Paul Ryan Fourteeners Thread Deleted! Why?

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philo

Trad climber

Somewhere halfway over the rainbow

Nov 17, 2012 - 02:07pm PT

WHY?

Rick A

climber

Boulder, Colorado

Topic Author's Reply - Nov 17, 2012 - 02:40pm PT

Stzzo-Check the top of the page:

Climber's Forum

General questions, discussion, community — join the conversation!

Werner-I can certainly understand a small business owner wishing to avoid even the remote possibility of financial trouble over a thread. What I cannot understand is taking this unusual action and then refusing to discuss why it occurred. If he just said what you said, privately, or publicly, I'd probably shut up.

Well, at least for a while until Ryan runs for president in a few years.

Best to you too, Werner.

Karl Baba

Trad climber

Yosemite, Ca

Nov 17, 2012 - 02:43pm PT

Most likely we don't have a dang clue why that thread disappeared. My experience is that our assumptions are much more often wrong than right

PEace

karl

Rick A

climber

Boulder, Colorado

Topic Author's Reply - Nov 17, 2012 - 04:08pm PT

Here's another example from google of ST's promotion of the "community" forum:

SuperTopo's climbing discussion forum is the world's most popular community discussion forum for people who actively climb outdoors.

As I said, I understand a website owner wanting to protect his business; no one would begrudge this, even if it is were overcautious. Chris certainly has every right to delete threads at his will.

It's just not a very civil way to treat the "community" he promotes to refuse to discuss the reasons for doing it here. Just looking for some common courtesy, really.

WBraun

climber

Nov 17, 2012 - 04:10pm PT

Rick

Try calling at Phone: (530) 545 0424

zBrown

Ice climber

chingadero de chula vista

Nov 17, 2012 - 04:21pm PT

OK - I know why the thread was deleted, but I can't tell because I'd have to kill myself.

-Cyanide de Bergerac

jstan

climber

Nov 17, 2012 - 04:23pm PT

Promises promises.

nah000

Mountain climber

canuckadia

Nov 17, 2012 - 04:35pm PT

while i don't post here a lot, i appreciate what chris has created and more importantly what that creation facilitates.

given the herding cat nature of the above task, i generally don't give too much time to second guessing his (team's) minimal editing methods or prerogative.

but, this mystery disappearance and scrubbing of an entire thread that was from my recollection surprisingly respectful and at least tangentially on topic, is fundamentally different than the usual rendition of a fatty or leb type contributor.

more importantly it appears to fly in the face of all three of mcnamara's stated goals for this website.

from the link and mcnamara's keyboard they are:

//1) Inspire, educate and humor each other
As I see it this is the whole point of the Forum; what the Forum is on its best days. There are a lot of amazing people here from wildly different backgrounds. It’s great how many different styles of information come forth, from people sharing wild winter ascents in the High Sierra to how to make the ultimate van conversion.

2) Preserve history
A lot of Historical Gold has been posted here from Yosemite, Colorado, Alaska and around the world. I love the fact that a web search for old climbing history often directs the searcher to the SuperTopo Forum. Best of all, many of the people who made that history post here! Some people have asked if this historical stuff is safe here. Answer: Yes. We have been around since 2000 (the Stone Age in climbing Forum time) and are not going anywhere. We have a business model learned from living in Camp 4: even with low income, you can always keep your expenses even lower. (And grab leftover pizza from the Curry Deck when necessary).

3) Have the most open home for discussion on the Internet
For good or bad, SuperTopo is the least moderated, least categorized, least divided up forum out there. One page, simple layout, post em' if ya got em' That is what people love and hate about the Forum, myself included.//

if chris is serious about these, i sure would appreciate an explanation as to what happened to the original thread.

at the end of the day mcnamara doesn't owe me/us anything. but that stance is a double edged sword. without an explanation this incident changes my perception of both the value and substance of what i thought this place was.

i'll continue to visit, but a little joy in mudville will have been lost.

zBrown

Ice climber

chingadero de chula vista

Nov 17, 2012 - 04:40pm PT

HighTraverse

Trad climber

Bay Area

Nov 18, 2012 - 09:51pm PT

Indeed, that thread was a small bit of US history. Given that a lot of the thread was a discussion by people who are familiar with the Colorado 14'ers, debunking Ryan's apparent claim had credence.

Scrubbing it for whatever reason was unconscionable (in my not so humble opinion).

