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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 5, 2006 - 07:05pm PT
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So Pete,
do you think the interview responses were prepared pc positions or sincere?
Do you think that alcohol can actually take over a person's sense of what is right? Can actually close an open mind?
You speak of disappointment, but I'm not sure IN WHAT. Do you think that this is a case of people all to eager to see a person more successful than them be brought down and are on a feeding frenzy, or a case of well justified indignation.
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JAK
climber
Central NC
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yeah, the distinction has always made me wonder. is being a jew both a race and a religion? what other religions give themeselves a racial distinction.
AFAIK Jewish means a follower of Judaism and does not imply ethnicity. Hebrew does (descendants of Noah, biblically speaking), and doesn't necessarily mean Jewish).
That's why I always thought "I hate Jews" was kind of a weird ethnic slur. I don't think it's actually referring to an ethnic group.
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'Pass the Pitons' Pete
Big Wall climber
like Oakville, Ontario, Canada, eh?
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Ron,
I can tell you that Mel Gibson is a passionate Believer and Christian - that was fully evidenced in the responses in his interview. His responses were absolutely sincere and straight from his heart. Remember, he made the movie because he believes.
Which is why I was so incredibly disappointed in Mel to make those dumbass comments! It did not seem consistent with his character as I understood him to be. So I just don't get it. I'd like to know what the heck he was thinking!
And no, of course the alcohol doesn't account for it.
Incidentally, I grew up as a Token Goy on an All-Jewish Street. The Jewish kids for the most part kept to themselves, but I played a bit with them from time to time. The big kid next door, who was a year-and-a-half younger than me but twenty or thirty pounds bigger, particularly liked killing me in various contact sports like football and British Bulldog.
One time I got into an altercation with one of the kids, and I called him a "Kike". He told his mother, his mother called my mother, and my mother made me immediately march down the street, knock on the kid's door, and apologize to him.
It was a damn good lesson I learned that day.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 5, 2006 - 11:26pm PT
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Hmm, token goy. Interesting.
I'm no expert on the subject, but I thought true Christians believe in love and understanding. Yet it would appear that, with a holocaust denier as a father, the apple doesn't fall far from the tree.
There was that terrific scene in Godfather III where, before Michael Corleone confesses the murder of his brother, Cardinal Lamberto picks up a stone from out of the fountain and cracks it open to show that despite being submersed for centuries the inside is dry, just as the hearts of men can be surrounded by Christianity and yet remain devoid of its true meaning.
I don't say that Gibson lied about embracing Christian values, but I am quite far from being convinced.
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WBraun
climber
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People are not perfect. They make mistakes, only a liberated soul is perfect. The Saktavesa Avatar like Jeasus Christ is perfect.
So are you perfect? Always holding everyone (fallen souls) like you and me to the highest ideals eh Ron.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 6, 2006 - 02:13am PT
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Huh?
The Saktawhat?
I've screwed up plenty of times (and thats just this week) but I haven't slurred a group of people who have played a pivotal role in my earning near a billion dollars along with my own private island.
So, double standard? Well not really. I have a feeling that Meltdown Mel will be learning about peeing in the tall grass.
Still, I like that scene in Lethal Weapon umpteen where Danny Glover leans out of the window and imitates a siren.
I sort of imagine YOU doing that in the Valley Werner.
(Watch out! I've got Ouch's email address and I know how to use it! lol)
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d-know
Trad climber
electric lady land
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thanks JAK.
locker,
you have good vision.
wbraun,
we are all perfect.
we just need improvement.
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philo
Trad climber
boulder, co.
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Mel's meltdown? Big deal! Offensive as it may have been his words did not actually hurt anyone. Or call for anyone to be harmed. He has a right to his words. AND... none of us has the slightest idea what he might have been through in the previous 24 to 48 hours. Stress can make any one snap. SO WHAT! He will probably be dredged out into a public contrition for hurting peoples feelings and everyone will kiss and make up. But in this country right now we have prominent media talking heads calling for the outright assasination of democratically elected heads of states. Shouldn't they be held accused and accountable? Shouldn't we all be outraged?
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 6, 2006 - 10:18am PT
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But they're on TV philo.
