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cintune
climber
the Moon and Antarctica
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Apr 16, 2010 - 06:02pm PT
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"At least two-thirds of our miseries spring from human stupidity, human malice and those great motivators and justifiers of malice and stupidity: idealism, dogmatism and proselytizing zeal on behalf of religous or political ideas."
- Aldous Huxley
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Apr 17, 2010 - 12:05pm PT
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Forgive thee thy sins as we forgive those who sin against us. The lords prayer.
Why is is that so many of those who claim to be the most religious seem to forget this one?
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Apr 18, 2010 - 10:51am PT
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Dude, your way too f*#king long winded' answer my question..
Forgive thee thy sins as we forgive those who sin against us. The lords prayer.
Why is is that so many of those who claim to be the most religious seem to forget this one?
Edit
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mastadon
Trad climber
quaking has-been
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Apr 18, 2010 - 11:00am PT
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From the book of Don:
"Thou shalt not pollute this climbing forum with thy religious spew"
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Jingy
Social climber
Nowhere
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Apr 18, 2010 - 05:22pm PT
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Ladies... I could never ask this of you...
1 Timothy 2:12
12 I do not permit a woman to teach or to have authority over a man; she must be silent.
But god says so... ?
There's more
Judges 19:25-28
to all those in Ruwanda.. it's been going on forever, and there is no reason to be alarmed….
25 But the men would not listen to him. So the man took his concubine and sent her outside to them, and they raped her and abused her throughout the night, and at dawn they let her go. 26 At daybreak the woman went back to the house where her master was staying, fell down at the door and lay there until daylight.
27 When her master got up in the morning and opened the door of the house and stepped out to continue on his way, there lay his concubine, fallen in the doorway of the house, with her hands on the threshold. 28 He said to her, "Get up; let's go." But there was no answer. Then the man put her on his donkey and set out for home.
Romans 1:27 ..
there must have been plenty of this going on back then….
27In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.
Genesis 22:2…….. You gotta kid that won't shut up?.. There's a solution, divinely sanctioned!!!
2 Then God said, "Take your son, your only son, Isaac, whom you love, and go to the region of Moriah. Sacrifice him there as a burnt offering on one of the mountains I will tell you about."
(again, I'd never ask this of my wife.. mainly because I'd have more respect for her than this.. but again.. you gotta do what you gotta do right?)
Ephesians 5:22.. wives….. your life is not as important then your husbands (according to god)… so… submit
Wives and Husbands
22Wives, submit to your husbands as to the Lord.
Random findings:
16 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying,
17 Speak unto Aaron, saying, Whosoever he be of thy seed in their generations that hath any blemish, let him not approach to offer the bread of his God.
18 For whatsoever man he be that hath a blemish, he shall not approach: a blind man, or a lame, or he that hath a flat nose, or any thing superfluous,
19 Or a man that is brokenfooted, or brokenhanded,
20 Or crookbackt, or a dwarf, or that hath a blemish in his eye, or be scurvy, or scabbed, or hath his stones broken;
21 No man that hath a blemish of the seed of Aaron the priest shall come nigh to offer the offerings of the LORD made by fire: he hath a blemish; he shall not come nigh to offer the bread of his God.
In other words, keep those creepy physical defectives away from my holy altar! God is love, doncha know, God is love.
So.. I now understand that disabled people are to be shunned… people just like me… defectives…. should be shunned, in the eyes of the lord…
That's nice!
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tradmanclimbs
Ice climber
Pomfert VT
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Apr 18, 2010 - 05:49pm PT
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Well if its so true how come all the christian right wingers are so unforgiveing?
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Jingy
Social climber
Nowhere
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Apr 18, 2010 - 06:02pm PT
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I can't make up any excuses to all those right leaning folks......
There seems to be no excuse...
Any way I look at it leaves me with the feeling that I am a hypocrite... and I don't like that feeling... But I do prefer to remain conscious at all times.. and forget the bible completely
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cintune
climber
the Moon and Antarctica
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Apr 18, 2010 - 06:52pm PT
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"The outstanding feature of the mental life of savages known to psychologists as "primitive credulity" is doubtless chiefly due to sheer want of diversity of suggestiveness in their intellectual surroundings. Their notions stick fast because there are no competing notions to dislodge them. Society suffers a sort of perpetual obsession and remains self-hypnotized as it were within a magic circle of traditional views. A rigid orthodoxy is sustained by means of purblind imitation assisted by no little persecution. Such changes as occur come about not in consequence of a new direction taken by conscious policy, but rather in the way that fashions in dress alter amongst ourselves: by subconscious hardly purposive drifting. The crowd rather than the individual is the thinking unit."
The Encyclopædia Britannica: "Religion"
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TripL7
Trad climber
san diego
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Apr 18, 2010 - 08:36pm PT
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Jingy!