I haven't read all posts on this thread carefully so maybe I missed it, but I didn't see anyone postulate that the thread was hacked out of existence by a Romulus/LyinRyan supporter.
Their campaign had a large incentive to scrub anything on the web that called Ryan's veracity into question. Wiping out a James Fallows page would have immediate public condemnation. Who besides Ryan would give a tinker's damn about what's said in this two bit gin joint?

Hawkeye

climber

State of Mine

Nov 18, 2012 - 10:03pm PT

Ooooh CockEye you stopped ass raping yourself with an oversized oosik long enough to crawl out from behind the woodwork and spew santorum again. You are a cowardly anonymous trollboi. Your parents must be so proud.

philo,

you are one lucky faggot that i remain anonymous on here.....nothing a good bitch slap wont fix for you though...

Jennie

Trad climber

Elk Creek, Idaho

Nov 18, 2012 - 10:43pm PT

Online forum owners and individuals who post messages can be held liable for invasion of privacy or for making defamatory statements, which are damaging, false statements of fact.

Chances of plaintiffs winning such lawsuits are not high. Many lawsuits are thrown out of court or settled before trial, but not before causing major problems for the accused. Chris could go bankrupt just defending such litigation ...regardless of its merit.

Chris allows us a great deal of latitude on Supertopo Forum...and questioning Mr Ryan's claims is not unreasonable.

But the profusion of derision and glut of hate filled posts that came with disputing Ryan's assertions, here, could be used to manifest allegations of defamation and libel.

Chris HAS to be discerning in how far he permits maligning and derision of individuals...especially public figures.

WBraun

climber

Nov 18, 2012 - 10:58pm PT

Be careful what you all wish for.

These modern day politards ruining for high offices these days are heavy hitters.

Ya just might get a knock on the door and become a drooling lobotomized zombie hours later ......

zBrown

Ice climber

chingadero de chula vista

Nov 18, 2012 - 11:08pm PT

Maybe someone should ask why the reconstructed thread which contains a significant share of the original has not been deleted.

On another topic MittRomney, no exercise slouch himself, was in Del Mar today watching movies and eating pizza. Nobody seemed to care whether he and Ann ran up from La Jolla or arrived on horseback.

Philip Marlowe

Mighty Hiker

climber

Vancouver, B.C.

Nov 19, 2012 - 12:22pm PT

Another angle on this. The original threads gained some attention on your national stage. That in turn might have attracted all sorts of political trolls to SuperTopo. Not just amateurs, like most of us, but the professionals. Not only further diluting what the forum is about, but creating a management problem. Perhaps Chris simply didn't want to have to deal with that, and took pre-emptive action.

blahblah

Gym climber

Boulder

Nov 19, 2012 - 01:37pm PT

A story like the disappearance of this thread might seem petty and unworthy of much concern to many, but if his claims of mountain mastery were proven to be imaginary, I believe it could ruin his career, or certainly his chances for the presidency. It would be a story he could never live down.

The kind of corruption, lust for power and money that is at play here might make the disappearance of such a credible discussion as the one on ST a high priority.

Chris' silence on the matter does raise suspicions about his involvement in, or at least knowledge of what happened. Seems he could offer some kind of explanation.

Rick was really onto something, I think. It would seem somebody would have the skills to trace what happened, and who made it happen. The answers to those questions might be far more intriguing than the original thread was.

Not the way I see it. Ryan's lying about his marathon time was unconverted--and it was still a small story that quickly blew over. Ryan's 14er hiking can never really be proved or disproved, and his handlers came up with explanations of Ryan's statements that were probably BS at some level, but were plausible enough to ensure this obscure topic stayed obscure. I have hiked all Colo. 14ers (except Culebra) and ran (jogged) a sub-4 hour marathon, and not even I really care that much about Ryan's d-baggery. It's a real stretch to think that average Joe is going to care about this, especially in 4 years.

Anyone who thinks that getting caught being a BS-artist and teller of whoppers is fatal to a political career should spend a few minutes googling the career of our illustrious current VP.

Rick A

climber

Boulder, Colorado

Topic Author's Reply - Nov 21, 2012 - 09:31am PT

I took Werner’s advice and called Chris. We didn’t speak directly, but exchanged voice mails. He said he did not know why the thread was deleted. Apparently he wasn’t even aware of the issue!

So, apologies to Chris for saying that his silence indicated arrogance on his part. Apparently, he has better things to do (climbing?) than follow the discussions on his forum.

Still, there remains the mystery of who deleted the thread and why. I hope Chris can clarify how it came about.