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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Aug 19, 2011 - 11:22am PT
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Truly, is there anything more boring than a climbing film? Well, OK, a bouldering film is more boring, but other than that?
It's definitely not a spectator sport.
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Da_Dweeb
climber
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Aug 19, 2011 - 11:32am PT
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Are you a guy or a girl?
In fact Prod, I am the unholy offspring of a guy AND a girl.
Trip on THAT one for a bit...
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Walla Walla, WA
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Aug 19, 2011 - 11:34am PT
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Is there anything worthwhile to hook at basecamp? As a former hooker (of some reputation) myself, it's hard to imagine anything really "hookable" there. But I'm certainly prepared to be corrected on that score.
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Walla Walla, WA
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Aug 19, 2011 - 11:36am PT
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And, if there's shyt there, past experience tells me to stay away... that I in fact WOULD want to miss it, or have it miss me. Just my own pathology, I'm sure.
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Walla Walla, WA
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Aug 19, 2011 - 11:50am PT
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Oooo... I feel all warm and fuzzy all over now. Yak manager? You're thinking of all the angles. Yer right... can't miss it! Onions? Mmmm... be there or be square!
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Da_Dweeb
climber
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Aug 19, 2011 - 11:51am PT
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In any case, like it or not, on this issue Pete is a voice that can't be ignored - both through his persistent loudmouth-ness, and the fact that he has a history of actual physical investigation into the climb itself. Back from the early days of this controversy kicking up on McTopo, Petey was the first to buck up, investigate and attempt the climb himself, and recognize that he had been wrong both about the climb, and about Mark and Richard. (This is a feat others have claimed that they WOULD do but haven't, as yet, not to put too fine a point on it.) And he had the grit to admit that he was initially wrong, too. So Hater & pals can go ahead and try to minimize or silence him, I notice that's a general strategy they've got going on for anyone who provides an argument that runs counter to their own. But you know what? Pete's got a big mouth. And a loud mouth. And it does not stop talking. And I'm glad for it, too. I'm glad that Mark and Richard have an advocate in someone who has investigated the climb, decided that much of what's been said about it is BS, and has the brass balls to not shut up about that fact, even in the face of the flak he gets for it. Kudos to you, sir Pete.
Now, between the articles and the documentary coming up, I once again suggest that it might be time for all parties concerned to suck it up, and make some kind of peace. Think about how it's going to look if some kind of reconciliation can't be made by the time this stuff goes to press. Just give it some thought, all I'm saying is that it may be in everyone's best interest to find a way to settle this and put it to rest.
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Aug 19, 2011 - 11:55am PT
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On with the documentary! May I suggest a title? How about "Tempest in a Teapot".....er, you better make that Thimble.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Aug 19, 2011 - 12:00pm PT
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Kindergarden Climbers?
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neversummer
Trad climber
30 mins. from suicide USA
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Aug 19, 2011 - 12:09pm PT
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I thought he was the YAK milker ?
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Prod
Trad climber
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Aug 19, 2011 - 12:31pm PT
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In fact Prod, I am the unholy offspring of a guy AND a girl.
Trip on THAT one for a bit...
I guess it is really none of my business, but I was curious. I read some of your other posts and figured that you are a guy. No need to trip on anything.
Prod.
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bergbryce
Mountain climber
South Lake Tahoe, CA
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Aug 19, 2011 - 12:38pm PT
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I'm a few hundred posts behind on this thread.... A movie?? What??
Anyways, I just finished the book. It's a great read. Had no idea they spent 3(?) days waiting out a storm that put snow on the top of el cap. In a waterfall.
The stats were clearly stated in the appendix. Drill and hole count as well as their later thoughts on Sea of Dreams. Really, what's to argue??
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Walla Walla, WA
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Aug 19, 2011 - 01:52pm PT
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Jim, just curious. Basically every post from you on this subject is to keep reminding everybody that this just doesn't matter. If it doesn't matter, then why are you here on this thread that is quite clearly named? If it doesn't matter, why do you care? Your radio only plays one song, and I think that only Matt is really listening with you.
And perhaps you don't get it, but when you call it a tempest in a thimble, you are really and quite straightforwardly dissing on Ammon and Kait. They certainly thought it mattered... enough to pay their dues and take the falls and suffer the pain. Now, before they even get to tell their story, you're already dissing on it and undermining a good part of the motivation for it?!? I, for one, would be very interested to hear their story, regardless of it being about a route I did. My ascent was a long time ago. Theirs is current and sounds pretty dang exciting in its own right!
Are your own ascents just not getting that ongoing sense of importance they so richly deserve? Hmmm... maybe people find it less exciting than they should to hear a tale about spending three months trudging up a ridge in bad weather. I don't know. My guess is that you should have hired some people to shyte on you on command. From what I've seen, shyte is the key to getting noticed around here.
