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Tarbuster
climber
right here, right now
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Cosgrove post #9
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Re: Hey Coz, Sure would like to hear the story of Southern Belle Mar 24, 2009, 07:53am PT
Author: coz
Trad climber
From: California
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Roy,
I have all ready written one, and about ten other stories to go into a book as soon as I can get it all together. Any editors out there interested in helping? With good resumes?
Please send info to my e mail, thanks!
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Tarbuster
climber
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Cosgrove post #10
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Re: Hey Coz, Sure would like to hear the story of Southern Belle Mar 29, 2009, 10:36am PT
Author: coz
Trad climber
From: California
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DR,
Thank you for your kind words......
I think, I have made it clear, how I feel about GU, still feel the same way. I really don't see that I created art or your team, nature created both climbs, we just passed over them with our human bodies. My comment about the Mona Lisa was a metaphor.
If there is art it's God's art or a higher power, it existed before we climbed those faces and long after. I have established many death routes, it was the style in my day. I did not bolt the SB, Shultz and Shipley did, I argued with both of them to add bolts for years, probably about 12 or 13, would make it a very serious climb but with in the reach of many.
I didn't realize at the time what we had done, the standard we had set or how it would be view in the future, therefore being the humble trio we where, we left it alone. I am sure if the SB was retro-bolted it would be one of the most popular long free climbs in the world. Now, it's a frigging nightmare, I shiver to think about.
My problem with GU is not the ideal about making a statement, by establishing a safer climb, but more the fact that after trying to go ground up, you decided to quit and rap bolt it. The false claims made about not being able to see the line clearly from the ground (Clint's photo earlier in this thread, clearly show this as a false statement) and the claims there are no stances. What do you think Dave and Walt stood and drilled on. It wasn't a lack of good stances but their choice not to drill from them.
Also, your arguments about the ends justifying the means, just strike me as very white and manifest destiny (God given right over the land, native peoples and nature) Americana. I wish you guys had just continue ground up like all the other great efforts on that face. I do think the South Face is a limited resource and one that should be preserved.
I like this thread because it was not about your climb GU it was about the SB and about climbing, not ethics. Maybe if you and Sean establishes the SB, you would understand how I feel.
In all respect to all involved in GU, I do not consider it a climb but an installation and a blight on the face, it's removal and re-establishment ( bolt ladder and upper pitches only) would go along way to repairing the damage it cause in many peoples hearts and minds. It's something I don't like to think about or talk about, but out of respect to my elders (DR), I am answering your question.
I respect, all involved in GU as humans and climbers, just a disagreement on style - nothing personal. It's my hope we can go back to talking climbing, I think we all enjoying bringing back the memories of days gone by, as it is all an old climber has.
Scott,
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Tarbuster
climber
right here, right now
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And that's the last post I have from Scott for this thread.
I saved it in an MHTML document to my hard drive, just after the following post, on April 10, 2009:
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Re: Hey Coz, Sure would like to hear the story of Southern Belle Apr 10, 2009, 11:14am PT
Author: Clint Cummins
Trad climber
From: SF Bay area, CA
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> It looks to me that Leo or Dean found his way and Hank didn't.
> This route would probably benefit from some very definitive beta on how to find one's way on that particular pitch.
I agree - an improved topo would be nice. Few may be willing to lead p4, but it would be nice if they could find the few bolts above.
I've been thinking of going to near the base with a telescope to see if I can find the bolts and improve the overlay/topo.
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skcreidc
Social climber
SD, CA
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Thanks Tarbuster. Seems you have restored this thread back close to it's original condition. Many thanks!
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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Wow, Roy - thanks for sharing what you saved!
Kevin,
Most of the Doug Robinson, Sean Jones, rap bolt South face of Half Dome!
posts are still there, it's just hard to access:
http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.php?topic_id=566859&tn=1
(2681 posts remaining)
I think after that mass deletion, the ST folks improved things slightly and now do not remove threads that have a certain minimum post count?
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Tarbuster
climber
right here, right now
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Kevin,
I saved the Southern Belle thread. Yay!
I did not save the Growing Up thread. Boo ...
*Clint:
I sent you a PM.
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