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survival
Big Wall climber
A Token of My Extreme
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Sep 30, 2011 - 03:24am PT
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Rick Perry is a dangerous droid.
and not nearly as handsome as he thinks he is.
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apogee
climber
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Boy, it would have been soooo much more helpful if that story came out after Perry secured the nomination.
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nutjob
Gym climber
Berkeley, CA
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Oct 14, 2011 - 07:19pm PT
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Why is it that income from speculative investment in financial instruments triggers less taxes than a company that builds something or a person's labor on behalf of a company? This tells me our government prioritizes speculative investing as the preferred means of income generation rather than creating something of value. This is a core part of the rot in our country, and it is wholly embraced by republican leaders (if not by the people who vote for them).
Tax breaks to companies and wealthy individuals will not create more jobs. Companies don't hire people because they have more money. Companies hire people only if they see no other way to make MORE money. For example, if they sell out of their products or services because demand is high, they have no choice but to invest in making more products or services for sale. If they can figure out how to do this for less money, they do it: automation, off-shoring, etc. Companies exist to make money, not to perform the community service of creating employment.
IT IS RETARDED TO THINK THAT CUTTING TAXES CREATES JOBS!
The way to create jobs is to create demand, i.e. enable people to buy things from companies. But how do you do that when people don't have income from jobs to go out and buy products and services that trigger companies to hire more workers? This is the role of government spending, of making an "investment" in the economy which will later get paid back with tax revenues from all those working folks. Equating individual household economics to the role of a government is a disingenuous argument by wealthy/powerful folks to herd well-meaning republicans in their direction. When governments spend on programs that benefit a large percentage of society, it is an INVESTMENT IN FUTURE INCOME GENERATION, it is not "living beyond our means" like overspending a credit card.
On the other hand, if you keep cutting taxes, you create a downward spiral of smaller government offering less services and regulation and security of the population, which results in less income for the government to tax, which calls for smaller government, then less taxes, then less government.... eventually you get back to farmer peasants in fear for their lives, themselves and their children working every hour to give their harvest to the castle owner in exchange for the physical protection of the stone wall that just keeps out the neighbor barrons who are exactly like your boss/landlord/ruler.
I don't like straight welfare systems, but I am supportive of government spending in exchange for some form of work that creates something of value in the country. I want to see people get paid by the government to pick up trash on the side of the highway, getting paid to offer home-based subsidized daycare so other parents can work rather than sit home with kids and collect a welfare or unemployment check that is larger than their alternative of working minus child daycare expenses. I want to see government spending on transportation, medical care, education, basic science research, etc.
Fatty, if you want my vote in 2012 I should have heard this coming from you. You may be a nice person in real life, and you may be super-generous, but in your policies you are a pig making jokes that aren't funny. It's like Marie Antoinette saying, "they have no bread? Let them eat cake."
Remorse Edit 20 minutes later:
Sorry for singling you out Fatty. When there's this whole amorphous messed up system, it's hard to figure out where to vent it. You're certainly not the cause of it, and I don't know enough about what you really believe and support to justify an opinion about you.
I would like to see someone who feels like being a new political leader to take the reins of the Wall-Street Sit-In crowd and channel that angst into a productive direction: (1) publicizing the relationship between taxes, government spending, corporations, and job creation to counter the standard bs; (2)creating a more focused set of government spending priorities and initiatives that would broadly support employment while improving our civilization.
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Brandon-
climber
The Granite State.
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Oct 14, 2011 - 07:26pm PT
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Funny, Fattrad said that same thing here a few days back.
Giving the power to corporations doesn't work. The people are woefully uninformed. The general populace vote for commercials.
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guyman
Trad climber
Moorpark, CA.
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Oct 15, 2011 - 03:04pm PT
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I think we all pay way to much in taxes. Period.
The government is stealing from all of us.
Who gives them the right to confiscate so much from us?
Wake up and see that it really does not matter who the hell gets elected, we will be Fu@ked no matter what.
Have a nice day.... carry on.
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August West
Trad climber
Where the wind blows strange
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Oct 17, 2011 - 02:07pm PT
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Guyman,
What gives you the right to live in society that is generally free from violence, where you can call 911 to get police/fire/ambulance service, where you can live your life in many different ways (dirtbag climber, small business owner, etc)?
Where education, roads, national security are all provided for you?
It's not theft, it's a bargain...
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dirtbag
climber
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Oct 17, 2011 - 02:10pm PT
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If you want a functional, civil society, then pay up. Peace, freedom, and yes, prosperity costs money.
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survival
Big Wall climber
A Token of My Extreme
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Oct 17, 2011 - 02:30pm PT
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No. But thanks for checking in.....
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Oct 17, 2011 - 02:34pm PT
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CA says (because he is scared to post under his name)
Sure, the poor pay pay the other taxes you mention, but proportionately less also - the rich also pay disproportionately high property taxes (naturally), capital gains taxes (I don't know many poor people who pay these), social security and medicare taxes (getting far less than they pay in for these programs to subsidize the poor), and you forgot to mention state taxes - the bottom 50% pay almost none of these either in most states.
Property taxes: It is true, that if you are the wealthy landowner who owns everything, then you are the poor unfortunate that has to pay the property taxes on it. And as the wealthy have, in the last century, been taking over the possession of the property of the country, they do pay these taxes.
HOWEVER, for residential property, property taxes are figured into the rent, and passed along to the renter. Anyone who has ever owned rental property knows this.
CAPITAL GAINS TAXES: What a bizarre argument! These taxes are special REDUCED tax rates IN PLACE OF regular tax rates that are usually MUCH higher. The are available only on investments that would be available to wealthier people, that GREATLY reduce their taxes!
So his argument that only wealthy people have (he really means "get") to pay this tax is true! EVERYONE ELSE HAS TO PAY HIGHER TAX RATES ON INCOME
Social Security and Medicare taxes are capped at $125,000 of income, and has been for many many years. So the effective limit has been coming down.
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Norton
Social climber
the Wastelands
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Oct 17, 2011 - 02:38pm PT
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Correction:
Social Security has a cap on the first roughly 106K of "earned" income, NOT including dividends or capital gains.
Medicare has no limit, one pays 1.9% on EARNED income with no maximum cap.
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guyman
Trad climber
Moorpark, CA.
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Oct 18, 2011 - 01:09am PT
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Guyman,
What gives you the right to live in society that is generally free from violence, where you can call 911 to get police/fire/ambulance service, where you can live your life in many different ways (dirtbag climber, small business owner, etc)?
Where education, roads, national security are all provided for you?
It's not theft, it's a bargain...
I do pay a lot in taxes, and for the most part I am happy to pay these taxes. I am very concerned because as I see it, the government just feels it can raise taxes to cover decades of it's wasteful practices. The time is now to do something about it.
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nature
climber
back in Tuscon Aridzona....
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Oct 19, 2011 - 12:14am PT
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http://www.cnn.com/?refresh=1
Stick a fork in him. Turn him over. He's done.
Romney shreaded Perry. Jon Stewart will have a field day with the exchange tomorrow.
I wonder who Mit will select as his VP candidate?
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S.Leeper
Sport climber
Pflugerville, Texas
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Nov 10, 2011 - 01:27am PT
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what a mooor-on
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survival
Big Wall climber
A Token of My Extreme
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Nov 10, 2011 - 01:35am PT
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I love watching conservatives try to think. Brings me joy.
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apogee
climber
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Nov 10, 2011 - 01:40am PT
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"I wonder who Mit will select as his VP candidate?"
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