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Off White
climber
Tenino, WA
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Yep, the above comments are all true. When I saw the Crucible photo I thought, "whoa, unroped, that doesn't happen much" but then I realized eeyonkee=grug and thought, "oh, it's Greg Cameron, okay, makes sense then." You may not have been a magazine quality self promoting personality, but you're certainly an icon to us folks of San Diego extraction.
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eeyonkee
Trad climber
Golden, CO
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 8, 2007 - 12:10pm PT
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Aw shucks guys, every one of you who commented is probably a better climber than me (outside of offwidths, maybe). I've only done a handful of maybe 5.12s in my whole climbing career. I would feel lucky if I was considered the 4th best climber of the Poway Mountain Boys.
I had no idea that that free solo made such an impression.
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Raydog
Trad climber
Boulder
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Mar 12, 2007 - 09:45pm PT
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Greg,
that free solo meant we were all flying propeller planes and you were hitting the ceiling in a jet.
What's the secret to wide crack mastery Greg?
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Jaybro
Social climber
The West
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Mar 13, 2007 - 02:14am PT
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A long, long time ago, Leroy (also clean Dan) told me that camer-what's-his-name, guy, was a good wide climber ... I'm just glad I didn't have to armbar mother superior.
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Raydog
Trad climber
Boulder
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Mar 13, 2007 - 02:20am PT
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Right, I never would have tried Mother Superior without stacks.
The influence for this as far as I know came of course from Leavitt.
We all wanted to try the "new way" to climb wide.
To me the aesthetics of climbing straight-in cracks always seemed much higher that anything in a corner - personally.
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eeyonkee
Trad climber
Golden, CO
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 13, 2007 - 10:00am PT
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Mother Superior is an interesting, hard climb. Piggot first showed it to me. The first time I tried it (with Piggot) I used arm-barring techniques, of course. Got right near the end of the offwidth but couldn't get my knee above the overhanging part.
Tried it a couple of more times...got the offwidth but fell on the upper part. Eventually I got the whole thing using arm bars on the offwidth. Whenever I screwed around on this climb I had shoulder and elbow road rash to beat the band.
Around this same time I had flashed Bad Ass Mama (armbarring) in the Valley. Tom Gibson and I did it as an afterthought after we failed to negotiate the slabs to Half Dome one evening. I came up with the name Mother Superior to reflect that it was harder than BAM. Ok, so maybe it was in part because I went to Catholic school when I was younger.
Seems like it wasn't until at least a year later, maybe more, I did it using hand stacks. Maybe I was proportioned just right at the time with respect to knee size, but I remember the offwidth part feeling like 5.10 with the stacks. I never have soloed it (doesn't surprize me that Adrian did, Ray). I still have to remind myself to use hand stacks on offwidths. When I do, invariably the climb seems much easier. I wonder how BAM would be with stacks? - I haven't been back to try in 30 years.
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Raydog
Trad climber
Boulder
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Mar 13, 2007 - 11:08am PT
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I'm still spinning w/ the Robbins Crack first ascent account - really great story - finally I know.
There was even some doubt - a murmur of speculation that Robbins had actually been there and done it - that the name had derived from some other means - and been attached to the great Yosemite pioneer through association.
Any future definitive topo guide to Woodson - you'll need aerials -
would of course benefit greatly from as much accurate first ascent data as possible. We can pin all the unclaimed controversial first ascents on Piggot.
Who's got an airplane? Send me the digitals and I'll make them into perfect line drawings - no charge.
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Raydog
Trad climber
Boulder
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Mar 13, 2007 - 11:15am PT
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The last time I was at Woodson -
1998 with Eric Beck, pretty out of shape for rock but in ok physical condition - managed a clean top rope of Drivin' South,
first try. Had to use my feet.
Did Bachar do the FA of this thing? This incredible little gem which has spanked so many "hard guys"?
The "truth" about "friendly" Mount Woodson is sickeningly clear standing there looking up into those brutal locks.
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bvb
Social climber
flagstaff arizona
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Mar 13, 2007 - 11:28am PT
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ray --
the way i jeard the story was that bachar on-sighted soloed both drivin' south and hear my train on the same day in 1974, and they were both f.a's.
even for folks like us who've climbed there for decades, the early history -- 60's through early 70's -- sure was murky. by '76 - '77 people like off white and watusi and i were climbing there three or four days a week so if anything went down we were there to see it.
yeah, somebody really should do a decent guide that will actually get people to the routes, and has a good, well-researched history in the introduction. i think a big, big reason people don't go there so much now has a lot to do with the fact that finding anything -- even roadside problems -- without a local showing you the way, is pretty hopeless. can you imagine trying to find widow bereft or the star wall or clockwork orange off a written description?? fuhgedabouddit.
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Raydog
Trad climber
Boulder
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Mar 13, 2007 - 12:33pm PT
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Where's Bachar?
Dude, tell it like it is.
You're only one of the most influential climbers in the the history of the sport, please tell us the story of the first ascent of
Drivin' South
and
Hear my Train a Comin'
Who was there? What was it like? Who's ego got destroyed? How many went home with crippled self esteem?
