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brotherbbock
Trad climber
Alta Loma, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 10, 2010 - 11:14pm PT
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Wow Tom.... crazy you sold it that fast.
It's weird that the hand strap was an after market thing also, who would add it on then sell it as is???
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Fritz
Trad climber
Hagerman, ID
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Aug 11, 2010 - 06:58pm PT
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Re Dee ee's Piolet photo: I agree with Brunosafari that the middle notch in the pick was not a production feature, but was added later by someone.
Below is photo of my 1973 vintage Piolet. It is bamboo shaft.
The grain pattern is pretty similar on Dee ee's axe and mine. The Chouinard 1972 catalog only mentions laminated bamboo shafts.
Bamboo??? Or is Dee ee's one of the near-legendary early hickory shafts?
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Tom
Big Wall climber
San Luis Obispo CA
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Aug 12, 2010 - 01:39am PT
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There was some sort of "Rexilon" shaft for the piolets right around the time of the laminated bamboo. I can't remember what that was, only the name.
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karabin museum
Trad climber
phoenix, az
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Aug 12, 2010 - 12:36pm PT
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Brotherbbock, sweet Chouinard/Frost ice axe and in great condition. In Spring 1974 Chouinard added the set of teeth nearer to the shaft. So if your Piolet has two sets of teeth it is no older than spring 1974. The 1972 catalog shows teeth only at the tip. The 1973 supplement catalog shows teeth only at the tip. The spring 1974 Great Pacific Ironworks News catalog shows the teeth by the shaft and at the tip. The 1974 news catalog states "Also new is an extra set of teeth on the pick next to the shaft for climbing waterfalls........"This statement is also stated in the 1975 catalog. This axe 5 years ago was going for $500.00 to $750.00 on ebay. These days it averages $250.00. I suggest you hang it on your wall for a few years before selling it. I don't think the leash pin on the shaft was put there by Chouinard.
Rock on! Marty
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dee ee
Mountain climber
citizen of planet Earth
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Aug 12, 2010 - 05:07pm PT
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I added the notch with the intention of going all the way to the original teeth. I decided it might compromise the pick and stopped, plus, it was VERY hard steel.
I believe it is bamboo.
If Fritz's is '73 mine must be older.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Aug 12, 2010 - 05:10pm PT
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Some lucky Rooskie now owns this one unless he had to pawn it to pay
the heating bill. Why was I so soft-hearted?
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GhoulweJ
Trad climber
Sacramento, CA
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Aug 12, 2010 - 07:24pm PT
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I'll give $100 cash for it
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Tom
Big Wall climber
San Luis Obispo CA
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Aug 12, 2010 - 11:06pm PT
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Regarding that pin and strap:
I now seem to remember seeing something like that for sale in the REI catalog. I guess the "idea" was that if you were swinging the axe while going up a waterfall, and came off, the sliding loop would allow you to rapidly change your grip from the end of the shaft to the head, and thus perform an effective self-arrest with the axe deployed diagonally across your body. As I recall, the sliding loop was about that silly.
The usual Chouinard thing was to tie a loop of webbing through the eye in the head, long enough so that you could hang from it while gripping the sweet spot of the shaft, while on steep snow or ice. You would adjust this sling to your personal preference, and maybe for different steepnesses. For more moderate snow slopes, with the head in your hand, you would just hang onto the axe, and probably not have the sling around your wrist.
I would not doubt for one second that someone with a sporting goods store, who knew nothing about climbing, might have installed the wrist loop and pin as an "improvement" to the C-F piolet. They would order the loop and pin from REI, add it to the piolet, and upmark it accordingly.
An analogy to this sort of marketing wizdumb, concurrent with when that axe was first sold, was a fad of gluing fiberglass fender flares and "whale tails" onto 911 Porsches, and irreversibly destroying the value of the cars.
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Fritz
Trad climber
Hagerman, ID
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Aug 13, 2010 - 09:00pm PT
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dee ee. Re. how old your Chouinard Piolet is? It definitely predates mine.
I do have to defer to Marty’s assertion upthread: The 1973 supplement catalog shows teeth only at the tip. The spring 1974 Great Pacific Ironworks News catalog shows the teeth by the shaft and at the tip. The 1974 news catalog states "Also new is an extra set of teeth on the pick next to the shaft for climbing waterfalls........"This statement is also stated in the 1975 catalog.
I was thinking purchase date of 1973 on my “double tooth” Piolet: based on my first waterfall climbing trip to Baniff in Feb. 1974.
We climbed some steep (for us) stuff, like Cascade Gully.
