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Minerals
Social climber
The Deli
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Dec 29, 2010 - 11:44pm PT
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“What could some drawbacks be to replacing bolts when it is so frigid and obviously everything is frozen?”
As a guess, it seems like in super cold temperatures, the chances of snapping some of the old metal would be greater than if you were pulling the old stuff, say in the summer sun, when the metal would be much more likely to bend than snap/crack. It’s always good to be able to pull all of the old metal out of a hole if you are replacing old bolts. That way, you can reuse/drill out the old hole. Way to go on getting involved in bolt replacement!
First few photos look like a standard 1/4” split-shank thread-head bolt and a Leeper hanger. The fifth photo looks like a rusty stainless Fixe wedge bolt. Last photo looks like original plated SMC “death hangers” and Rawl 5/16” buttonhead bolts. Not sure about the two items in the upper right, but the ring bolt on the lower right looks like the ones that are/were at some of the belays on El Cap. They look like Euro bolts that have been added. Anyways, some of ‘em look like they have been hauled off of a few times because the rings become stretched and deformed. Yeah, great bolts...
StahlBro, yeah, nice hanger, eh? That bolt was placed at a huge stance, so luckily, I was able to pull it and replace it on lead (easy ground).
It’s threads like this that should make us all appreciate organizations like ASCA all the more!
Edit:
Not sure, but wonder if drill bits may be more susceptible to chipping/breaking in super cold temperatures. Seems like it makes sense. I’ve had this thought during the late season in Tuolumne, but those temps are balmy compared to what you are used to.
Well, Sushi Guy... It's true!
+100 for ASCA!
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nature
climber
Tuscon Again! India! India! Hawaii! LA?!?!
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Dec 29, 2010 - 11:49pm PT
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It’s threads like this that should make us all appreciate organizations like ASCA all the more!
yah mon. well said, Brian.
+1
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Prezwoodz
climber
Anchorage
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Thank you for the post Minerals!
I haven't had any problems with drill bits snapping yet. It has been below zero a few times while I was bolting. The drill died faster for sure.
Today was amazing. A beautiful 30 degrees and the scenery couldn't be better. Pulled 15 bolts and didn't leave anything in the rock. Although I found that most of the holes are not in rock I would ever bolt in so I had to add another hole nearby. One bolt I put the bar on it and just pushed it right out. I hadn't even put the hammer to it yet. Scary!
about half the bolts I pulled were actually in drill pockets that were drilled vertically. Three bolts in one super long shattered drill pocket. They were super easy to pull.
Oh and why are they called SMC Death Hangers? I think all 15 of the bolts I pulled today were the same thing.
ASCA Is AWWESSOME! Free full page spread in the next Alaska rock climbing guide for the ASCA, thanks for all the hard work and hardware!
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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> Oh and why are they called SMC Death Hangers?
I don't know of anybody who actually died because one failed.
I think that term is used to emphasize the difference between the 2 common types of SMC hangers -
the older ones are chrome moly steel (like Leepers) but chrome plated (they might crack),
the newer ones are thick stainless steel and are very strong.
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dave goodwin
climber
carson city, nv
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On our ascent of Mescalito this summer we replaced two bolts at our last bivy (three pitches from the top).
both were old quarter inchers. On the first bolt my partner Eric clipped the funkness to the hanger after loosening it with a tuning fork. It took several good yanks with the funkness to get the bolt to come out.
when it finally did we were amazed to find nothing attached to the hammer. the whole set up, carabiners funkness and the old bolt with hanger, just hurled into the unknown.
so if anyone finds an old hanger attached to a funkness at the base you know where it came from. With the force to yank it out it probably took a pretty good trajectory and probably landed way out in the trees.
take care
dave
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bhilden
Trad climber
Mountain View, CA
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About the SMC Death Hangers... didn't the three guys from Minnesota who fell retreating on the Nose in 1978 die because of a broken thin SMC hanger at the rappel station? They accidentally dropped their haul bag an entire pitch and when it came taught on the anchor the hanger snapped. Unfortunately, they had clipped around the chain between the two anchor bolts and not into the anchor bolts directly.
Bruce
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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The stainless steel SMC hangers have a spotless performance record unlike the plated chromoloy versions that had the same accelerated stress corrosion problems as the Leeeper chromoly hangers.