The culture Paul was addressing was one where men basically ran the show. They had almost total authority over the women, children and the slaves. They had no alternative but to live submissivly to these very authoritarian people...the Ephesians(Western Turkey). It was a patriarchal and a hierarchil society.
Paul comes into that situation with the Christian Gospel and tells the women, children, and slaves that they are fundamentally the same as the men, and that was a radical message at the time. He tells them they are created by God, they are loved by God, Christ died for them and that they could be reconciled to God; they could be indwelt by the Holy Spirit, they could become members of the body of Christ(Church), they could actually have a life of eternal significance. That was radical in the extreme.
Women were not allowed to study, when Paul said that women should learn in quietness and full submission, he was offering them an amazing new opportunity. Paul didn't want the Ephesian women to teach because they didn't yet have enough knowledge or experience.
Paul himself acknowledges that women publicly prayed and prophesied(1 Corinthians 11:15). No problem!!
Keep in mind that he(Paul)was speaking to new converts.
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
Full Silos of Iowa
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Apr 18, 2010 - 09:23pm PT
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Jingy- Way to seize the baton and help run it forward. You're a trooper!
Indeed, those who take the ancient Abrahamic narrative literally are indeed bronze age relics. They are Christians and Muslims alike. And we certainly know a few here at the Taco campfire.
Thank God! --God Hypercrates-- I'm not one of them!
Hadrian- Brick by brick.
Gandhi- Be the change you seek in the world.
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TripL7
Trad climber
san diego
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Apr 18, 2010 - 10:21pm PT
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Jingy- "Random findings: Speak unto Aron...man that hath a blemish"
Of course you are aware that the Lord was giving instruction to Moses in regards to which priest was allowed to go into the Temple once a year into the Holy of Holy places to give/offer sacrifice...
This was to underline, or make the point that God required a perfect sacrifice/perfect unblemished offering for sin...and it was not accomplished once and for all until Jesus Christ.
Had nothing to do with our imperfections as you suggest above...we are all blemished.
Jingy- "You got a kid that won't shut up?"
"Take your son, your only son..."
I am not going to take the necessary time to explain the full significance of God requesting Abraham to offer Isaac as a sacrifice, but here are a few:
1. God gave Abram and Sarai a son when they were 100 yr. and 80 yrs, old(the natural way)a miracle.
2. God promised Abraham that He would raise up a people, through Isaac, "as many as the stars in the sky".
3. He was testing Abrams faith. Child sacrifice was wide spread by the various people of the earth, was Abram as devoted?(God would never condone it).
4.Although he deeply loved(cherished)Isaac, Abraham new and trusted God to complete His promise through Isaac(some how raise him from the dead).
5. This was the very mountain that Jesus Christ was crucified on.(Abraham built an alter their).
6. God eventually provided the sacrifice, then and later once and for all with JC.
Abraham had a very personal relationship with the powerful and living God.
You are missing the whole point of the scripture you loathe, not to mention a relationship with your Creator!!
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mrtropy
Trad climber
Nor Cal
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Apr 18, 2010 - 10:24pm PT
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I like the sexy bits- the begets stuff and some of the S&M
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Jingy
Social climber
Nowhere
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Apr 18, 2010 - 10:31pm PT
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Trip7 - "The culture Paul was addressing was one where men basically ran the show. They had almost total authority over the women, children and the slaves. They had no alternative but to live submissivly to these very authoritarian people, Ephesians(Western Turkey). It was a patriarchal and a hierarchil society."
yet another reason to get rid of it (the book)!!!???!!!!
creator came from sperm and eggs.....
not missing any points.. just pointing out my favorite passages.. like the title of this thread asks...
you don't have to lecture on this subject.. I know there is no god, no matter how much sense you seem to make.. if only to yourself..
good luck, and next time, post up your favorite passages.. like I did...
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TripL7
Trad climber
san diego
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Apr 18, 2010 - 10:41pm PT
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Jingy- "Another reason to get rid of it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"
Your the one taking it out of context without a clue to what is being adressed and attempting to use it to your own agenda bro!
He, Paul was writing a letter, and organizing a church in another country. Where women, children and slaves were just that...slaves. Does the Talban sound familiar? Well it was worse. They taught them to read etc and:
"Love your wife as yourself"
Does that annoy you?
To bad!!!
It's here to stay!
EDIT:Christianity changed their life for the better. There are many women pastors teachers evangelist etc.
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TripL7
Trad climber
san diego
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Apr 18, 2010 - 10:44pm PT
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One of my "favorite passages":
"They perish for lack of Knowledge!"
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TripL7
Trad climber
san diego
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Apr 18, 2010 - 10:53pm PT
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"Call your wife blessed, and praise her."
