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Travis Haussener
Trad climber
Salt Lake City
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Bio weapons sheesh come on you guys think positive...as a chemist, this is our wet dream. Pretty much unlimited reign to test anything you want on these patients with zero repercussions from the grand ole' FDA, given the circumstances i.e. (you're dead either way).
Personally I think western medicine (IV's, internal lines, blood transfusions) would provide a reduced mortality rate for any strain, it's just the countries are soooo poor. I'm interested/excited to see how this goes.
Maybe someone with a little more virology or medical experience could chime in. I have no idea as to how good (relatively speaking) the treatment is in West Africa.
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overwatch
climber
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I believe ken m is a doctor
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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I do have an MD, and a masters in microbiology/genetics.
there are few things medically that really scare me, but Ebola is #1 on that list.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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I have no idea as to how good (relatively speaking) the treatment is in West Africa.
I believe that Medecins Sans Frontieres has been running the show in
Conakry so they are hardly n00bs and from what I have seen their sterile
technique has been quite rigorous. That is why their people who have
contracted it is so worrisome.
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beaner
Social climber
Maine
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I believe that Medecins Sans Frontieres has been running the show in
Conakry so they are hardly n00bs and from what I have seen their sterile
technique has been quite rigorous. That is why their people who have
contracted it is so worrisome.
The two infected Americans were with Samaritan's Purse. How much experience did they have with Ebola?
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stevep
Boulder climber
Salt Lake, UT
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I think only one of the infected Americans was formally a clinician, the others were missionaries who did some health care work. Still, a bit puzzling and concerning that we're seeing infections in the clinical staff at this point.
The Reston incident mentioned in the Hot Zone seems to be somewhat of an outlier. They think it was airborne, but if I remember correctly, that wasn't conclusively proven. And as mentioned above, it seems that strain wasn't a problem for humans. But that's obviously not a guarantee that something worse won't show up in the future.
And while I'm not an MD, I do work in health data analytics, so have enough epidemiology background to be reasonably coherent about this stuff.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Actually, the video I saw was of those guys as the narrator said the person
on camera was one of the infected so it was their sterile protocols I was
seeing. I mean they had masks on top of masks and double-gloved with goggles
and spraying their footwear and walking through disinfectant baths and on
and on. That's why it is so scary.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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The Reston incident mentioned in the Hot Zone seems to be somewhat of an outlier. They think it was airborne, but if I remember correctly, that wasn't conclusively proven. And as mentioned above, it seems that strain wasn't a problem for humans. But that's obviously not a guarantee that something worse won't show up in the future.
And while I'm not an MD, I do work in health data analytics, so have enough epidemiology background to be reasonably coherent about this stuff.
I believe that RESTV was conclusively shown to be airborne. As you note, it was a unique case. However, every outbreak seems to fall into that category, which is worrisome that there is genetic drift with each different strain.
There was at least one case where there was presumed pig-human transmission of RESTV, and these sorts of transmissions are the most worrisome, as they are the most likely to produce very pathogenic strains of epidemics such as flu.
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overwatch
climber
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I gotta stop reading this thread. It is making me want to post something I shouldn't say
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Our Government can prevent these individuals from being brought to the US and can also insure they receive top notch medical care in Africa.
The best interests of the American people in general are once again being ignored---something that is becoming disturbingly commonplace from today's Federal Government --- long overdue for a giant bitch-slap from the American people---at least that portion of the American public that actually gives a rats rear end about this country.
The American people are not being given the benefit of the doubt here.
It's time at least that one of the current crop of cowardly politicians stand up and say this.
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SteveW
Trad climber
The state of confusion
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Scary scary scary. . .
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fear
Ice climber
hartford, ct
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IMO, the potential problem is not the two patients being brought here. It's much more likely already in our country given that infected people in Africa were in major cities.
And if healthy people are not prepared to hole up for at least a few months without any outside assistance, well then, they're not paying attention.
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crøtch
climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 1, 2014 - 02:07pm PT
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Ken M makes an excellent point regarding recent safety lapses at the CDC.
(CNN) -- Anthrax. Smallpox. A potentially deadly strain of the flu virus. The American public trusts the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention to handle dangerous biological materials, but recent incidents have put a damper on the agency's reputation, members of Congress said Wednesday.
