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Jo Jo
Mountain climber
Lacey, WA
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Aug 10, 2012 - 06:03pm PT
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Seamstress,
Thank you for your kind words. Jay and I are still trying to grapple with putting names to rescuers and faces to those we met at the Visitor Center and down at Longmire afterward. So, thank you for the revealing perspective of your involvement in our rescue. We were pretty much in a daze when we got down off Rainier that day. We are truly thankful to all of you who gave of your time and energies over those long weeks in January to spend so much time on the mountain searchng for the lost and weary. It is overwhelming for me to read your description of the terrain and weather . . . Jay and I were obviously in the thick of all of it but really weren't so much focused on snow depth, temperatures, visibility, as we were simply trying to stay warm so we wouldn't die! To read your account of the mindblowing difficulties the rescuers were having on the mountain, only confirms to me that Jay and I did the right thing in digging in and trying to conserve our energies. I got home that night, cried non-stop at the kitchen faucet when I saw running water; and then again as I sat in a bath full of hot water and bubbles with my beanie and headlamp still on, in the pitch dark . . . I'd come home to an electrical outage in my neighborhood!!! The next day I spent all morning digging out my driveway with a garden shovel (it took me four hours) . . . and cried again in the middle of the street as the true meaning of the outcome of the previous few days hit me like a ton of bricks. I was alive, and despite the blisters on my hands from shoveling snow, I was glad I could feel every single one of them. It sure beats the alternative. And, I cried again this week as I hugged one of Michelle Trojanowki's friends . . . it has been a tough week.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 10, 2012 - 06:17pm PT
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hey there say, jo jo...
oh my, as to that quote... some of us know this feeeling, though from other things...
hugs again... thankfulness, real thankfulness will never cease...
hugs again...
I got home that night, cried non-stop at the kitchen faucet when I saw running water; and then again as I sat in a bath full of hot water and bubbles with my beanie and headlamp still on, in the pitch dark . . . I'd come home to an electrical outage in my neighborhood!!! The next day I spent all morning digging out my driveway with a garden shovel (it took me four hours) . . . and cried again in the middle of the street as the true meaning of the outcome of the previous few days hit me like a ton of bricks. I was alive, and despite the blisters on my hands from shoveling snow, I was glad I could feel every single one of them
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Jo Jo
Mountain climber
Lacey, WA
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Aug 10, 2012 - 06:21pm PT
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Riley . . . thanks for your comments and for the link. I will have to read the book. I am sure I will be able to relate to some of it. How very sad. To lose a loved one is difficult, but to lose a child is somehow incomprehensible to me.
Studly . . . yes, you are right about how easy it is to get lost in a white out. Many times my climbing buddy, Mariana, and I have descended from Camp Muir in visibility that limits us from walking together between the wands for fear of getting lost. She'll walk alone toward where she thinks the next wand is located and just as she starts to disappear in the distance, I yell out for her to stop -- I won't go another foot before she says she can see the next wand. That's a navigation technique I've learned on the Muir Snowfield. However, we aren't always that lucky. Inevitably, we defer to GPS.
Climbski2 . . . sticking it out for 30 hours in freezing snowcaves without a sleeping bag or stove was cold and, as you put it, "a boring annoyance," but I knew it was the only choice and it inevitably saved our lives. Thanks for the thumbs up. I can't tell you how good the leather heated seats of my boyfriend's truck felt when we hit the road.
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Psilocyborg
climber
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Aug 10, 2012 - 06:22pm PT
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{edit} telling a completely off topic funny story about navigation in a thread like this is bad form. I apologize.
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Seamstress
Trad climber
Yacolt, WA
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Aug 10, 2012 - 07:49pm PT
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We rarely get to connect with someone that we have helped later. We are always so curious about what happened to them, and what we could have done better. There was a lot of debriefing afterwards, largely because it was such a large operation with people from so many different teams.
We all wish that the outcome was the same for the missing four on the snowfield. We headed home very late that night after the three snowshoers - including JoJo - came out. The bags stayed packed for the inevitable call to return to look for the others came. The planning was well underway for that.
JoJo, you absolutely did the right thing, to dig in by night. By now, I'm sure you have read up on all the info available about emergency snow shelters. You put on a very brave face publicly. I certainly didn't see any foreshadowing of the tears that came to you later. You were focused on what you needed to do to get out. I gave you some charcoal handwarmers, and we offered you whatever we had. I've brought a lot of people off mountains that were out for a few hours that were in far worse shape than you were. That release after you get home - that's perfectly normal. Your compulsion to always take a few extra layers - that was very smart and fortuitous as well. You have good survival instincts.
