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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Aug 28, 2010 - 09:59pm PT
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Just make sure the sign is bilingual.
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apogee
climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 28, 2010 - 10:26pm PT
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I was hoping a(nother) local would chime in- thanks for the word, x15.
The graffiti does look like it's been there a while- it appears somewhat faded and a bit worn- but if it really has been around for some time, it's probably not going to be wearing away anytime soon.
I'm still motivated to figure out a way to eradicate it- it just bugs the sh#t outta me knowing that kind of urban blight has found it's way to one of my favorite crags. If it's been there for some time, it may be tough to remove; on the other hand, since it's granite, maybe it will respond well. Sadly, what is learned in this process might come in handy on some of the other tagging sites around Idyllwild.
If this has been around a while, the sign idea might be pointless- it would seem that if that site was the first in a wave of similar attacks, we would have seen more on Tahquitz or Suicide since then. (Thusfar, 'frontcountry' boulders have been victimized most frequently around here.) Perhaps it's better to remove the Tahquitz graffiti, and in the event more shows up, go on the offense.
Hearing others thoughts would be helpful on this one.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Aug 28, 2010 - 10:42pm PT
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It's been there for at least five years and has faded quite a bit.
Any chemical removal process would probably do more harm than good.
Mechanical removal would just leave a more permanent etching of the words in the stone.
Sad, but probably the best option is to just continue to let it fade.
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apogee
climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 28, 2010 - 11:21pm PT
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Five years??!! I can't believe it hasn't been noticed enough to raise a stink in one climber circle or another. I spend a lot of time on that side of the crag- can't believe I haven't noticed it, either.
Still, 'this aggression cannot stand' (The Dude). Given how far out there it is, I doubt that erasing it is going to spur a one-upsmanship reaction from another tagger. Removing it is worth a try- perhaps test one method vs. another before going after it. Making no attempt to remove it and knowing it is there just sickens me.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Aug 28, 2010 - 11:27pm PT
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Sickens me every time I see it and one up-man-ship is not an issue given the generally short non incarcerated life span of cholos.
Still, any hasty removal attempt could end up doing far more harm than good.
One thing that did occur to me,
Does anyone know how to accelerate the growth of lichen?
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apogee
climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 28, 2010 - 11:33pm PT
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"Does anyone know how to accelerate the growth of lichen? "
The massive amount of fertilizer that sprays from the orifices of Palin & Beck might do the trick. On the other hand, it might decimate the area.
Ooops....polititard thread drift. My bad.
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jstan
climber
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Aug 28, 2010 - 11:51pm PT
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Improving lichen growth
Lichen in the Gunks has been greatly reduced because the rain there has been getting steadily more acidic. The same has to be happening there to the east of LA. So possibly an experiment involving adjustment of pH would be useful.
Not climbing on the rock is also beneficial,
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Aug 28, 2010 - 11:57pm PT
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All this stuff is at the base and not near any climbs. The rocks do get a lot of sun and not much water to speak of so getting lichen to grow Ain't happen-in.
Still, it would be really easy to do far more damage with a poor removal plan.
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apogee
climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 29, 2010 - 12:23am PT
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I'm more hesitant to use a chemical treatment (even RemovAll 320, which is supposed to be fairly 'green') than to try a mechanical method like wire brushing. Though it risks leaving some rock scarring and 'ghosting', it is granite which is pretty tough. Personally, TGT, I'd rather see the 'ghosting' from a wire brush attempt than to leave that blemish there for years to come with the hopes that it will fade.
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Gabe
climber
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Aug 29, 2010 - 04:01am PT
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We're all watching and waiting for you.... who is SMS and V. CAMPO? did you really sign your name genius?
edited so that level heads may prevail........
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Watusi
Social climber
Newport, OR
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Aug 29, 2010 - 05:59am PT
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Thanx so much Apogee for doing your best to keep the real still real...And to my super old time mate BH for putting his input on this! It's just sad...