"What happened was completely unacceptable," CDC Director Dr. Tom Frieden said in his testimony before the Energy and Commerce Committee's subcommittee for Oversight and Investigations.
"It never should have happened."
Rep. Tim Murphy, R-Pennsylvania, the subcommittee chairman, opened the hearing by summarizing the troubling incidents that have come to light over the past month.
In early June, dozens of CDC workers were potentially exposed to anthrax after a lab failed to inactivate the dangerous bacteria before transferring it to a lower lab.
A subsequent investigation revealed "an alarming series of failures," according to one of the subcommittee members, including an incident of cross contamination between a relatively safe and a potentially deadly strain of the flu virus.
An outside investigation by the U.S. Department of Agriculture found dangerous biological materials stored in unlocked refrigerators and a general lack of lab workers following safety protocols. Investigators say the anthrax that was believed to be deactivated was transferred in Ziploc bags, which are obviously not approved to carry such materials.
"This is troubling, and it is completely unacceptable," Murphy said. "The CDC is supposed to be the gold standard (for lab safety). ...This is not sound science, and this will not be tolerated. These practices put the health of the American public at risk."
Murphy said the CDC was lucky that no one appears to have been infected during the anthrax incident, but "sooner or later that luck will run out."
This is not the first time the subcommittee has heard of safety issues at CDC labs, said Rep. Diana DeGette, D-Colorado. Multiple hearings over the past decade have shown lapses that together reveal a problem with safety reporting at the agency, she said.
"What we all need to know is the plan to change the culture at the CDC," DeGette said. "We can do a lot but we can't legislate a culture change."
Frieden, who took the CDC director job in 2009, acknowledged that he and other CDC managers failed to recognize a "critical pattern."
The CDC has closed the labs that were involved in the incidents. They won't reopen until better safety procedures are in place, Frieden said. Scientists have also stopped moving any biological material out of its two highest-level labs while their procedures are being re-evaluated.
This may slow some CDC processes -- such as providing materials for companies to create next year's flu vaccine, Frieden said -- but safety comes first.
"We must do that work more safely, and we will," he said.
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dave729
Trad climber
Western America
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“To mess around with Ebola is an easy way to die. Better to work with something safer, such as anthrax.”
― Richard Preston, The Hot Zone
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dave729
Trad climber
Western America
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All I can think is the lunatics are in charge
to even consider this transfer of live Ebola virus
into the US.
A Virus Walks Into a Bar...' and Other Science Jokes - Brian Malow
[Click to View YouTube Video]
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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I agree with Ward Trotter. This is all about bleeding heart liberals.
It's about an arrogant group of ideologues and fools in charge of the national government who are now consistently putting their political ideology, power interests, and stupidity ahead of the best interests of the American people.
The way this monumental arrogance manifests itself over this particular issue is in a conspicuous failure and unwillingness to give the citizens of this country the highest priority of safety, and benefit of the doubt ,against a horribly contagious disease.
Ebola is still largely a mystery. It is a virus with the potential capacity to change and adapt to new circumstances.
Why play russian Roulette with a highly contagious disease of this magnitude on the blind assurances of a medical establishment at Emory, or any other institution---a medical establishment currently incapable of fully understanding or predicting the possible adaptive course of this horrendous virus in a new environment, should a human error occur? And this is not to mention presently not having a vaccine or a cure against this thing.
It is irresponsible and stupid and gets at the very heart of how currently unresponsive our government has become at putting the interests and safety of the American people first and foremost.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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What Overwatch said.
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drljefe
climber
El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson
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That sh#t makes your heart bleed too?
F*#k.
Oh well, time to pack ebola
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crankster
Trad climber
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These "missionaries" are either nut jobs or (more likely) CIA agents--so of course they got to bring their "injured personnel" back to the grounds. Most likely they were CIA employees aiding in their "research" to begin with. Plus, the fake with the Malaysian plane didn't work out so Ob-ola needs another little scandal to distract attention from the border situation. He wages full on war, bringing scabies, tuberculosis and what's not along with illegal criminals across the border freely; early into his 1st term, he had allowed anyone with HIV immigrate into the US (which was not allowed before him). I wonder why Atlanta and not So Cal...oh wait in So Cal it might hurt illegals, god forbids.
Climbers...should stick to climbing.
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Kalimon
Social climber
Ridgway, CO
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We're overdue for a good global pandemic anyway . . . hell in a bucket baby.
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