My previous axe was a straight-picked model ( Stubei Nanga Parbat) and would not have cut it on near vertical ice.
I have been digging through old slides, hoping to find one dated Feb. 1974, that shows the Chouinard/Frost axe. No luck there, but I have been able to confirm my memories of being in Baniff then, with some scenic slides of that date.
So ---I owned my double-tooth Chouinard-Frost Piolet, by Feb 2004, and likely somewhat earlier.
However, I was also a Chouinard gear retailer and buddies with the Chouinard NW rep. Dale Day: so I may have got some priority in shipment.
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Brian in SLC
Social climber
Salt Lake City, UT
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Aug 14, 2010 - 02:26am PT
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Here's a Chouinard Frost with two sets of teeth with what I'm guessing is a hickory shaft...
Ha ha.
Sorry for the poor, hasty photo.
Another difference I've noted: the older single teeth models are held to the shaft with two rivets, the double teeth ones have three.
Cheers!
-Brian in SLC
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Fritz
Trad climber
Hagerman, ID
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Aug 14, 2010 - 10:14am PT
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Brian: re: Here's a Chouinard Frost with two sets of teeth with what I'm guessing is a hickory shaft...
Sunnybeaches! That's awesome dude!
Have you been hiding that one, or did you just acquire it?
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karabin museum
Trad climber
phoenix, az
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Aug 14, 2010 - 12:16pm PT
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Not just a Hickory Shaft, a First Class Hickory Shaft! Brian you are awesome! Very nice piece!
I usually follow the past catalogs for history reference on gear dating, but sometimes the manufacturer starts distributing their newer pieces before the catalogs are printed. Sometimes manufacturers use their catalogs to advertise their new pieces before they finally let the public use them. Example is the Metolius BRD device that they showed for three years in their catalogs before they distributed it to the public. Another example is Chouinard which showed Crack N' Ups available in 1973 where they were not distributed to the public until 1975.
Yous manufacturers keep playing with our minds!
That's why beer was invented and then came the tall tail stories..........
Rock on, Marty
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Brian in SLC
Social climber
Salt Lake City, UT
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Aug 14, 2010 - 01:04pm PT
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Yeah, recent acquisition.
Kinda bummed how beat up it is...
Hee hee.
I fancy a trip to the source some day. Lecco area, Premana. I imagine a feller could do some climbing there too...(dang, I have a couple weeks of vacation remaining to burn by the end of the year too...).
Cheers!
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dee ee
Mountain climber
citizen of planet Earth
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Aug 15, 2010 - 01:38pm PT
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I got mine sometime in the early '70s. I can't pinpoint the purchase date.
Before the Chouinard Piolet I had a Simond Super D which was a pretty fancy axe for it's day. My dad got it for me when I was about 10 yrs old. I used it until I got the Piolet roughly when I started high school. That could have been as early as 1971.
This doesn't look like the Super D, it must have been my dad's.
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TYeary
Social climber
State of decay
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Mar 15, 2014 - 07:45pm PT
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old friends.
TY
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Mar 15, 2014 - 07:59pm PT
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I used them on Point 5 Gully on Ben Nevis in 1972.....made it seem like real climbing. Ah nostalgia, makes you want things that you wouldn't actually use.
Not me...I don't own a carabiner that ways more than an ounce.
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Fritz
Trad climber
Choss Creek, ID
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Mar 15, 2014 - 09:50pm PT
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Donini! You forget your "gear-stash" Donini-museum in Chile! We needed some biners last year to hold down stuff on a truck, when we were visiting "Casa Donini"------- and I even found an old early 70's Eiger "Death-biner" in there.
Heidi did borrow one of your ice-tools to produce ice for our medicinal Gin & Tonics.
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bhilden
Trad climber
Mountain View, CA/Boulder, CO
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Mar 16, 2014 - 01:09am PT
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Compared to modern ice climbing tools those old axes are like climbing in blue Robbins' boots. I couldn't believe the difference when I switched. But, boy do they look nice!
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E
Ice climber
mogollon rim
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Mar 16, 2014 - 06:21am PT
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I have a chouinard /frost bamboo shaft northwall zero hammer for sale $750 you pay the shipping
I will even sign it (display model only with cracked shaft)
Also a pair of old grey jumars that prolly used to belong to Dr. F that I'll throw in to sweeten the deal(he signed them too)
i'll get the Bird to sign em too cuz he's seemed to sign everything else in sight, lechlinski will sign it as well if ya want.
thats the proper way to have a fundraiser on the Super topo
obviously bored and waiting for weather to improve here in glen nevis
Erik E
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