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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 17, 2013 - 05:10pm PT
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Yeah, that's totally true when one ignores the examples of Russia and China and Eastern Europe and North Korea and Cuba, and ...
Nope. It is always introduced as Socialism for the people's good!
EDIT:venesuala has turned itself around brilliantly in the last 15 years under the direction of socialist not sold out to blueeys pride and joy
nowhere on the globe matches their achievements in the reduction of poverty and the advancement of education and healthcare
no wonder the capitalists are pissed...
Do you follow geo-politics? Venezuela is seizing private businesses by the gov't! They are actually turning from communism into a fascist State.
Look it up!
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pyro
Big Wall climber
Calabasas
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Nov 17, 2013 - 05:18pm PT
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Venezuela is still part of opec!
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 17, 2013 - 05:24pm PT
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Venezuela is still part of opec!
And I hear they're still part of South America, so what????
And BTW, I had an awesome Emergency+4 Lunchbox when I was a lad. It was one of my fav's.
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Pcutler
climber
Iowa
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Nov 17, 2013 - 06:02pm PT
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My old man always taught me that the good lord saw fit to give you two things for free. Air and water. Everything else in life that you want you'd better go and get yourself.
Nothing is free in the world - including health care. If you want it you'd better be willing to work for it.
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Curt
climber
Gold Canyon, AZ
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Nov 17, 2013 - 06:03pm PT
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Do you follow geo-politics? Venezuela is seizing private businesses by the gov't! They are actually turning from communism into a fascist State.
What a shock. Probably because there is little if any difference between the two
Curt
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 17, 2013 - 06:08pm PT
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Your old man was wrong. 1 out of every 8 people on the planet do not have access to safe and clean drinking water...free or not. 99% of all fatalities from drinking water occur in the third world.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 17, 2013 - 06:13pm PT
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My old man always taught me that the good lord saw fit to give you two things for free. Air and water. Everything else in life that you want you'd better go and get yourself.
Nothing is free in the world - including health care. If you want it you'd better be willing to work for it.
Sometimes we have to look back in history to see how ours will unfold. Yer old man was wise.
edit; Your old man was wrong. 1 out of every 8 people on the planet do not have access to safe and clean drinking water...free or not. 99% of all fatalities from drinking water occur in the third world.
Hey Jim, what would fix that problem? Who is responsible for fixing it? What caused that problem?
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 17, 2013 - 07:32pm PT
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You mean,better than the one he himself inadvertently presents?
No need.
Where is Dinesh wrong?
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Curt
climber
Gold Canyon, AZ
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Nov 17, 2013 - 08:07pm PT
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Curt...
Just curious...
Why do you sign "Curt"???...
You're name's right next to your post...
???...
Hey Locker,
Good question.
Curt
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Nov 17, 2013 - 08:08pm PT
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we should have no public education, no public police and fire services and no public roads - to but name a few. No public libraries, either. That is the natural conclusion to what you are putting forth.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Nov 17, 2013 - 08:16pm PT
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It does not sound to me as though they brought in on consult anyone who particularly knows his ass from a hole in the ground when it comes to healthcare.
They are "progressives" and they went to Harvard or Yale.
(and never were contaminated by having a real productive job)
Who are you to question their judgement?
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Nov 17, 2013 - 09:21pm PT
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he Atlantic reports that in practice, this means that a married couple in New York making more than a combined $62,040 gets no subsidies from Obamacare. But two people who live together without getting married? They can make up to a combined $91,920 and still get subsidies from the government.
The government has a clear and compelling interest in promoting marriage: Virtually all of the research shows that stable marriages increase economic output, reduce poverty, shrink income inequality, lower rates of incarceration and drug use, and spur the creation of future taxpayers (aka babies). The tax code already discriminates against the government's interest by providing an economic incentive for couples to choose cohabitation over marriage. Now Obamacare has come along to magnify the discrimination.
It's not clear whether this perversity is accidental or by design. But it's yet another line item in the argument against what is clearly the most catastrophic piece of legislation in modern American history
http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/penalty-marriage-obamacare_767194.html
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 17, 2013 - 09:27pm PT
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If you - or anyone else - opposes public healthcare, why are you not also opposing public education? Public roads? Public police services? On what basis do you make this distinction? What is your criteria. Using your logic, we should not pay to send poor people's children to public schools? Actually that is a rather good question given some of the outcomes of various schools but such is another issue altogether issue having nothing to do with what we are addressing, at hand.
What if someone never worked a day in his life but he goes to the library and checks out a book? He did not pay one cent for that book yet he read it cover to cover? Have you been violated? Blue, TGT, others? Why are you OK with public education and public police protection but you are NOT OK with public healthcare. On what basis do you make the distinction?
Ever read the Constitution? I know many of you want to throw it away, but it's still the defining legal document that dictates how our gov't operates.
The Federal Government is tasked with few things in the Constitution. Among those are a military, a postal service, and regulation of the States and commerce.
Since when did the Fed have the authority to mandate that a person buy something from the State or the Fed? And fine them when they refused!
Tyranny. Pure and simple.
EDIT:Water has never ever been free. Not in the history of the world.
DMT
Explain.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Nov 17, 2013 - 09:31pm PT
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They don't know the difference between a local school board, county or city government and a Washington bureaucrat.
Local control is anathema.
Rule by a central plutocracy?
sacred.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 17, 2013 - 09:38pm PT
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People are f*#king stupid and want to govern with emotion and how they 'feel' about a certain issue. There is no concern for the rule of law and the Constitution.
People are f*#king stupid!
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dirtbag
climber
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Nov 17, 2013 - 09:52pm PT
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blue:
people are not "f*#king stupid" albeit some may be so. We are not talking about "feeling" anything. We are talking about delineating what are your criteria for that which falls in the public realm. There is nothing "stupid" - f*#king or otherwise - about this question. It is simply asking you to define your criteria.
Hi Lois.
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wilbeer
Mountain climber
honeoye falls,ny.greeneck alleghenys
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Nov 17, 2013 - 09:58pm PT
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Defending selfishness has never read so obviously.
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Todd Eastman
climber
Bellingham, WA
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Nov 17, 2013 - 09:58pm PT
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Blu, the Constitution provides for amendments and provisions that anticipate changing realities...
... I wish the uber-conservatives got this simple truth.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Nov 17, 2013 - 10:09pm PT
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Healthcare is NOT a right! It's a system of paying for your future hospitalization. It is a system of ensuring your health.
If you do not take care of yourself, is it I who is to pay?
In 1st world countries we understand this shit! That is why we strove to be better. Those that fall behind will be cared for, that is also our awesomeness.
But to drag down the producers, that is unlawful and derelict.
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