Lots of people will offer criticism as they are sitting on the couch, engaged in all sort of life shortening activities, feeling quite self-righteous about their wisdom. Don't let them make you feel like a fool. You were far from foolish.
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WBraun
climber
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Aug 10, 2012 - 07:53pm PT
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sitting on the couch, engaged in all sort of life shortening activities,
The couch and the remote is the reservoir of all material pleasures .......
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Aug 10, 2012 - 08:14pm PT
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JoJo,since my best years are long
behind me I doubt that I will have
the pleasure of trying to read a GPS
in a blizzard. They can be frustrating
enough in bright sunshine! Maybe somebody
needs to develop a bag to put it in which
you could put your head and hands in
with a drawstring to 'weatherproof' it?
You do seem to have made enough good
decisions so the only question that I
would respectfully put to you is:
"Do you believe you should have dug in
earlier?"
Being a passed master of bad decisions
I have studied the subject quite extensively
from a seafarer's, mountaineer's,and pilot's
perspective. When to say when is the age-old
question, isn't it?
Glad you're still with us!
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Jo Jo
Mountain climber
Lacey, WA
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Aug 10, 2012 - 09:32pm PT
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Seamstress,
Again, thank you so much for the further insight into the rescue from a rescuers perspective. There was a lot of criticism of Jay and I after we returned to "the lowlands." I took it all in good heart. Those who were criticizing merely didn't understand what it was all about. Many hadn't read the story correctly and didn't realize that Jay and I had walked out on our own. Many also didn't realize that we had overpacked for a three-hour hike and if it wasn't for that preparation, we would most certainly have died. We didn't incur any rescue dollars and, even if we had, I look at it as a benefit to those of us who make tracks on mountains instead of roads. It was the ignorant that criticized and I didn't pay it much mind. What gave me great inspiration and conviction that I had done the right thing, was the thumbs up from the NPS and the rescue teams. If I had been scorned by the elite group of adventurers I so admire on that mountain, that would probably have destroyed me. My absolute support goes out to all of you as you continue with your search and rescue attempts. I only wish I could have been of more support myself.
I hope I can catch up with you one day personally -- it would really do me a lot of good to fill in some of the holes . . . actually, there are many of them . . . including how the Korean group managed to find their way off the mountain that day. Oh well, perhaps our paths will cross some day -- I'm up on Rainier often.
If I can inspire any readers right now about my ordeal, it would be to simply stay calm, believe in yourself, conserve your energy, and think positive thoughts. Oh, and don't forget to practice fasting every now and again -- it was really helpful to know that I don't physically fall apart if I miss a daily meal. Jay and I often skip meals . . . we know we can endure long periods of time without eating . . . so that never really was a fear factor for us. And, we both know that fear can kill.
Thanks!
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Jo Jo
Mountain climber
Lacey, WA
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Aug 10, 2012 - 09:38pm PT
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Reilly, I'm happy to answer your question about the possibility of digging in earlier. If you want to hear/read the whole story about Jay and I up on the mountain last MLK weekend, simply type our names: Josephine Johnson and Jim Dickman . . . the many sites will pop up. But, in a nutshell . . . we climbed just over an hour from Paradise up onto the Mazama Ridge. It was snowing but not a blizzard. When we reached the ridge and wandered up onto it another five minutes, we knew we were going to be in serious trouble if we didn't turn around as the winds had picked up to around 70mph in just seconds; visibility dropped to almost zero; and the temperature dropped suddenly. I could hardly open my pack to get out extra clothing and goggles. We tried for about 2 hours to get down off the ridge but couldn't find our way. It was 2:00pm when Jay started to dig the snow cave. It took about 2 hours. We were able to crawl into it at 4:00pm and that's where we stayed until 7:20am the next day. So, we pretty much thought we'd be able to find our way off the ridge but realized quickly enough that if we didn't dig in straight away, we'd be digging in the dark, so that's why we started digging at 2pm -- it was getting dark around 5pm at that time of the year. I think we did the right thing . . . I hope we did . . . I guess we did . . . I'm alive to tell you about it :)
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Aug 10, 2012 - 11:00pm PT
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JoJo, I'd say you absolutely made the right call.
So I guess you got frostbit fumbling around with the GPS?
This is how bright I was - standing on Liberty Cap
in late January watching the sun go down.
Temp - +/- 0
Wind speed 30, gusting higher, much higher
Minimal bivy gear. What's the way down?