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Hawkeye
climber
State of Mine
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Aug 19, 2011 - 02:11pm PT
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And perhaps you don't get it, but when you call it a tempest in a thimble, you are really and quite straightforwardly dissing on Ammon and Kait. They certainly thought it mattered... enough to pay their dues and take the falls and suffer the pain. Now, before they even get to tell their story, you're already dissing on it and undermining a good part of the motivation for it?!? I, for one, would be very interested to hear their story, regardless of it being about a route I did. My ascent was a long time ago. Theirs is current and sounds pretty dang exciting in its own right!
Are your own ascents just not getting that ongoing sense of importance they so richly deserve? Hmmm... maybe people find it less exciting than they should to hear a tale about spending three months trudging up a ridge in bad weather. I don't know. My guess is that you should have hired some people to shyte on you on command. From what I've seen, shyte is the key to getting noticed around here.
while i generally believe that SG and others wrongfully diss you, you may want to go look in the mirror. stop and really take a look.....you seem to go out of your way to say, "please crap on me"....
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Aug 19, 2011 - 02:19pm PT
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Say what you will, but if Ammon was up there taking repeated wingers and "watch me" made up a significant percentage of the total on-route vocabulary then it was a bad ass endeavor whether you like the line or not. Doubly so given the claimed inexperience of the FAs.
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Prod
Trad climber
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Aug 19, 2011 - 02:31pm PT
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Look, there is really only one reason anyone has any interest left in this steaming sh#t pile of a "story". We want an answer to the question of whether it is a chiseled mess (as Grossman and Mimi continuously assert) or a quality line of hard climbing.
I do not agree with this.
First off I want a time line.
-When did they get to the valley?
-When did they start climbing the route?
-When did locals take notice?
-Who took notice?
-When was "The Meeting"?
-I've heard the route was inspected at night, and deemed a bolt ladder? Is this true? Who did the inspection? If this part is true and the route is not a bolt ladder, then in my book this party is culpabble.
-Was the night inspection before or after the meeting?
-When did the shitting and chopping take place? Were the night inspectors the shitters?
-What happened when Richard and Mark persisted and climbed the route?
2ndly.
Who were the shitters. I've heard about 5 names, some a few times from a few different sources. I find that kind of animalistic tribe behavior fascinating. Were they lowly minions of the tribe trying to make a name for their selves? Where they the respected leaders? Were they indignant individuals?
3rd. Was the route bold or a hack job?
Just my $.02
Prod.
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Bill Sherman
Mountain climber
Culver City, CA
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Aug 19, 2011 - 02:55pm PT
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Prod, some of those questions can be answered from Richard's book. With everything going on right now I went ahead and picked up a copy to read. It was a good way to spend 3 hours. It obviously can't explain the details of the who, what, and when of the choppers but it gives a really good timeline of how they underwent tackling the route on a day by day account through the first couple of weeks.
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madbolter1
Big Wall climber
Walla Walla, WA
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Aug 19, 2011 - 03:10pm PT
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you seem to go out of your way to say, "please crap on me"....
Ooo, ooo... I seem to have discovered another sacred cow that can apparently spew whatever crap HE wants and not get called on it. Okay, yup, I guess that means: "crap on me."
Sorry for my irreverence.
Not.
I bow to no man.
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Hawkeye
climber
State of Mine
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Aug 19, 2011 - 03:24pm PT
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its not a matter of bowing....when i first thought of an aid climbing movie i had the same reaction as donini...watching climbing can sometimes be like watching grass grow. but then i realized that if done right, then the movie could be entertaining.
you seem to get all butt hurt when there are any slight negative comments your way. i have given crap to SG and mimi on this and other threads because i thought that they were being ridiculous in their zeal. but you too are being ridiculous in your zeal.
i wish you nothing but the best but this whole thing has obviously caused you some severe mental issues. i hope you get over them someday but that appears to be doubtful.
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Captain...or Skully
climber
or some such
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Aug 19, 2011 - 03:26pm PT
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Please let Ron Anderson be the technical advisor for the film. He'll do it up right.
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sac
Trad climber
Sun Coast B.C.
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Aug 19, 2011 - 03:31pm PT
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You know, much is being drummed up about the crapping on the ropes.
What was quite a bit worse though was the assault made on Jensen and Smith from the Aquarian. A french team launched their paper bag of crap on them from far above, did score on Smith---covered him--- and then the french finished their climb. They even jeered down to the WOS party as it happened. That was obviously an assault. Much worse than the ropes incident.
I realize how much Mark and Richard can't help positioning themselves as embattled and martyred and they on some level need to view themselves this way even, but with this poop-throwing event, no one could blame the
While we're throwing more wood on the fire...
This from P.Haan upthread.
I'm a climber
I care.
Stoke.
A. Durie.
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