Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
goatboy smellz
climber
Nederland
|
|
|
Oct 26, 2011 - 09:22pm PT
|
You guys should petition the Smithsonian for future space and statues, this could be big.
|
|
Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - Oct 27, 2011 - 12:09am PT
|
Showing my ignorance: how do we request supertopo do a little lead in encouragement for route reflections as part of the beta section? Maybe just forward this thread link to whomever and request it? Karl, I gather you don’t want to fiddle with the registry notion forever, but would you mind making the contact and request since you birthed the whole registry notion way back when?
I'm away from the net for some time. Somebody else raise their hand and be the hero... we can all do a piece of this and encourage FA folks to write up their routes just a bit, even if it's just to comment their hemorrhoids were flaring on lead.
PEace
Karl
|
|
LongAgo
Trad climber
|
|
Karl,
OK, I just wrote Chris McNamara and asked him about adding some lingo to supertopo route beta/history section encouraging FA teams to add notes along the lines of this thread. We'll see.
LongAgo
|
|
donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
|
|
What about a "bold statement" that is not bold? I refer to extremely good climbers who put in moderate climbs sans protection which they don't actually need. Is such a climb to be left out of reach for the very climbers it is more suited for?
|
|
Rhodo-Router
Gym climber
the secret topout on the Chockstone Chimney
|
|
Whoa! donini suddenly represents for the n00bs!
I better check the noaa site- think hell just froze over.
|
|
LongAgo
Trad climber
|
|
donini,
The idea to the registry reflections is to get what one can from FA teams on not just where the route went and how hard, but perspectives and rationales for lots or little or in-between protection style, especially where bolts are involved but natural pro or lack thereof too. One would hope the case you raise would be included along with opposite cases and a full range of cases. However, as Karl found long ago when he first raised the registry idea on rockclimbing.com, the idea of asking for such reflections on any climbing site with route descriptions raises some temperatures; and in any case, the request may or may not bring useful or interesting revelations. But, seems to me, worth the try. What’s your view on that point?
Tom Higgins
LongAgo
|
|
Mungeclimber
Trad climber
sorry, just posting out loud.
|
|
What about a "bold statement" that is not bold? I refer to extremely good climbers who put in moderate climbs sans protection which they don't actually need. Is such a climb to be left out of reach for the very climbers it is more suited for?
Donini, I'd go on to ask you to define what is moderate, and what is an extremely good climber?
I only climb 5.8+, but I've been know to put in routes that were not sport climbs.
Doesn't address the OP idea, but I think clarifies the difference between capturing an ascent and the intent of an ascent.
well, maybe it does.
|
|
Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - Nov 17, 2011 - 04:41pm PT
|
Bolts or non-bolts or whatever, there is a basic fact that this sport has a vast recent history which can still be recorded while the players are still alive.
I think it's important to get a perspective, not only from the big prominent players who write bold tales for magazines but for the countless little and varied routes. What funny things happened? What were their motives and ideas?
You know, like getting the people's history of how they lived instead of just who won what war and who ruled the Goths and so on.
It's a rare opportunity to have sport/activity so new that it's evolution and history can still be somewhat captured
Peace
Karl
|
|
kev
climber
A pile of dirt.
|
|
|
Nov 17, 2011 - 04:45pm PT
|
the intent of an ascent
usually is to drink beer on the fa, try not to put many bolts in but don't have something that would kill anyone, and above all have lots of fun! OR at least it is for me...
|
|
Nate D
climber
San Francisco
|
|
|
Nov 18, 2011 - 10:05am PT
|
Kev, boy are you doing it all wrong. Fun? Whatever...
Just bumping relevance. :)
|
|
kev
climber
A pile of dirt.
|
|
|
Nov 18, 2011 - 12:53pm PT
|
Ahhh, now I get where I've been going wrong Nate - too much fun :)
|
|
donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
|
|
|
Nov 18, 2011 - 01:19pm PT
|
The "intent" of most climbers who are establishing first ascents is to complete the route with the means at hand. All of my first ascents in Yosemite were done prior to 1978 and therefore were done without cams. Overhang Overpass is quite a different climb depending on whether one uses cams or not. I didn't, because cams were not in existence, necessitating a 50ft. runout. That same climb done today with cams is notable only for it's quality and relative difficulty. It was not my "intent" to put myself in harms way but circumstances (protection devices available) led to just that. If someone does the climb today, putting cams in every body length, are they being historically consistent with the climb as it was done on the first ascent?
I realize that climbs with an established amount of fixed gear (bolts) such as the Bachar/Yerian present a thornier problem for some. It is mentioned here about climbing 300 years from now. Don't you suppose that by that time removable protection devices, unknown today, will allow for asents of the Bachar/Yerian that are a far cry from John's experience?
Where, oh where, do we draw the line? And what is the difference between intent and necessity. Lastly, how long are climbers going to respect the style of the first ascent given
the forward march of technology?
|
|
Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - Nov 18, 2011 - 04:34pm PT
|
interestingly enough, the practice of towing on to big waves in the surfing world was controversial because many of the Old skool guys were offended.
The First Ascender Registry isn't about retro-bolting but getting the history and flavor of the area and routes. I guarantee you that if that doesn't happen, then 70 years from now, when you're dead, younger generations raised on gym and sport are going to get sick of hundreds of run-out routes and take matter in their own hands.
But of course the FA situation matters. Originally the last anchor on Sunshine on Drug Dome just had one bolt (I think he ran out or broke bits) Of course it matters if that was intentionally bold or just an emergency measure.
Peace
karl
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!