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splitter
Trad climber
SoCal Hodad, surfing the galactic plane
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Maybe he should just be required to hug every tree he comes within a hundred feet of for the rest of his life. Or plant trees in deforested areas for the next decade. And if he wins the Nobel Prize for conservation, on Judgement Day will he still be sh#t out of luck? Or, if he becomes a Catholic and confesses to the priest and says 100 Hail Mary's, 50 Acts of Contrition and a dozen or so Our Fathers (plus slip the priest a Benjamin or two) will he avoid Purgatory?
edit: Or, if he moves to Afghanistan or maybe Pakistan, or Boulder Co, and they find out about his dastardly deed and chop off one of his hands, will that make everything okay with the world once again?
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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Trees don't have feelings. Trust me, I've asked them.
And no, I'm not a tree hugger. More of a dirt and rock fondler. Hugging that much wood just doesn't feel right... but whatever makes you happy.
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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wtf Dan, you think I condone cutting down that tree? Pretty clueless aren't you?
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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Dan, I've said over and over that they fuked up and I have never once tried to justify their actions.
That doesn't change the FACT that trees don't have feelings.
There is absolutely NO conflict in those statements.
I fear you have been hanging out with you buddy Rong Anderson too much... or perhaps you share the same affliction in which you insist everything you think reflects reality. Whatever the case, you clearly have no idea where I stand on this issue... but you seem pretty insistent that you do.
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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People have tried to reason with Rong for years. He is impervious to reason. If someone insists on acting like an ignorant fukwad despite the facts, I see no problem in calling them an ignorant fukwad.
But that's all beside the point. No point in you ass-uming I condone cutting the tree simply because you have already formed an ill opinion of me and I don't support lynching Joe.
Ron, I lost interest in you long ago. You bore me. You are an ignorant fukwad.
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Fritz
Trad climber
Choss Creek, ID
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mechrist: Re your assertion:
That doesn't change the FACT that trees don't have feelings.
Trees are living beings, but rather than argue details on that subject:
Many of us have feelings for ancient trees clinging to life at altitude, sacrificed for a new sport-route.
I'm sorry for you: that you don't care about that sort of thing.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de La Playa
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 4, 2013 - 10:12pm PT
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There must be some way out of here.
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NilsDavis
Trad climber
Bishop
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OK so after researching (also thanks mechrist), the Treebeard tree wasn't chopped down.
Dan: good to hear from you. This whole thing is about Cascade Cliff. Strange decision on Kinder's part to remove whole trees, but this whole thing is not black and white and the vitriol his actions have drawn are way over the top.
He publicly apologized and that takes courage. It's an interesting subject this whole "gardening" topic, but not one we as a climbing community can learn from if we aren't civil to one another.
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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mechrist: Re your assertion:
That doesn't change the FACT that trees don't have feelings.
Trees are living beings, but rather than argue details on that subject:
Many of us have feelings for ancient trees clinging to life at altitude, sacrificed for a new sport-route.
I'm sorry for you: that you don't care about that sort of thing.
What is up with you old guys? Seriously, you all gone senile or something?
I don't care about that sort of thing? Get a fuking clue before you start making assertions like that. I've done far more than you can imagine to make the best of this unfortunate incident. What have you done?
And yeah, NEWS FLASH: not all living beings have feelings.
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Fritz
Trad climber
Choss Creek, ID
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OH-Christ-----mechrist: Are you off and spewing?
You are the spew-king of ST when you get going.
Sooooo- you want to supply some details?
Or just spew some more?
What is up with you old guys? Seriously, you all gone senile or something?
I don't care about that sort of thing? Get a fuking clue before you start making assertions like that. I've done far more than you can imagine to make the best of this unfortunate incident. What have you done?
And yeah, NEWS FLASH: not all living beings have feelings.
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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Shitz, I've done my best which is far better than many here have done. And I haven't accused anyone of not caring "about this sort of thing." What have you done to make anything positive come of this situation?
The response on his web-site still attempted to defend his in-defensible cutting of that really old and wonderful tree in a beautiful place.
yeah, gee Shitz, sure sounds like he is trying to defend his actions...
I want to make no mistake that this was a regrettable error on my part. I am deeply apologetic about what I did. I was wrong. I F’d up. And I’m very sorry. (emphasis his)
Maybe you should pull your head out of your ass and spend a minute trying to understand the difference between someone explaining their motives (right or wrong) and someone defending their actions before you accuse them of such.
Only a willfully ignorant fukwad would mistake the following for an attempt to defend his actions:
My Actions, My Responsibility, And My Mistake
I've read every post on the links over the last few days...
Great! Then you should have no problem pointing out where you got the impression I "don't care about this sort of thing." Be specific and feel free to quote me directly... even if it is out of context.
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Todd Eastman
climber
Bellingham, WA
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I want to make no mistake that this was a regrettable error on my part. I am deeply apologetic about what I did. I was wrong. I F’d up. And I’m very sorry.
Anyone can apologize, it's simple...
... now if Mr. Kinder is to actually do actions that mitigate for his destruction of the commons, I might give him an atta-boy, not until then!
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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Todd, you haven't really been paying attention, have you?
Posted 10/22/2013:
We've been in contact with Joe and he truly regrets his act and understands its impact. But as actions speak louder than words, we're encouraged that in addition to paying a fine to the Forest Service, Joe has also decided to donate $1,000 to the Sierra Nevada Alliance, whose mission is to protect and restore the natural resources of the Sierra Nevada for future generations while promoting sustainable communities. Joe will also donate a week of his time to tree planting and other service in Yosemite National Park.
http://www.petzl.com/us/outdoor/news/in-field-0/2013/10/22/response-petzl-athlete-joe-kinders-actions-in-california
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WBraun
climber
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Mechrist -- "NEWS FLASH: not all living beings have feelings."
You're a stupid idiotic cold stone speaking for other living entities .......
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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Pretty dismissive of the feelings and intelligence possessed by the "cold stone" bub.
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Fritz
Trad climber
Choss Creek, ID
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Re-mechrist being the "prince of ST Spewing."
My statement: Trees are living beings, but rather than argue details on that subject:
Many of us have feelings for ancient trees clinging to life at altitude, sacrificed for a new sport-route.
I'm sorry for you: that you don't care about that sort of thing.
His Spew:
Great! Then you should have no problem pointing out where you got the impression I "don't care about this sort of thing." Be specific and feel free to quote me directly... even if it is out of context.
Oh-christ------mechrist.
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Todd Eastman
climber
Bellingham, WA
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Todd, you haven't really been paying attention, have you?
That is what he appears legally obligated to do, what he can do to do clear the air likely demanded form his sponsors, and is what I consider a sleazy out.
His future actions are what matter. The guy screwed up the public property that he makes a living off of without paying fees.
Sorry, it may be Christian to forgive...
... I am not a stinking Christian!
HTFU!!!
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Fritz
Trad climber
Choss Creek, ID
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and why does mechrist hate old guys?
What is up with you old guys? Seriously, you all gone senile or something?
Is he nasty to everyone??
Pets, women, friends (if any) ???------ or is it a problem with his elders-------or his superiors?
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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Todd, paying the Forest Service fee was the only legal obligation.
There was no legal obligation to pay $1,000 to Sierra Nevada Alliance and plant trees for a week.
Apparently that isn't good enough for some... which says more about them than Joe.
I don't trust Christians.
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mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
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again?
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