusing him of faking the landing. He promptly punched the guy in the nose. Pretty good of Armstrong. What a moroon ... accusing him of faking the moon landing. Someone just wanting some TV attention.
JEM
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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Yes, WoodySt and as you can see on this forum I do use it. Any conspiracies around 9/11 were all very, very small and not comprehensive. A conspiracy to protect the perps from being arrested beforehand, sure maybe. A conspiracy to shoot a cruise missile into the Pentagon? Dream on. The only truly mass conspiracies of 9/11 happened afterwards. The first was the CYA conspiracy, where agencies, politicians and beareaucrats covered their asses on an unprecidented scale. The second was the fear-mongering that has resulted in billions of dollars and thousands of lives wasted on homeland '(in)security' and the war in Iraq.
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Jaybro
Social climber
The West
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Met one of those moonies, I believed him. Same evidence as I have that I climbed the Nose, witnesses, cohorts, photos, etc. None of us can prove sh#t.
silly troll
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Klimmer
Mountain climber
San Diego
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Dec 23, 2006 - 12:22am PT
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I was searching around for something else in the archives and I came across this old thread. How did I miss this thread? I love this stuff.
Faked Moon landings. I never gave any of this the time of day, but some peolple do especially in a few other countries, as well as the occasional HS physics student that comes along to my class.
So I had the opportunity to go to the Houston NASA Space Center (just after Katrina happened), for my sister's wedding and went on the NASA tour including going into the Houston Apollo Mission Control Center. You know the one, "Houston we have a problem." It is no longer in use, but a historical very large room within a much larger building, left as it was last used.
Well, I knew the answer but wanted to get it on video tape for my students so we could discuss it when the topic ever came up in class, and I point blank asked our tour guide. I asked, "You know there are some people in the world, including sometimes HS students in my Physics class, who actually think that the moon landings have all been faked and man has never set foot on the moon. One of the pieces of evidence they point to is the waving of a flag on the surface of the moon. Can you respond to that?" And this guy was there at NASA during the Apollo missions.
He said, "Sure. We get that question here at Houston often on tours." He went on to describe how the flags where purchased just down the street at a local hardware store and were all folded up just as they were purchased and sent on missions. The flags were synthetic and had memmory, so when the flag was displayed on the moon and unfolded, and hung from the pole with rod to get it to stand up, the folds in the sythetic nylon flag acted like springs in the 1/6th gravity and atmosphere free surface of the moon, and continued to wave and bounce in place, acting as though the wind was blowing. And on the back wall near where we were all standing in mission control at Houston there are now about 7 massive blow up color images of the flag being set-up on the moon with the astronauts! And we could see exactly what he was talking about. I took video of all of it. Good stuff.
The Russians had actually landed unmanned vehicles on the moon before we got there, and even designed one that took moon samples and returned these samples back to Earth. How many of you know that? This Russian moon lander was called Luna 20 (Russian soft lander; lunar soil samples returned to Earth). They were the first to land an unmanned craft on the moon, we were the first to set man on the Moon. Then of course we brought back a significant amount of moon rocks from all the Apollo missions. And here on Earth, Moon Meteorites do indeed fall. How you ask? When a Meteriod from the Asteroid belt between Mars and Jupiter slams into the Moon as they do here on Earth, a massive enough collision of a meteorite on the Moon can actually send ejecta up and out of the moons gravity field to eventaully one day fall to Earth as Moon Meteorites. Yes, they are rare but we do find then across the Earth's surface in diverse places. NASA has a website devoted just to Moon meteorites. You can even own a piece of a moon meteorite, but expect to pay big $ for a significant slice. I have two small pieces that are each in mg mass amounts. One from the highlands of the moon, and one from the mare region, and they were still very expensive. Moon meteorites fetch about $1000/g on the market. Buy from a licensed dealer!
Guess what? All three sources of Moon rock/meteorite (Russian samples, Apollo Moon Rocks, and Moon Meteorites) all have the same exact mineral type analysis and radioactive date ages of 4.5 - 4.6 billion years old. You can't fake that. We don't have rocks that old on Earth because our world is still very volcanically active and rock material here gets recycled and the atomic clocks are then reset. And the mineral assemblages are very,very unique and far different from Earth. Three independant sources from the Moon and they all check out exactly.
Well, I could go on and on, there are so many ways to show we have been to the moon and back.
Don't anyone suggest real or faked moon landings and 9-11 conspiracy theories (Official or alternative) have anything in common. Don't even go there. Two very different things entirely. That is the Scouts' Honor truth.
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Majid_S
Mountain climber
Bay Area
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Dec 23, 2006 - 01:50am PT
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Dingu
have you asked Astroman to see if he has done it ? or may be the german brothers.
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JuanDeFuca
Big Wall climber
Stoney Point
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Dec 23, 2006 - 02:41am PT
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What is it with going to the moon. From a technological standpoint Man has done things orders of magnitude more difficult. You think its easy to pack millions of transistors inside the modern microprocessor. Or how about sequencing the human genome. You ever fly on a 747? We have submarines that go 1000 meters deep with more destructive power ever unleashed by man. We have put landers on Mars. Toured the solar system.
What is it about the Moon?
If you really believe it was faked you are either a complete idiot or a mental case.
JDF
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Chaz
Trad climber
So. Cal.
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Dec 23, 2006 - 05:11am PT
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Hell Yes we went to the Moon!
We sent men to Venus and Mars, too. But The Government's covering it up and keeping it secret.
The guys in charge of this cover-up are the same ones who killed the Kennedys, knocked down WTC #7, own the Federal Reserve, and sell hot-dogs in ten packs while buns are sold in packages of eight.
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