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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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I would like to know where the Feynman quote came from... it is not easily found (which is suspicious for him)...
[Click to View YouTube Video]
the implication that Feynman was religious is certainly incorrect...
"...I'm not frightened by not knowing things, by being lost in a mysterious universe without having any purpose, which is the way it really is as far as I can tell, possibly. It doesn't frighten me."
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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P.Rob
Nice list of Believing scientists. But you can't really include Faraday since he lived 200 years ago.
That's a pretty short list.
I'm reminded of working in the Physics Dept of my university for a summer with a PhD Candidate for high energy physics. He thoroughly denied evolution. He suspended his knowledge of science when it contradicted his religious beliefs rather than reforming his religious beliefs based upon what he knew as fact.
As an engineer, I can promise you that confusing belief with fact can lead to disaster. Global warming denial is a case in point. Not believing what facts are telling you leads to the Global Horizon oil rig disaster.
Please tell me how particle physics and relativity are "true", as proven by 60 years of experimental proof and practical experience, yet evolution is bunk.
It's OK with me if you believe in God. There's a lot to be said for believing in the moral and ethical frameworks of all religions. Even in believing that God created the universe. Just don't go telling me that God created the earth in 6 days and Eve from Adam's rib. Or that Noah got 2 of every species onto his ark. Or that God delivered the Ten Commandments to Abraham. Or that He turned Lot into a pillar of salt.
I'm not accusing anyone in this forum of believing any or all of the above, just pointing out that\ science trumps belief whenever they contradict.
And no, I cannot disprove the existence of God, any more than you can prove His/Her/It's existence. It's only what God IS or ISN'T that can be debated rationally.
Edit: Ed, thanks for following up on what I thought was rather fishy.
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P.Rob
Social climber
Pacomia, Ca - Y Que?
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Quote comes from Prof.Henry "Fritz"Schaeffer " scientists & their gods"
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Andree Hussar
Social climber
ny
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FYI ...the man F is his own god and he purports twisted views to all of you climbers ... and no one ever challenges him.
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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Atheism is a belief and you are your own God... that is your religion.
which is rather silly statement. I believe the implication being that without an absolute ethical framework against which your morals are judged by some supernatural authority, "God", that you sort of make it all up on your own?
that you have no purpose other than that which that "God" has conveyed on you?
that you are exceptional because "God" made you that way?
..not believing in "God" also encompasses not believing in your own self as being "God", too...
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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P.Rob, I know where the quote comes from, is Schaeffer saying that he heard Feynman say this and is conveying it to us.. even then, it would be attributed to some meeting at some time and some place...
my point is, that it is only a quote from Schaeffer, and not found elsewhere... I doubt it.
On the Schaeffer site, I also read a story regarding Lev Landau which makes it sound like he wanted to be "saved," where that was interpreted in a Christian sense... also highly doubtful that the story has anything at all to do with religion...
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Andree Hussar
Social climber
ny
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Reread what you stated and it makes no sense
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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Ms. Hussar, why do you say atheists believe that they are, themselves, "god"?
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WBraun
climber
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Ed
Since you don't know what "God" really is you wouldn't really fully understand what she means by that.
It's not a simple black and white understanding ........
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Andree Hussar
Social climber
ny
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I am on the east coast and need to sleep!!!!!!!!
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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go to sleep then...
Werner... how could you say this: Since you don't know what "God" really is... I actually think I have a working understanding of it... and even on a non-intellectual level. If you are implying that having rejected the notion of "God" demonstrates that I didn't understand it, well I think you are speculating.
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Andree Hussar
Social climber
ny
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I was going to sleep until this non sequiter video was posted...
And the God I believe in has revealed himself in the bible and I reccomend reading the book of John as it seems no one has any knowlege of the bible.
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WBraun
climber
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Ed -- "I actually think I have a working understanding of it"
Then explain it.
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Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
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why would you assume no one has knowledge of the bible? because they disagree?
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Sierra Ledge Rat
Mountain climber
Old and Broken Down in Appalachia
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I found my Blind Faith at a drug party in Newport in the early or mid-1970s.
I was deeply religious when I was young. But as I grew older, wiser and better educated I saw that religion was for primitive or simple people.
They need something that helps them make sense of the universe. Unfortunately, religion and the religious mindset is passed on the the children.
It's like Santa Claus. Well, I'm here to tell you that there ain't no Santa Claus, or Tooth Fairy or Easter Bunny.
Eventually you grow up and then you don't need Santa Claus anymore. Same applies to God. Some people just never grow up, I guess.
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Andree Hussar
Social climber
ny
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I was deeply religious when I was young. But as I grew older, wiser and better educated I saw that religion was for primitive or simple people.
They need something that helps them make sense of the universe. Me, I revel in being confused and perplexed by the universe.
So you "revel" in being confused and perplexed?!!!!
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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shouldn't you go to bed Ms. Hussar? the thread will still be here when you get back to it
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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for you Werner... John chapter 3, 6
What is born of flesh is flesh and what is born of spirit is spirit.
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