Liberty Ridge, of course! It's the most
direct plus it is actually quite sheltered
from the prevailing wind. ;-)
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Jo Jo
Mountain climber
Lacey, WA
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Aug 11, 2012 - 11:12am PT
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Reilly. Jay got frostbite on his fingers from getting his gloves wet while digging, not one but TWO snow caves. He didn't tell me, so I wasn't able to share my extra gloves with him (I ended up needing them anyway . . . so I guess Jay just didn't want to impact my comfort -- being a great boyfriend :) and climbing buddy). Anyway, I didn't realize how bad the situation was until he asked for extra gloves when we bumped into the rescue team on the third day. I felt bad. As for his toes, they got frostbite because he didn't remove his boots at night. Boots are only warm when you are actually moving -- generating warmth that is then captured inside. When you are sitting for 15 hours in a snow cave and leave your boots on, they get colder and colder and colder . . . they don't do much good. I pulled mine off and put on an extra layer of socks and then pulled my feet into a stuff sack (like a potato sack race). The stuff sack was one of those pillow stuff sacks that, when turned inside out, has a fleece layer so you can use it as a pillow. I didn't turn it inside out, but stuffed my feet into it with the fleece layer on the inside -- it kept my feet from freezing. I had to sit on Jay's feet (after he finally removed his boots) to warm up his toes. I hate to think what might have happened if I hadn't done that. Fortunately, he hasn't lost any digits . . . but the recovery was slow. His fingers and toes are now more susceptible to cold and we have to watch this carefully when we are hiking.
As for your experience on Liberty Ridge . . . that's a pretty scary situation. My friend, Rob Planker, died on Liberty Ridge a couple of seasons ago. He was with a couple of friends and for some unknown reason became hypothermic about 1,000 feet below the summit. His friends ended up summiting, continuing over to the other side of the mountain to get a rescue party together, but when they returned, it appeared that Rob had left his tent and slid 2,000 feet off the mountain. His body has not been recovered. The mountain does not discriminate -- she takes whoever she wants, be they inexperienced or not.
You were lucky. I was lucky . . .
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Aug 11, 2012 - 11:55am PT
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I disagree about taking boots off.
They are going to provide some degre
of insulation no matter what. They
just need to be loosened. If you take
them off then you run the risk of the
boots freezing up-then you're worse off.
For the record I almost always kept mine
in the bag with me. I realize that wasn't
an option for you but it always served
me well. Sleeping was awkward but I always
had toasty boots to put on in the morning.
ps
Gotta go-my nurse is here with a big-azzed needle!
Don't get old-it blows! ;-)
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Michelle Mair
Social climber
valencia california
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Aug 11, 2012 - 12:27pm PT
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This goes out to JO JO. The missing body found was my brother Mark Vucich. I thank you for trying to look for him and Michelle. I can't believe my brother is gone. It's hard to understand what happened and why but I appreciate you never giving up looking for them. I heard how bad the conditions were but just never really understood. How could a storm take someones life....
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wbw
Trad climber
'cross the great divide
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Aug 11, 2012 - 12:46pm PT
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Knowing how to use the GPS would be important. But it would not be in the least helpful if a person does not have the mental strength to stay calm in a situation where making a few basic decisions, such as building a snow shelter, would truly be life saving. I know folks that spend their weekends practicing the gadgets, but would panic in a situation such as the one in this thread. Much respect to Jo Jo and her friend for having the strength to make calm, life saving decisions.
Condolences to all involved, and to the friends and families. Sounds like one horrendous storm.
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phylp
Trad climber
Millbrae, CA
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Aug 11, 2012 - 01:06pm PT
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joJo, thanks so much for all this detail. It's such valuable information.
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Jo Jo
Mountain climber
Lacey, WA
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Aug 11, 2012 - 01:19pm PT
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Michelle,
I never gave up searching on my many climbs up to Muir since January. I am so sorry you have lost a brother. From all that I have read, he was a wonderful person. I have five brothers and could never imagine what it would be like to lose any one of them. I still don't understand how Jay and I survived that wretched storm. It indiscriminately took Mark's life, yet I was overlooked. I don't know why as I am sure Mark and Michelle were well-prepared and had good decision-making experience. I was absolutely heart-broken as each and every attempt for the rescuers to get up there on the Muir Snowfield the week after MLK were thwarted by the ongoing weather.
If it gives you any consolation, Michelle . . . although the mountain can be a terrible monster at times, it has a beautiful calm to it that somehow brings peace even in the worst conditions. I did not suffer too terribly while trapped for three days . . . it was the waiting that took its toll on us. Not knowing when the conditions would subside so we could get out of the snow cave and make an attempt to find our way down. All I wanted to do was keep moving to keep warm . . . I am sure Mark and Michelle felt the same way.
