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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Mar 14, 2013 - 12:01pm PT
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Good stuff Dingus. There's a little bit of almost all of us there.
The part I found interesting was that I'd heard he was "bitter" at the end.
I know he was in front of the cameras, but "bitter" didn't come through in this film.
He was mostly in good spirits and humor. Sure, lots of joking about age and condition, but not "bitter."
I make plenty of comments about age and condition myself, because it's true.
It was a joy to watch.
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jstan
climber
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Mar 14, 2013 - 12:52pm PT
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Thanks Andy.
Brown and Whillans were at the core of the technical rock experience when I first encountered it. They still are. And not just because of heroics. It was because their personalities and minds simply resonated with so many. There still are more Brown and Whillans's around than you can shake a stick at.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Mar 14, 2013 - 01:08pm PT
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Thanks, Andy. That was, yes, poignant but still a joy to watch.
When Don got off his bike I didn't think he'd make it to the climb let alone
up it.
"It's still a bit naughty here." :-) :-)
"Is this a non-smoking stance?" :-/
I met Joe in '78 atop the infamous Red Wall and thought he looked impossibly
old (48! LOL), especially to have just come up one of those chossy horror shows.
Of course, I was too awe struck to mumble little else than
"It's an honour, Your Grace." ;-)
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Mar 14, 2013 - 01:17pm PT
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"It's an honour, Your Grace." ;-)
You did NOT say that, you fecking crawly bumlicker!
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crunch
Social climber
CO
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Mar 14, 2013 - 02:05pm PT
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Great video, thanks. Fun to watch and listen.
Enjoyed reading Jim Perrin's The Villain, which paints a more complex picture. A fascinating follow up to Perrin's "Menlove" about Menlove Edwards, another enigmatic hardman/climber. With Whillans, there was a bitterness. Perrin explored this and refrained from publishing the book until both Don and his widow Audrey were gone.
I've heard about this meanness, anecdotally, from others. Joe Brown, in the video, hints at this; the meanness was directed mostly toward women.
The climbing was, for Don, as for so many of us, a chance to escape our roles and attitudes and demons. You can see he's having a blast. Loving every minute.
Joe learned from his climbing, rose above what he might have been. Don somehow never escaped the hard-drinking, working class role he was born into and was familiar and comfortable with. In some ways this was more honest, sticking to his roots, but also limiting.
Met Don, once. Bought him a pint! Many of those "6 pints a night" were bought by admiring young kids, like I was at the time, happy to listen to his stories, which went on and on, in that funny, droll, squeaky voice and were hilarious.
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AP
Trad climber
Calgary
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Mar 14, 2013 - 02:17pm PT
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Amazing that he could still fit into a harness.
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Banquo
climber
Amerricka
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Mar 14, 2013 - 02:59pm PT
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Whillans was 52, I'm 56. Getting older makes it harder. It's sort of the reverse of what Greg LeMond said about training for bike races: "It never gets easier, you just go faster." Well, aging is more like I go just as hard but not as fast.
It also gets harder to keep fit and the weight in check. In my 20's I weighed about 155, worked hard, played hard and ate and drank as much of anything I wanted. My goal these days is 170 lbs but I can no longer eat and drink with abandon.
DMT - You're doing great. Picture the average 50 something north American male, an ugly site more often than not.
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couchmaster
climber
pdx
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Mar 14, 2013 - 03:41pm PT
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Dingus brings up a good point. I will on occasion, criticize myself for being overweight or out of shape. Out of shape for me means huffing on a steep 6 mile hike with over 2000 feet of elevation gain. My wife, a nurse, just laughs at it. Says that I'm running in the top 10% for my age group from what she sees. Unfortunately, if you are hanging with climbers, a comparison to them can make you feel weak and old. Some of the folks I climb with could be my kids, in fact, some are younger than my kids. If we look at what brought Willians down, smoking, alcoholism, and poor eating choices, we can see a better path. We've seen it with others who miss out on a lot of years due to getting addicted to booze of one sort or another. Looking at Beckey, Donini Lowe and Chouinard (lots of others in that mold) as models might be more appropriate, and from the outside it looks like plenty of getting out, and food and booze in moderation is the way to be.
