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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Jun 10, 2010 - 02:20pm PT
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In the case of Jerry Clown, there's no need to lie. An accurate recital of his record should be enough to elect Whitman.
You mean the record surplus under Brown will be enough to elect Whitman? I don't get it.
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Ksolem
Trad climber
Monrovia, California
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Jun 10, 2010 - 02:49pm PT
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Jerry Brown from a live radio speech in 1995:
The conventional viewpoint says we need a jobs program and we need to cut welfare. Just the opposite! We need more welfare and fewer jobs. Jobs for every American is doomed to failure because of modern automation and production. We ought to recognize it and create an income-maintenance system so every single American has the dignity and the wherewithal for shelter, basic food, and medical care. I’m talking about welfare for all. Without it, you’re going to have warfare for all. Without a universal health care like every other civilized country, without a minimum level of income, this country will explode. You can’t blame the guy at the bottom forever. At some point there’s a reaction and we’ll see that the real criminals are those calling the tune, making the rules, and walking to the bank. We have the money, we have the brain power. The United States now has the highest measured wealth of any nation ever in the history of the world. We could rebuild our cities, we could create the kind of buying power and community well-being that will provide for peace. The guaranteed income is one way. Another way is to have always the availability of work in a nonprofit, in community service. A third is to start giving people training to develop skills where they can be self-supporting. You could come up with a cash supplement. Even conservatives have suggested a negative income tax to cut out the bureaucracy. If we were smart, we’d get rid of welfare and give people a family assistance like they do in Europe…
The problem isn’t even a problem. Automation and technology would be a great boon if it were creative, if there were more leisure, more opportunity to engage in raising a family, providing guidance to the young, all the stuff we say we need. America will work if we’re all in it together. It’ll work when there’s a shared sense of destiny. It can be done! It’s all there! What isn’t there is the leadership to create the kind of social network, the safety net, the distribution that would truly create a just and equal society…
We have to restore power to the family, to the neighborhood, and the community with a non-market principle, a principle of equality, of charity, of let’s-take-care-of-one-another. That’s the creative challenge. First, expose relentlessly the big lie that comes over the tube every night-that if you just go out and find that job, and work harder, it’ll all be fine. It won’t! There’s not enough work to go around and a lot of the pay is not fair. Unless you totally yank up that system and create a better one, unless the spirit changes, unless the heart opens, unless we confront power with the truth of our own unarmed but absolute fearless truth, we’re not going to overcome it. Evil is too embedded to be overcome by anything other than a spiritual challenge.
A shared sense of destiny? Right. For a society of dependents. Count me out please.
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apogee
climber
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Jun 10, 2010 - 02:59pm PT
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"Count me out please."
Aside from Jerry's interesting past, and Meg's election-crushing amounts of $, Brown's candidacy is going to simply reinforce the immovable partisanship that exists in politics these days. We really don't need that kinda shite.
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dirtbag
climber
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Jun 10, 2010 - 03:20pm PT
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Good one!
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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Jun 10, 2010 - 03:28pm PT
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Too funny, Skip.
I've actually visited the "governor's mansion" during Brown's years. While I agree with fattrad that he may have moved from his "Governor Moonbeam" days, I have at least the following criticisms of his terms as governor:
1. During his term, state support for the University of California as a percentage of its operating budget fell precipitously. Reagan got the camel's nose in the tent on tuition, but Brown wholeheartedly pushed in the rest of the body.
2. His judicial appointments were an affront to the law and to justice. For years, whenever we came accross a ridiculous decision, the first question competent lawyers would ask is "Was that written by a Brown appointee or a legitimate judge?"
3. Adrianna Gianturco. Her unilateral conversion of the Santa Monica Freeway into one with a diamond lane was so egregious it drew the ire of normally liberal Paul Conrad and erstwhile Brown supporters at the USC law school. Later, she added a lane over Sepulveda Pass intending to use it as a diamond lane for buses. Only after it was built did she and her department discover that the buses used by the RTD could not even make 30 mph up that grade.
4. His inability to control the legislature, and the California government's contempt for the people of California during his terms, and for the taxpayers in particular, led directly to the passage of Prop. 13. We still suffer seemingly irreparable harm from the distortions and inequalities that brought about.
5. It is hard to imagine a greater enemy of California agriculture. Those who decry the disappearance of farmland in this state would have much more to cry about if he repeats his actions during his terms as governor.
6. The quote from Kris is, if anything, too mild about how bizarrely he views economics. He has no clue.
Beside all that, he couldn't even get me a proper diploma. My Berkeley diploma, bearing Reagan's signature was perfect. My master's diploma from UCLA is nonexistent. I got an embossed letter saying that they ran out of diplomas, but that I would be receiving mine in due course. That was in 1978. I'm still waiting. My law school diploma, also from UCLA, at least bears Brown's signature, but misspelled my name. As I said, incompetency followed him wherever he went!
I could go on, having lived through those wonderful '70's with the dual incompetence of Carter and Brown. No thank you for a repeat.
John
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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Jun 10, 2010 - 03:31pm PT
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How come you guys missed this: Last Tuesday June 8
Sarah Palin: Her own Quotes
"These decisions and the resulting spill have shaken the public’s confidence in the ability to safely drill. Unless government appropriately regulates oil developments and holds oil executives accountable, the public will not trust them to drill, baby, drill. And we must! Or we will be even more beholden to, and controlled by, dangerous foreign regimes that supply much of our energy. This has been a constant refrain from me. As Governor of Alaska, I did everything in my power to hold oil companies accountable in order to prove to the federal government and to the nation that Alaska could be trusted to further develop energy rich land like ANWR and NPR-A. I hired conscientious Democrats and Republicans (because this sure shouldn’t be a partisan issue) to provide me with the best advice on how we could deal with what was a corrupt system of some lawmakers and administrators who were hesitant to play hardball with some in the oil field business. (Remember the Alaska lawmakers, public decision-makers, and business executives who ended up going to jail as a result of the FBI’s investigations of oily corruption.)
