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WBraun
climber
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Americans love violence and killing.
Yeah .... Americans are stupid ......
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Why wasn't there post war murder in the streets?
there was. among other problems. it's no accident that mid- and late forties were the birthplace of film noir. there was also a fairly serious recession and a good deal of worry about de-mobbing. that's one of the reasons for the gi bill and its various expansions.
the unusual thing about ww2 in the us, was that it was followed, quickly, by another military escalation and industrial boom. not to mention still another ground war (korea) and then another (vietnam).
ww1 was different, partly because the us entered the war late and had nothing like the ground troops experience of the brits and euros. the aftermath of ww1 in europe was chaos. in the us, the effect was more muted.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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dmt, yeah, direct and then voluntary censorship in hollywood and elsewhere became part of the culture. when raymond chandler wrote the screenplay for the blue dahlia, the navy intervened (the govt had prior approval over all scripts pertaining to the war and/or vets) and forced rewrites after chandler had tried to make a realistic portrayal of a ptsd vet.
prior to ww2, you didnt get much discussion of trauma in pop culture because depth psychology didn't become part of a common american vocabulary until ww2. freudian psychology was assimiliated earlier in intellectual circles, but depth psych generally was a mid-2oth c phenomenon.
and so was the idea of the "veteran" as a culture hero. before ww2, enlistees in the armed forces were pretty much the lowest of the low in terms of status. the army traditionally had been manned by mercenaries, immigrants, criminals, and lumpenproles. the officer corps was different (white souther elites were traditionally over-represented there), but veterans were not, as a category, seen as entitled to respect of any particular sort. in pop culture, "soldiering" was a euphemism for masturbation.
so in the md-forties you see this sudden explosion of films, novels and journalism that does indeed talk in fairly modern and honest ways about what we now call ptsd, but that move is quickly overwhelmed by new and heroic portrayals of vets to create the sort of cluster thread we get here, with the warring camps divided up on either side of depth psych and modern brain science.
remember macarthur turning the cavalry on the bonus marchers, the ww1 vets who camped out in washington, d.c., to request assistance from the govt. it wasn't until the mass mobilizations of ww2 that american pop culture decided that armed forces services was intrinsically worthy.
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rand0M aXiS
Trad climber
Beserkeley
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Copter dropped coffee cups to warn Rainier campers
SEATTLE — A helicopter crew searching for the gunman who killed a Mount Rainier National Park ranger on New Year’s Day came across a small group of campers and used an unusual method to warn them the shooter was at large.
The crew of the Bellingham-based Customs and Border Protection helicopter wrote messages on paper coffee cups and dropped them to the campers on Monday morning telling them of the danger.
The first cup said, “A ranger has been shot shooter at large. Call on cell if able.” As the group packed up camp, the chopper swooped over them and dropped another message: “Take road to falls and sheriff deputies. We will keep an eye on you.”
One of the hikers, Natalia Martinez-Paz, wrote about the experience in a post at www.nwhikers.net .
http://www.spokesman.com/stories/2012/jan/05/copter-dropped-coffee-cups-warn-rainier-campers/
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Seamstress
Trad climber
Yacolt, WA
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Jan 11, 2012 - 05:11pm PT
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Several of my friends were in that parking lot on Rainier that day and owe a ddep debt to the Rangers, including Margaret, who actly selflessly and swiftly to avoid a larger tragedy.
My frineds were donw back country skiing on fabulous new snow and headed to their cars. As the trunks and doors were open, Rangers yelled to get into the building. Folks continued to sort their gear, intending to go to the building as soon as they packed up. But the Rangers hollered more insistently that they needed to RUN to the building, and armed man was shooting people and may be on the way to the parking lot. People ran to the building, leaving their cars unlocked, doors ajar, gear all over.
Inside, the public was told to make themselves comfortable as they would probably be there awhile. Armed Rangers were with them. Folks were asked if they had any firearms. While it is legal to have arms in the park, t is not permissable to have them in that building. Three people surrendered their guns very cooperatively. THe Park Service opened the Commisary, providing food, pizza, and even beer free of charge to the people hunkered in the room.