We don't pay $7.50 for them to entertain us!
Apples and oranges.
Neither mitigates the other.
But this thread wasn't supposed to be about how BADLY he screwed up or not. Its about how lame it is to say, "It wasn't me. It was the alcohol talking."
I hope most people are intelligent enough to realize that while inebriated Gibson was speaking his true opinion, not that of some alien homunculus that took over his body while he was out bar hopping.
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dirtineye
Trad climber
the south
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Ron, what if alcohol just makes people more impulsive, and they make a bad choice in a heated moment?
Alcohol also brings out agression in some people. I remember seeing something scientific about this, but it seems that even people who are not truly as#@&%es can become one if they drink enough.
I just don't buy that alcohol is always truth serum and that their true character comes out when someone is really really drunk.
IF that were true, my true character would be that member of the 7 dwarves, Sleepy. OR maybe in the rare cases of excessive consumption, that less well known 8th dwarf that they kept locked in the closet, Pukey.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 6, 2006 - 10:43am PT
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How do you know they're not truly a$$holes that are just usually careful to hide it.?
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dirtineye
Trad climber
the south
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That's possible, and no doubt it happens. I just don't think it is always the case.
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Jennie
Trad climber
Salt Lake
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Ron, Do you get any flak from Mormon's in Utah? I haven't , personally seen much anti jewish bias amog mormons but my petrception aren't always 100% accurate.
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
St. Louis
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Once while under the influence, I went on a major diatribe about how STUPID the show Knight Rider is. I mean, I went on and on and on. I vaguely recall doing this (I was really hammered), but others confirmed I'd done so with great gusto. The weirdest thing is that I have zero recollection of ever having actually seen this show in my life.
Does this mean my true inner self is one of a tv critic?
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TYeary
Mountain climber
Baldwin Park, Calif.
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Perhaps mister "Blackheart" made a mistake. Maybe it WAS the alcohol talking. Maybe not. It very hard , sometimes, to see what is truly in a persons Heart. Again, maybe, we really wouldn't want to know.
One thing is for sure, you never have to put money in his pocket again, if you feel that way.
This whole affair saddens me and reminds me how much I'd rather be climbing!
Tony
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 6, 2006 - 11:45am PT
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This is strange. I once saw Crimpie in a cameo appearance ON the show Knight Rider. She had this bird that "disrespected" the car.
As for Mormons and Jews.
The LDS Church ostensibly holds Jews in high regard, but there have been issues.
One of the most noted stories was the now discontinued practice of baptizing deceased holocaust victims into the church.
When I first came here blacks weren't even permitted into the Mormon priesthood. Its nice to see that they've entered the 20th century, if a tad late.
Only this year at Conference the head Mormon cautioned followers against the practice of discrimination, so I don't think it would have seen mention were it not a persistent sore spot.
In my own experience here in Utah virtually every racial slur and antisemitic display I've been exposed to (and there have been many) has been made by members of the Church of Jesus Christ of the Latter Day Saints.
Pretty phucking sad.
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Tarbuster
climber
right here, right now
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i've had too much german beer lately to address this topic with any clarity.
and as dirt daddy well knows, i routinely run laps on these threads, so now his marinol has loosened him up and he thinks i might benefit from nailing some righteous 5.6 while sippin' a tall one.
ok dirt, that's compelling.
now, alcohol loosens inhibitions, which often pulls the lid off whatever's in there, be it smarmy smoozy, aggression or whatever. such is an aspect of the unpredictable nature of the booze hound, or itinerant sloppy rookie drunk alike.
i'm going to my poor man's bouldering pasture and i will not let any notions of knight rider enter my head. nope, gunna shuv that out. block it out. darn crimpster, you are a truble maker.
tarbuster out.
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Crimpergirl
Sport climber
St. Louis
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Tarbuster, I'd sing the Knight Rider theme song here to create an ear worm (I'm a devil aren't I?). However, lucky for all, I have no idea what it sounds like. Maybe after some whiskey it'll come to me....
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JuanDeFuca
Big Wall climber
Stoney Point
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When school is in I hear the word Nigger everyday.
Juan
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JuanDeFuca
Big Wall climber
Stoney Point
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What is a Ear Worm?
Juan
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