Center hanger is clearly cracked.
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Prezwoodz
climber
Anchorage
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Feb 28, 2011 - 04:30pm PT
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Ran across my first Dolt Bolt. Whats the time period on this thing?
Some other new stuff.
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OlympicMtnBoy
climber
Seattle
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Feb 28, 2011 - 07:34pm PT
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More fun old bolting gear from some stuff I inherited from a retiring friend. The blue drill seems to want a different taper on the bit shank than the larger drill or I'd use it for alpine stuff. I got a bit stuck in it and didn't have room to get the key in to get it out.
I wonder what the heck the split shaft button heads on the middle with an eye for a cotter ring were for. I assume random non-climbing bits mixed in but I'm glad I haven't come across any of those holding something on.
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cragnshag
Social climber
san joser
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Feb 28, 2011 - 08:33pm PT
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I wonder what the heck the split shaft button heads on the middle with an eye for a cotter ring were for
Those are used for hanging acoustical ceilings and whatnot to the underside of concrete floors. You thread the hole with a wire and run the wire to the suspended ceiling. Plenty strong.
In theory you could use a cotter pin to "secure" a bolt hanger to the rock, then go back later with pliers and retrieve your hangers.
I suppose if you ever encountered one of those on lead you could get your car keys out and put the ring through it, then clip the ring............
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Mungeclimber
Trad climber
sorry, just posting out loud.
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Feb 28, 2011 - 09:30pm PT
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ship those buttonheads to me for good use!
:)
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Captain...or Skully
climber
The Seas of Stone.
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Feb 28, 2011 - 09:37pm PT
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Isn't it funky how you clip into this old bolt, feels solid, then funk it out and you realize just HOW sketchy the thing really was? Yeesh.
Here's to the upgraders. Community service indeed.
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JP.Franklin
Trad climber
Santiago-CHILE
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Aug 10, 2011 - 07:43pm PT
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Undusted kit we used in the good old eigties.
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tolman_paul
Trad climber
Anchorage, AK
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Aug 10, 2011 - 08:14pm PT
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My kit from the early 90's
As to replacing bolts in the winter, my understanding from dealing with various arctic engineering projects is -20F is the threshold where you have to start worrying about the performance of structural steel being affected by the temperature. So if you're hard core enough to be replacing bolts at -30, yes metal imbrittlement will be an issue.
What's suprised me over the years of replacing bolts in various locals is how much difference there is in both the soundness of old bolts, and in the rock. The last couple bolts I replaced a few years back were on this formation.
They were 1/4" buttonheads in ss smc hangers, and within 100' of saltw#ter, not to mention rainfall and winter freeze thaw. I'd have to check the guide book to see when they were placed, but I'm thinking they were at least 20 years old when I changed them out. The rock is fractured sedimentary sandstone/choss. They were some of the most difficult button heads I've ever pulled!
Not that I fealt bad about putting in 1/2" ss bolts, but sometimes those old bolts aren't as bad as they look, yet ofetn times they are much worse!
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Jan 21, 2012 - 12:31pm PT
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Cold metal bump...
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justthemaid
climber
Jim Henson's Basement
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Jan 21, 2012 - 01:09pm PT
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We clipped this one just last week down in El Potrero Chico. Not just for fun. The first modern bolt was 30 feet off the ground.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Jan 21, 2012 - 01:13pm PT
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How do you say FUNK in spanish?
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justthemaid
climber
Jim Henson's Basement
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Jan 21, 2012 - 02:29pm PT
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El manko?
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Mar 31, 2012 - 08:41pm PT
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Funk Mank- Great name for a lousy route...
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guido
Trad climber
Santa Cruz/New Zealand/South Pacific
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Mar 31, 2012 - 09:01pm PT
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This brought back some old memories of climbing at the St Helena Palisades with some rather sketchy hangers we fabricated and placed!
"I remember doing some routes in the Palisades with Roper in the early 60's. We made up these crazy bolt hangers out of old license plates!
A short lived adventure into making hardware. We borrowed some ginormnous Eucalyptus stumps from the golf range in Tilden Park for our "anvil", and set up shop in Ropers backyard.
Not one of the most intelligent things we ever did. Then again not one of the dumbest."
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