"Love your wife as Christ loved the church."(Holy and blameless...He died for it).
"Love your wife as you love your body and your life."(As the temple of the living God).
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
Full Silos of Iowa
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Apr 18, 2010 - 11:09pm PT
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Oh, God!!
Grim Reaper: personification of Death
God Hypercrates: (modern) personification of Fate
Take some comparative religious studies courses. Break out of the archaic mentality that the Abrahamic narrative is the real deal in regard to how the world works. Instead take it on as ancient Abrahamic mythology.
Grow! Take on the growing pains! Switch. Adapt. Upgrade. The sky won't fall!
The difference between God Hypercrates and God Jehovah is the difference between lightning and the lightning bug.
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TripL7
Trad climber
san diego
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Apr 18, 2010 - 11:10pm PT
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'Heaven and earth shall pass away, but My words shall never pass away" Mark 13:31
"The grass withers, the flower fades, But the word of our God stands forever." Isaiah 40:8
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go-B
climber
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Apr 19, 2010 - 08:39am PT
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Proverbs 19: 3 When a man's folly brings his way to ruin,
his heart rages against the Lord.
16 Whoever keeps the commandment keeps his life;
he who despises his ways will die.
21 Many are the plans in the mind of a man,
but it is the purpose of the Lord that will stand.
23 The fear of the Lord leads to life,
and whoever has it rests satisfied;
he will not be visited by harm.
27 Cease to hear instruction, my son,
and you will stray from the words of knowledge.
Psalm 79:13, But we your people, the sheep of your pasture,
will give thanks to you forever;
from generation to generation we will recount your praise.
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dfrost7
climber
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Apr 20, 2010 - 06:40pm PT
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Hi.
So, I want to add a bit about God - about this relationship-with-Him thing.
Something happened this weekend, quite personal, but I want to share it with this community, because, at one time, I was involved enough for this to matter to some of you. I've never been entirely out of touch with it - climbing community.
I have this son - Graham. Russel Erickson and I were such tight friends, when he was born a lot of people at 'Gonia thought he was Russel's. Wills babysat him - thanks Wills. Mike Graham has known him about since he was born. I used to set up his playpen and do some work over at Grammicci. Thanks Mike.
Anyway, I got a call a little over a week ago from a friend who's now a radiologist at a nearby hospital. It was so random and weird. I was painting with my new best-buddy-painting-partner in Yermo at this post apocalyptic scene we found. My buddy's an atheist. I never preach to him, he knows I love Jesus and we're a great painting crew.
So, we're sitting in this place and I get a call. I asked the Dr. why he called? We hung out as friends like 35 years ago. He said he was just thinking about me.
Didn't think much of it (but weird), til my son, Graham, took me in the kitchen three days later and said they had found a mass in the x ray they took for his pneumonia. 4" x 1 1/2" between his spine and lung. Yes, I hit the boards (slang for prayer).
Fast forward - he's uninsured (20). I called my friend (radiologist) who had contacted me four days earlier. I know people who don't believe in God consider this coincidence - I'm not going to wrestle with God's loving hand.
They kept him a couple of days because of the size and location. The results came back this morning it's benign. Yes, I am so thanking God, for many things.
We were prepared for whatever may have come. But I need to say why I am writing this to y'all.
These things come. They come to all of our lives. Sooner or later, if you love someone you will be touched by some variety of this gut wrenching event. I would have asked for those of you who know Graham, and would do so, to pray with us, for him.
I understand (I've spent enough time) the nature of climbing as a culture. But, it is not dominated by those who feel they can't believe, for whatever reason. Many use science, but that's a smoke screen. Please understand, I'm not a right-wing-Palin-poster-toter. After all, His kingdom is not of this world.
When there are events, such as Rob being ill with whatever he is facing. Or Bobby, or John, or Todd, or Michael or any of those who have either been lost or facing illness in family or self, please know, there are those of us who will whole heartedly hit those boards, and stay there, until we get the all-clear.
It doesn't drive me nuts when people are bashing God, or Christians. There is some behavior I see in the public eye that most definitely needs to be taken to task.
But know, your fight is with a living God. The same one who set things up this past weekend for my son (still has to have the thing removed). Know that you are loved by us, too. Know you are right, atheist, to question. Know you are right there are some nut cases - you're right.
Know also, God is love. Know how happy this mom is that the news came back good today.
It wouldn't have dinged my faith if it had not, I've already lost one child. Just know, God is love.
That's what He wants us all to know. I was deeply moved, when my atheist painting buddy texted me, he had prayed for my son. Life is very real and very precious. Love one another.
The strange connection with my random calling friend was, he took our hand through the whole thing. He arranged everything for Graham. It has been an amazing week.
I would have to say, one of my favorite Bible verses is ... We love Him, because He first loved us.
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