C'mon John...
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Raydog
Trad climber
Boulder
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Mar 13, 2007 - 12:46pm PT
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Please see drawing sample below.
In my opinion this is about the right technique to produce an accurate guide to Woodson. It blends geological and topographic features in a clear yet realistic way.
Woodson - I think - has three main faces. All three need aerials.
In addition the various well defined clusters need detailed art, similar to what is above but from the air.
For the user to associate with the topos while they hike up the hill, use black and white photos, taken from the road, with a corresponding index to that found in the drawings.
The hill south of Woodson gets the same treatment.
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eeyonkee
Trad climber
Golden, CO
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 13, 2007 - 12:59pm PT
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Beauutiful drawing, Ray.
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Raydog
Trad climber
Boulder
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Mar 13, 2007 - 01:06pm PT
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Stuff like the above is of course more convenient to do now w/ modern tools.
Back then I had a single-slide slide projector pointed straight down onto my work table. I could adjust for scale and keep it focused. I'd put paper underneath and "trace" images I needed,
pretty common set up for illustrating.
The advantage of the drawings is - of course - so that the most relevant (key) features can be selectively shown, since photos are rife w/ confusing shadows, etc.
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crotch
climber
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Mar 13, 2007 - 01:41pm PT
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Pretty Deerhorn drawing Ray.
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Raydog
Trad climber
Boulder
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Mar 13, 2007 - 05:11pm PT
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FYI Greg and others, I see Tom Gibson around Boulder now and then.
Maybe it's in this thread and I missed it but, just who exactly were the Poway Mountain Boys - did you go to the same high school together? Can you list them for my edification?
I don't think there were any other climbers down in the Imperial Beach/Chula Vista area except later I met this guy Craig Snortland. He climbed with Ken Turley who lived up in Lyons Valley near Lawson Peak. They did some nice climbs out there - I think Lawson comes up on a google image search.
Craig, Piggot, Carmel and I went up to the Ogre one day. I led it onsight and did a good job protecting it without any real fuss.
Around that time I dubbed Piggot
"the Clint Eastwood of Climbing".
Speaking of google - I have a feeling bvb is going to show up with perfect Google Earth Pro aerials of the Woodsonian and say "get to work froggy".
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eeyonkee
Trad climber
Golden, CO
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 13, 2007 - 05:48pm PT
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Ray, I can't believe that you independently came up with the Piggot-Clint Eastwood angle. I've always said that Rick's glare reminded me of Clint's. I was glared at by Rick plenty, or so it would seem. Leroy once said on this forum, something to the effect that "My how Rick could fill the room with his silence".
The Poway Mountain Boys. I've mentioned it in a couple of other threads. We all went to Poway High (except for the honorary members). We actually had an official climbing club at school. There were a few others who came and went, but the core group is/was: Dave Goeddel, Denny Adams, Bruce Adams, Kinley Adams, Rick Piggot, Colin Piggot, Jim Cameron, Greg Cameron, Tom Gibson, George Manson (honorary), Dennis Sullivan (honorary).
Edit: Jeez! I forgot somebody...what was I thinking!...and the Big Duke himself, Dan Heiser(honorary).
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Raydog
Trad climber
Boulder
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Mar 13, 2007 - 06:06pm PT
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Thanks for reiterating the list for my benefit Greg.
Just sitting there, Rick Piggot exuded a powerful presence, an energy that could easily be misunderstood until you got to know him a little. He'd crack a smile, it was amazing.
I took Piggot on a tour of Mother Grundy peak once, my girlfriend Ann was there too. There's this thing that is EXACTLY like Woodson's Test Tube but at least 120 degrees overhanging. It was near the end of the day. I fit in the thing perfect and ratcheted off the moves. Rick, long framed and pretty darn tall got completely shut down. It was the only time I've ever seen him even slightly ruffled. End of day.
Rick is a great guy. I can't even imaging doing those El Cap routes he did, clearly an excellent climber, I'd say in a sense world class for sure.
Thanks Greg.
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bvb
Social climber
flagstaff arizona
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Mar 13, 2007 - 08:36pm PT
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yeah, i climbed with piggot a whole lot between 85 and 89. it was a priviledge and a real eye opener -- not matter how wired a woodson master you'd think you were, one day with piggot would set the record straight. the guy is a true jedi master.
ray, remember, after i'd moved from san diego to yosemite, when i was supposed to hook up with you and piggot and you guys were gonna show me some huge new off-width roof somewhere in the east county? and i didn't show, stood you guys up? next time i saw piggot he briefly mentioned that and i felt about three inches tall. heh. he really knew how to psych a guy out.
so where was that roof, anyway??
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Raydog
Trad climber
Boulder
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Mar 13, 2007 - 09:25pm PT
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You got me bvb.
Roof?
I can't remember.
hmm
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bvb
Social climber
flagstaff arizona
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Mar 13, 2007 - 09:35pm PT
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december 1998, christmas break, big, dead-horizontal roof, not woodson, not rainbow, perfect stacking size, 20-footer.
where the hell was that sucker?? you guys had me reeled in...but family sh#t interposed....
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