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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Nov 18, 2016 - 10:00am PT
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What other industry permits this?
What industry doesn't?
So, DMT, what yer saying is get rid of those farmer industrialists and we'll solve our illegal immigrant problems? ;-)
The trouble is that a lot of Democrats also depend on those farmers. We're all in the boat together and it is getting really hard to row with the hull dragging on the bottom.
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Fat Dad
Trad climber
Los Angeles, CA
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Nov 18, 2016 - 10:02am PT
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True, Reilly, but the level of government and public aid seems that much higher with the big water consumers. Maybe timber companies come in a distant second.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Nov 18, 2016 - 10:16am PT
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How you gonna get all the local water fiefdoms to relinquish their inholy control, let alone help
row the big boat? Our friends moved to the vinelands just east of Paso Robles five years ago.
The place they bought had a 400' well that was down to a trickle. They're hoping their new
800 footer will last them but their puny one incher can't begin to compete with the vineyards'
two and three inchers. The local water board is more corrupt than a Chicago councilman
BITD, and that's sayin' sumpin', isn't it? "We need another study." A time honored paean to
prevarication and corruption. Yo, some things don't need no stinkin' studies, nawmean?
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Nov 18, 2016 - 11:31am PT
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Call me a realist but I strongly suspect it will get done only after the boat is high and dry,
or more appropriately, low and dry.
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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Nov 21, 2016 - 08:53am PT
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My combination rain gauge / squirrel feeder is registering a good half-inch.
This beats the hell out of El Niño.
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 21, 2016 - 09:29am PT
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So...
It is pissing down rain here, wild wet and wooly, the Celtic Sea is foaming at its... mouth???
And I just want to bump any non-political thread. I am all for free speech, honestly, even as a journalist, but...
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 21, 2016 - 09:56am PT
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Still pissing down here in the Southeast. Hey Bald Eagle Dave, what's Bristol like now? Wet, windy, wild?
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Gnome Ofthe Diabase
climber
Out Of Bed
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Nov 28, 2016 - 04:40am PT
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Not as bad as it will get with coming cloud of Rump yer azz anti environment
monitizing the air you breath if they could no administration
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August West
Trad climber
Where the wind blows strange
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Nov 28, 2016 - 11:15am PT
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That's kind of what I mean, too, and what I mean by 'just like with oil.' But we all know it and the farmers know it better than most: we can't keep growing more crops, more people, more houses, more economy; cannot. Sooner or later and probably sooner, we run out of water in a really hard way.
I guess it depends on what you mean by run out of water. Our current agricultural production is not sustainable because we are mining groundwater (faster than it is replenished). Not to mention the regions where we are degrading the land.
In general, I think growing nuts, fruits, and vegetables is a better than lawns and golf courses. But, despite their undeniable political power, agriculture uses the vast majority of the water while only contributing 2% or so to the CA economy. For CA as a whole, I don't think water shortage is going to effect cities and the economy. When push comes to shove, there are way more suburban/urban voters who expect water to come out of the tap than farmers.
I put zero water on my lawn. (It's rather neat, if you don't water, you end up with drought tolerant vegetation). I never wash my truck. When I take a shower, the water comes from the Sacramento river and it goes back to the Sac and can still be used by those down south (or for the benefit of fish in the delta).
There will be specific parts of the economies and no doubt some specific towns that get hard. It really is a shame that we can't manage it better for better long term use.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Nov 29, 2016 - 02:27pm PT
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Wettest first two months of the fall in 30 years (in NorCal)!
"California’s northern Sierra Nevada mountain range, home to some of the state’s largest reservoirs, had the wettest first two months of the water year since 1984, the National Weather Service said Tuesday. Between October and November, the eight measuring stations along the northern range received an average of 18 inches of precipitation, or about 200% above average for the first two months of the state’s water year, said meteorologist Eric Kurth of the National Weather Service in Sacramento. The lone exception was 1984-85, which also happens to be the last time there was this much precipitation in the northern Sierra Nevada, Kurth said. The heavy precipitation came mostly in October, when storms soaked Northern California. The Sierra Nevada’s eight-station index recorded more than 12 inches of precipitation, or about four times the average for October, Kurth said.