Good luck Dingus!
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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Mar 14, 2013 - 03:47pm PT
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Thanks, DMT. Whillans did quite a bit of climbing while "grossly overweight because of his prodigious intake of beer," to quote Mountain magazine. Right now, I'm grossly overweight because of my prodigious intake of chocolate (and because of a nine-month layoff to recover from injury), so we'll see if my ability to rebound at age 61 is what it was earlier.
Tom Patey wrote my personal favorite account of Don Whillans in One Man's Mountains. He has a chapter entitled "A Short Walk with Whillans," the "short walk" being to the Second Icefield on the Eigerwand. To me, he perfectly captures the Whillans persona.
John
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eeyonkee
Trad climber
Golden, CO
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Mar 14, 2013 - 05:11pm PT
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What a great find! I love that British understatement.
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Marlow
Sport climber
OSLO
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Mar 14, 2013 - 05:24pm PT
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Great video. Joe Brown is in excellent shape, climbing with confidence.
The wit and the mockery is a constant.
Don taking off his helmet. Joe: The helmet, is it protecting your head or the cig?
Interviewer: What does it take to be a good team?
Don: Confidence...
... you don't have to like each other...
They have been talking about imagination. The rope is on the ground close to their feet. Don: I can't imagine the end of the rope down there.
Joe: "The rope's not coming, are you standing on it?"
Don: "Yeah,...
... do you want me to get off it?"
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
Panorama City, California & living in Seattle
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Mar 14, 2013 - 07:53pm PT
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That was pretty darn fun.
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Largo
Sport climber
The Big Wide Open Face
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Mar 14, 2013 - 08:25pm PT
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Great stuff. That hanging belay off mank was something.
JL
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Mar 14, 2013 - 09:40pm PT
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His last climb at 52, what a shame. He was so naturally gifted and so personally conflicted. Genetics, lifestyle, luck....and the only one you can control is lifestyle. Don's lifestyle was so over the top wrong as to appear self destructive.
Being a drunk in your 20's is accepted....hell, he's the life of the party. In your 30's the occasional eyebrow is raised but hell, he's still the life of the party. In your 40's and 50's people start avoiding you. Your 60's.....no problem, you're no longer around.
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SCseagoat
Trad climber
Santa Cruz
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Mar 14, 2013 - 10:08pm PT
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Your 60's.....no problem, you're no longer around. ...and the only one you can control is lifestyle Cuts to the chase!
Susan
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Peter Haan
Trad climber
Santa Cruz, CA
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Mar 14, 2013 - 10:17pm PT
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A very wonderful later shot of Joe up on Llanberis Pass, with Cenotaph and Cemetery Gates in the background, long after Whillans has passed and their last climb together but a memory. Joe is 82 now. The image must be fairly recent, by Ray Wood.
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Andy Fielding
Trad climber
UK
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 14, 2013 - 10:27pm PT
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The image must be fairly recent, by Ray Wood.
Peter according to www.snowdonia-active.com the picture is credited as being taken by Ray Wood just before Joe's 80th birthday in 2010.
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Mar 14, 2013 - 10:29pm PT
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I'll bet he's still flyfishing for salmon.
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Peter Haan
Trad climber
Santa Cruz, CA
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Mar 14, 2013 - 10:35pm PT
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Yeah, I bet too, Jim. What a terrific classy man he is and so different than Don, so much freer.
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John Morton
climber
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Mar 14, 2013 - 11:00pm PT
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Thanks Andy, what a treat! Great to let the rock and the people speak for themselves without the relentless pounding music of the typical climbing vid. Did this route in Apr. 1965, and remember it mostly as being vastly more friendly and less scary than Cenotaph Corner.
John
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