Have you visited Mt. Rainier? It is beautiful. Pebble Creek is the first major stop after leaving Paradise . . . it provides water for those who wish to filter as well as beautiful views. Your brother's resting place the last six months has been filled with beauty and awe. I hope you visit some time.
My warmest regards to you and your family. I hope they find Michelle close by.
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Jo Jo
Mountain climber
Lacey, WA
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Aug 11, 2012 - 01:27pm PT
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Phylp. Thanks. I've been searching for an outlet for how I've been feeling the past six months. I can't talk to non-climbers about this stuff -- they just don't understand and I don't expect them to. I have felt that there has been a reason for my survival . . . perhaps this is it? Sharing the experience so others can learn. Inspiration is part of it . . . but education is what I have strived to share. It has been so difficult to put into words but climbers and mountaineers know how to ask the right questions. This has been a great forum for sharing, so my thanks to all of the readers who have supplied input.
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Bargainhunter
climber
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Aug 11, 2012 - 01:30pm PT
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This is a sobering thread and I appreciate very much the posts of those who were personally involved and affected.
Whiteouts up there are a serious matter. My beginner anecdotes are trivial in comparison to what has been described above, but I felt compelled to post.
My first trip up Rainier about 20 years ago, I hiked up the Kautz route and descended a variant near the DC / Furhrer Finger. My partner had less than 24 hours off, so we did it in about 15 hours RT or so with a long nap somewhere on the way up. Between us we decided to be safe and take a light single wall tent and a single sleeping bag. On the descent, hammered by fatigued and altitude, we got stuck in a whiteout…there was no obvious trough nor climber’s trail to follow down, and we had to pause a while to get our bearings. I was SO glad we had shelter and a sleeping bag. I would have panicked if we hadn’t had that bivy gear as it really gave me peace of mind; I can’t imagine what it would have been like for us to descend blindly through unknown territory.
I had run into similar whiteouts descending Mt. Baker from the Coleman headwall, skiing the Shuksan Arm, and alone on a day hike of Glacier Peak; they all gave me serious pause. Later, a forced bivy on a glacier on Mt Formidable without gear sobered me enough to realize how thin the margin of survival could get.
Later that season, I spent a cold July 4th alone above Camp Sherman in a windy storm. To clarify, I was cold in my sleeping bag (this was the same sleeping bag that I took on Denali in June 2000 by the way!), in a tent, during the day, in a summertime storm, at a low elevation on Rainier. I can’t imagine being in a snow cave on Rainer in winter for 3 days with no bivy gear (much less Denali or K2). Must have been terrifying. I doubt my skinny ass would have made it.
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Jo Jo
Mountain climber
Lacey, WA
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Aug 11, 2012 - 01:31pm PT
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Reilly,
I can understand you hesitancy to want to take boots off in this kind of a situation. I usually would do the same thing but I was only on a three-hour snowshoe, ascending less than 1,000 feet above Paradise, and wasn't wearing my Spantik mountaineering boots with the liners and sub-zero temperature guarantee. I had a pair of Asolo day-boots that, even with the untightening of the laces, still got colder and colder. They were wet -- so provided not such great insulation. When I took them off and put on extra socks and put my feet in the stuff bag, my feet immediately got warmer. If I had been wearing Spantik mountaineering boots, I would certainly have left them on -- they keep my feet toasty-warm whether I am moving or not.
PS: Hope the needle didn't hurt too much????
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Jo Jo
Mountain climber
Lacey, WA
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Aug 11, 2012 - 01:48pm PT
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Bargainhunter . . . it WAS terrifying but, more than that, it was just UNBELIEVABLE . . . that I was within sight of home plate but couldn't get home. Having fallen off that icefall the second day and losing my snowshoe had me convinced that I would need to summon every bit of energy I had to get out of the situation on Monday. I still don't know how I did it . . . the climb out without water (it had frozen late afternoon on Saturday and we couldn't thaw it under our layers of clothing) and snow up to my hips, and on one snow shoe was a real push. I am only 110 lb and 5' nothing . . . without much sleep on the floors of ice caves for over 30 hours, I had to keep thinking positively. If it is any consolation -- moving was what kept me going. Leaving that wretched snow cave on Monday morning and moving was the best therapy. I was so glad to be doing that, even though I felt terrible. When we finally crested the Mazama Ridge later that morning, I was too scared to look back down in case I lost my balance and fell. Jay and I don't hike without a bivvy and stove now . . . even if it is on a small day hike. We've learned our lesson . . . but what I really learned was that if you truly have the desire to keep going and mother nature gives you that opportunity, if only for a little while, then go for it . . . and don't look back.
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