While the milestone may be a good omen for the water year ahead, it’s also highlighted more short-term, positive impacts on California.
On Nov. 3, the U.S. Drought Monitor reported that about a quarter of California was out of drought conditions, the best outlook the state has had since spring 2013, when 64% of the state was considered in “moderate drought” or worse.
The U.S. Drought Monitor relies heavily on precipitation levels and soil moisture to assess conditions, state water officials said. For that reason, an unusually wet October, such as the one Northern California experienced, would show some areas as having escaped drought.
In the meantime, much of the Southland remains parched as the state enters a sixth year of drought.
The southern Sierra Nevada range has received about 88% of its average precipitation for the first two months of the water year while the central region has received about 139%, according to the latest data available from the Department of Water Resources. "
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Nov 30, 2016 - 09:33am PT
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Hilmar Youths Water Board Experience
jholland@modbee.com
SACRAMENTO
A state panel heard arguments Tuesday for providing more river water for fish – and from Hilmar FFA members who said this would devastate farmers.
The State Water Resources Control Board launched its formal hearing on a proposed doubling of flows on the lower Stanislaus, Tuolumne and Merced rivers each February through June.
Fishing and environmental groups had most of the scheduled time, and they used it to contend that salmon and other fish have suffered from diversions to farms and cities.
The Hilmar High School students took advantage of the brief slots for the general public to warn of the consequences: Less water for almonds, dairy feed and other crops. More pumping of already-stressed groundwater. Less income for truckers who haul farm products and for one parent who makes his living spreading manure.
“My family (is) fourth-generation farmers in the Central Valley, and I would like to grow up to be a fifth-generation farmer,” student Ethan Jones told the board. “However, I am worried that it may not be possible.”
Hilmar sent about 25 of the 400 members in its chapter of FFA, originally known as Future Farmers of America.
“Our community revolves around farms and dairies,” member Derek Rios said. “Without them, our community will be nothing.”
The hearing will move to Stockton on Dec. 16, to Merced on Dec. 19 and to Modesto on Dec. 20. The board will hold a final session in Sacramento on Jan. 3 and take written comment until Jan. 17. It could make a final decision in July.
The plan calls for boosting the rivers to 40 percent of the natural flow in pre-dam times. The three rivers combined are at about 20 percent now, but the Stanislaus already is under a somewhat higher standard.
J.D. Richey, a fishing guide in the Sacramento-San Joaquin Delta, supported a large increase in flows.
“My industry is in disrepair right now – total collapse,” he said. “The main reason for that is lack of water.”
Environmental leaders said the low flows lead to high water temperatures and other problems for salmon and steelhead trout, which both travel between the rivers and the Pacific Ocean. Kyle Jones of Sierra Club California urged a 60 percent level.
Read more here: http://www.modbee.com/news/article117852048.html#storylink=cpy
The proposal also aims to reduce salinity in the Delta, which is tapped as a water supply for much of California.
The water board’s staff projects a 14 percent drop in river supplies in average years, and 38 percent in “critically dry” years. Farmers, city water suppliers and other critics say the state has underestimated the lost income and jobs.
“We’re looking at probably 800 small farms disappearing if this gets implemented, if this doesn’t get changed,” said Gail Delihant, director of California government affairs for Western Growers.
Danny Merkley, director of water resources for the California Farm Bureau Federation, also blasted the plan. “This proposal is a taking, and it’s taking legal water rights away,” he said.
The upcoming hearings will include scheduled speakers from cities, farm groups and other people in each of the three affected counties.
http://www.modbee.com/news/article117852048.html#storylink=cpy
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Nov 30, 2016 - 09:36am PT
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Hilmar Youths' Water Board Experience
jholland@modbee.com
SACRAMENTO
A state panel heard arguments Tuesday for providing more river water for fish – and from Hilmar FFA members who said this would devastate farmers.