Palin for regulation? What?
And yes about those titties: Any need for regulation?
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Ksolem
Trad climber
Monrovia, California
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Jun 10, 2010 - 03:38pm PT
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Ha! I knew Dr. F would fall for that line.
What a sucker.
No one has to work anymore. We'll all be free dependants of The State.
Go back to high school and read your Orwell.
The funny part is that you deny that any Democrat politico would lie, and you'll fall for that crap. Meanwhile Jerry is laughing all the way to the bank.
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apogee
climber
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Jun 10, 2010 - 03:47pm PT
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Boy, you Repubs sure get worked up about Jerry Brown.
Kinda like the way Dems froth about Sarah Palin.
Hmmm.
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Bob D'A
Trad climber
Boulder, CO
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Jun 10, 2010 - 04:45pm PT
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John wrote: I could go on, having lived through those wonderful '70's with the dual incompetence of Carter and Brown. No thank you for a repeat.
John...you really must have selective memory...Nixon, Agnew, Colson and Bob Halderman...you got extreme balls to make your above statement.
Maybe it's just how you look at government...no scruples!!! I'll take Carter over that cast of fecking criminals anytime.
You really surprised me on that one.
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Bob D'A
Trad climber
Boulder, CO
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Jun 10, 2010 - 05:06pm PT
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Fat..they were criminals...Nixon was a sociopath..the f*#k head wanted the Beatles locked up.
He wasn't a quarter of the man Carter was.
Jeff...you have been condition by dirty politics...you enjoy and like them...I don't.
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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Jun 10, 2010 - 05:17pm PT
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Wow, skip! Who was your father-in-law?
I should add that not all of Brown's appointees were bad. Otto Kaus, for one, was an extremely able justice, even if his decisions would not always have been mine. Now Bird, on the other hand . . .
Bob,
I agree that Nixon wasn't half the man Carter was. Unfortunately, Carter is a good man, but was a terrible President (and has become a terrible ex-President). He inherited an economy ripe for expansion and steady growth, and ruined it. His foreign policy was at best ineffective, and at worst, disastrous. Joan Claybrook was awful, and it's no accident that America made some of its worst cars during the Carter/Claybrook years.
Carter's heart was, by and large, in the right place, and he was individually highly intelligent and admirable. He was a poor administrator, however, and his policies were and, sad to say, remain those of someone with a big heart but an empty head.
John
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Bob D'A
Trad climber
Boulder, CO
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Jun 10, 2010 - 05:19pm PT
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What ever you say Jeff...you consistently bash Carter...he also did great things during his time in office and he wasn't a convicted criminal.
You just don't like because of his views of Israel...
John...he was far from being stupid and if we listened to him about energy...maybe we wouldn't be in this position today.
So are you saying that Ford clean up the recession he inherited from Nixon and Carter put us back in recession??
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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Jun 10, 2010 - 05:21pm PT
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Fattie
Enlighten me about Nixon’s and his achievements: [A] end of Vietnam War and more civil rights
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Jun 10, 2010 - 05:21pm PT
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Nixon had many faults, but did accomplish some worthwhile things, perhaps due to the Democrats controlling congress.
Clinton's dalliance with Lewinsky, and his lying about it, are hardly in the same league as the efforts of Nixon and associates to subvert the constitution, and Agnew's outright conviction for bribery. High crimes and misdemeanours, and felonies, subvert the fabric of government. Clinton was a dumb liar, but hardly a traitor. Probably all presidents/administrations at least at times commit unconstitutional or criminal actions. Comes with the territory. Even Lincoln. But Nixon was one of the very few to do so on a concerted basis, entirely in his own self-interest.
Had Nixon not resigned, he clearly would have been impeached by bipartisan vote of the House of Representatives, and convicted by a bipartisan vote of the Senate. Clinton wasn't.
As for Carter - well, he wasn't great, and he wasn't bad. He's been much better as an ex-president, though he can be a bit sanctimonious. And he's honest about the Middle East, unlike so many.
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Bob D'A
Trad climber
Boulder, CO
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Jun 10, 2010 - 05:31pm PT
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John...who put Paul Volcker in??
Fat..who established full diplomatic relations with China?
John...was inflation high under Nixon and Ford?
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dirtbag
climber
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Jun 10, 2010 - 05:32pm PT
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Nixon would be considered centrist by today's standards.
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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Jun 10, 2010 - 05:38pm PT
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Nixon would be considered centrist by today's standards.
Are you kidding? He'd be called a socialist commie nazi.
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apogee
climber
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Jun 10, 2010 - 05:49pm PT
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"Carter's heart was, by and large, in the right place, and he was individually highly intelligent and admirable."
And he didn't start a war costing thousands of lives based on false information.
And he didn't do shady dealings with Iran.
And he didn't get impeached.
Gosh, by comparison, I'd say Carter was a pretty darn good POTUS!
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Jeremy Handren
climber
NV
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Jun 10, 2010 - 05:58pm PT
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In many ways the alternative energy technologies that we are now buying from China, Denmark etc...got their first real kick start from Carter. If the Republagumby in Chief hadn't taken over the White House and started America on a trajectory that was to demolish (among others) its alternative energy industries, we'd be in a lot better shape than we are now.
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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Jun 10, 2010 - 06:01pm PT
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Please tell one thing Republicans have done for this Country in the Last 30 years??
They've dismantled our industrial capacity.
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