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Lucke
Trad climber
Claremont, CA
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Aug 31, 2010 - 02:52pm PT
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I have been in contact with the Access Fund about this problem and one suggestion for the graffiti problem and the trash/scat problem mentioned in another thread is to put up "Tread Lightly" signs/posters which they are preparing. While this may not be as satisfying as threatening the graffiti punks it should have more effect.
The bigger problem it raises is who can speak and act for Tahquitz and Suicide? I'd like to see a climbers association formed to provide stewardship for this climbing area. Is there anyone out there who would like to join up?
I am trying to arrange an Adopt-a-Crag day in October to work on the trail that leads from Lunch Rock around the west side of Tahquitz. Are you interested?
Jim
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apogee
climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 31, 2010 - 03:04pm PT
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I've considered some kind of association to benefit the climbing areas of the San Jacinto mountains as well- I've wondered how much interest there would be in the local climbing community to help support it in the way of membership. I am currently a board member with another climbing advocacy group and have some experience in operating such an organization, and I'm also keenly aware of how challenging it can be to keep it moving effectively.
Though I would imagine there would be quite a few who would support such an organization, I would guess there would also be those who would rather not see something like this for one reason or another. I would be curious to hear opinions on such a formation, no matter what the position.
Re: Lunch Rock project
Possibly interested, though I'm pretty buried with an event in that month for the advocacy group I work with. Float the dates and I'll see if I can make it work.
RE: the OP
I received word from Bob Gaines the other day that corroborates BH & x15's observation that that graffiti has been there for years. Though I've been in that area many-a-time since then, I'm embarassed to say I only recently noticed it! Still, now that I know it's there, I'm inclined to do something to remove it. The beta that has been posted thusfar has been very helpful- keep it comin'.
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Feb 18, 2011 - 01:29am PT
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Can anyone advise as to where to get Removall, of the type suitable for removing paint from rock? Oddly, the company which made it was called Napier Environmental Technologies, and based near Vancouver. But they seem to have been sold to a South African firm called Free World Coatings. I haven't had much luck trying to contact either via the web address provided, or just buying the stuff online.
If no one knows where Removall is available, how about some similar product? That is, some more or less environmentally friendly product that one can use to remove paint from rock. Slather it on, wait a while, brush and rinse. Or something like that.
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Josh Higgins
Trad climber
San Diego
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Feb 18, 2011 - 01:44am PT
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I use tagginator. Here's an example of the work we did with it a two weekends ago:
http://pullharder.org/2011/02/10/mt-woodson-paint-removal/
It takes the paint off with no damage to the rock. It's a base, so it's corrosive, but I think that gets buffered out by the earth and doesn't persist as long as organic solvents. It's advertised as "environmentally friendly."
If you're in SD, I could see if you could borrow from the Allied Climbers of San Diego's stock pile.
It requires scrubbing, multiple applications, and a rinse off with water (which can be hard to hike to the base). If you're interested in more information, please let me know.
Josh
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Feb 18, 2011 - 12:49pm PT
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Thanks - I'll see whether I hear anything back from either company. If not, maybe I'll look into Tagginator. Vancouver is a big enough place that there's bound to be something suitable available here.
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H
Mountain climber
there and back again
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Feb 18, 2011 - 02:41pm PT
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Anders,
Our club has done two grafitti removal days. I emailed my buddy for the name of the stuff. Its made in Germany and is non toxic. We had to go through a bunch of hoops because it was a State Park. It worked well on Schist but not so great on Tuff. I think he trick is ti let it sit a while
I'll PM you when I get word back.
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Feb 18, 2011 - 04:53pm PT
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Thanks, all! The context is that the graffiti is often 30 to 60 minutes hike from the nearest road, and there is no water or power available. So, short of industrial level work, all I've got is what I can carry. The remover product, 30 - 40 litres of water, soft brushes, and so on. Pressure washing, and 'blasting' with corn or anything else, aren't likely options.
The rock is granitic, though, and time not an issue. No problem to apply the product, give it some time, wash and brush off, reapply, and so on. Particularly as some of the graffiti is painted rather than sprayed.
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