Folks were not permitted to use the public restrooms as they were visible to the outside. Instead people were instructed to go downstairs to the employee restroom, and a long line formed, thanks to the beer and pizza consumed. As my friends waited on the stairs to the bathroom, some scuffling was heard above. A woman investigated and came back white as a sheet. "Men are brandishing guns and telling people to put their hands behind their heads." The people collected at the bathrooms and debated if they should make a break for it or join the others upstairs in the "position". A quick group consensus formed that the gunholders were probably law enforcement and not the gunman. So upstairs they went and assumed the position. In a short period of time, the law enforcement officers determined that the gunman and any potential accomplices were not among this crowd at the Visitor Center.
The Rangers and these law enforcement officers treated people very well, despite the obvious difficulties of the situation. My friends speak glowingly of the professionalism and humanity of these people. THat is particularly significant to me since these are cynical, backwoodsmen providing these compliments.
In the wee hours, law enforcement was pretty sure that they were tracking the subkect miles away from Paradise. However, the gunman did have a commanding headstart. THey gathered people, 5 at a time, to be escorted out of the Park. My friends were in the second group to leave. As they were hurried to their vehicles, they could see the law enforcement surrounding the building, obviously concerned and protecting the precious visitors inside. Officials took the lead and trailing spots in the convoy, and they were escorted down the hill. My friend attempted to remove his chains, but was not permitted to do so. They drove 12 miles on pavement with their chains stil on. It was deemed to risky to stop.
In Ashford, the escort left them and retuirned uphill to accompany the next group down the hill. In Ashford, the public was directed to another facility. Here the FBI questioned everyone further. After that questioning, they were permitted to drive home.
It was a harrowing day for all on the mountain. But my friends can not say enough about how carefully the Park considered the safety of their guests.
Many of us visit Rainier a few times a year. We have all met Margaret, though we didn't necessarily know her by name. We all remember her as a friendly and helpful woman on the mountain. Every time we return to Rainier, we will think of her again. The press quickly moves on to the next high profile event and forgets about Margaret. None of us in this small community will forget about her, and I hope her husband and children will realize just how much regard we have for her.
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mariaji
Social climber
Tucson, AZ
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Jan 11, 2012 - 11:09pm PT
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We send all our love to her family. Although we didn't know you personally, we grieve deeply for your family's loss.
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saa
climber
not much of a
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Jul 23, 2012 - 12:03pm PT
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Most sincere sorrows to those M Anderson loved. Really. This is terrible.
However, if i may, all rangers are not angels. I ran into a bitch from hell in YNP in 2010. I was working for the park.
We had a summer storm flood july 16 2010, and took refugees at Merced LAke Ranger
Station. She complined we had accepted guests. Water was raging. Logs 80 lbs coming down in the wild stream.
She was in absentia. Later, her professional assessment, paid by your taxpayer dollar,
Was:"people should cross the water even if it s hip high. '" Sure! The drowning death toll is not high enough. It is shocking YNP employs such persons. A professor at Stanford is. Ot neceSsarily a good ranger. Yet despite complaints from other YNP employees she
Was rehired.
Sorry to spread disappointment over a thread that morns a good lady.
The sadness is: it is the good ones who go first. Much sorrow to those of Ms anderson
Very fondly sorry for the loss of her
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Jul 23, 2012 - 12:06pm PT
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saa, that's a 'shit sandwich' share. Why go to the trouble of dredging up a thread untouched for months to post a 'condolences-rangers can be as#@&%es-condolences' comment?
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Anastasia
climber
InLOVEwithAris.
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Jul 23, 2012 - 03:21pm PT
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Not true... The vets of World War I camping in front of the White House during the Great Depression in Protest of their care. They were begging for help and is one of the big reasons Herbert Hoover was moved out of the White House.
The Great Gatsby and other such novels were about the jaded guys coming back from The Great War. A bunch of uncaring, dysfunctional alcoholics. PTSD is just a name for an old problem we always knew about.
Sadly society has always known tragedy. I think some cultures are just more accepting of it and deal with it directly while most in the U.S. like to avoid. Avoiding is what gets us in trouble.
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