The State Water Resources Control Board launched its formal hearing on a proposed doubling of flows on the lower Stanislaus, Tuolumne and Merced rivers each February through June.
Fishing and environmental groups had most of the scheduled time, and they used it to contend that salmon and other fish have suffered from diversions to farms and cities.
The Hilmar High School students took advantage of the brief slots for the general public to warn of the consequences: Less water for almonds, dairy feed and other crops. More pumping of already-stressed groundwater. Less income for truckers who haul farm products and for one parent who makes his living spreading manure.
“My family (is) fourth-generation farmers in the Central Valley, and I would like to grow up to be a fifth-generation farmer,” student Ethan Jones told the board. “However, I am worried that it may not be possible.”
Hilmar sent about 25 of the 400 members in its chapter of FFA, originally known as Future Farmers of America.
“Our community revolves around farms and dairies,” member Derek Rios said. “Without them, our community will be nothing.”
The hearing will move to Stockton on Dec. 16, to Merced on Dec. 19 and to Modesto on Dec. 20. The board will hold a final session in Sacramento on Jan. 3 and take written comment until Jan. 17. It could make a final decision in July.
The plan calls for boosting the rivers to 40 percent of the natural flow in pre-dam times. The three rivers combined are at about 20 percent now, but the Stanislaus already is under a somewhat higher standard.
J.D. Richey, a fishing guide in the Sacramento-San Joaquin Delta, supported a large increase in flows.
“My industry is in disrepair right now – total collapse,” he said. “The main reason for that is lack of water.”
Environmental leaders said the low flows lead to high water temperatures and other problems for salmon and steelhead trout, which both travel between the rivers and the Pacific Ocean. Kyle Jones of Sierra Club California urged a 60 percent level.
The water board’s staff projects a 14 percent drop in river supplies in average years, and 38 percent in “critically dry” years. Farmers, city water suppliers and other critics say the state has underestimated the lost income and jobs.
“We’re looking at probably 800 small farms disappearing if this gets implemented, if this doesn’t get changed,” said Gail Delihant, director of California government affairs for Western Growers.
Danny Merkley, director of water resources for the California Farm Bureau Federation, also blasted the plan. “This proposal is a taking, and it’s taking legal water rights away,” he said.
The upcoming hearings will include scheduled speakers from cities, farm groups and other people in each of the three affected counties.
http://www.modbee.com/news/article117852048.html#storylink=cpy
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rwedgee
Ice climber
CA
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Dec 16, 2016 - 07:14pm PT
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The Santa Clara river was flowing along the 14 freeway for the 1st time in years but the water was black from all the ash from the Sand Fire...and stunk something fierce. It smelled like after a house burns down, that wet sulfur ash stink, similar to a swamp.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
Sands Motel , Las Vegas
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Dec 17, 2016 - 09:40am PT
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Love those sneaky rider bills...Thanks a bunch Feinsteen...
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Dec 17, 2016 - 10:43am PT
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to provide more water for LA
Not true. We don't want it, and are planning for a future without it.
(but it's nice to have a target, eh?)
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Dec 17, 2016 - 11:00am PT
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I was having a conversation last night with a friend, on the issue of desal.
I mentioned that it is an extreme technology, based upon very energy intensive usage, that makes it a less desirable alternative, due to cost.
He couldn't understand what I was saying, as he thought that if you used solar, the energy is essentially free. I couldn't seem to get past that.
So I sent him this:
http://energyinnovation.org/2015/02/07/levelized-cost-of-energy/
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Brandon-
climber
The Granite State.
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Dec 18, 2016 - 09:41am PT
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I read that the American at Chili Bar (not sure which fork, I'm not a boater) was going to be running around 20k CFS. Sounds like a fish story, anyone see it with their own eyes? I can find the link if anyone cares.
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