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Matt
Trad climber
places you shouldn't talk about in polite company
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Topic Author's Reply - Dec 13, 2006 - 12:50pm PT
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karl-
i have been flying alot lately, and i have taken to casually mentioning to the TSA epmloyees (there is now typically a person located before the xray machine whose sole purpose in their profesional life is to inspect plastic bags of toiletries) the fact that anyone could simply put a full size bottle of shampoo or whatever into their pocket and walk through the metal detector w/out any trouble.
i usually don't mention the fact that terrorists who were going to blow up a plane w/ shampoo would probably think of this too, or that any liquids which might somehow be combined to create an explosive could be smuggled through in an easily crafted crotch harness, or whatever, so long as there would be no metal to detect.
so i leave it to them to surmise that all they are doing is slowing down travelers and helping johnson and johnson sell travel size products. it's actually quite funny to see the dumbfounded looks on their faces- it's almost as if they think they are really making people safe with their shampoo inspections...
btw- if you choose to engage in a similar conversation, you obviously don't want to use words like terrorist, hijack, or bomb, and be prepared to spend a few extra minutes getting a pat-down (which is really just an opportunity to have the same discussion w/ a supervisor).
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Matt
Trad climber
places you shouldn't talk about in polite company
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Topic Author's Reply - Dec 13, 2006 - 01:21pm PT
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http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/12/AR2006121201392.html
general barry mccaffrey (you remember him, the guy who made up the war plans for the invasions of afganistan and iraq?) blames rumsfeld, then suggests that we investigate and impeach...
hey fatguy, why doesn't he suggest expanding the conflict to syria and iran? (hmmmm, i dunno, maybe cause he's not some loser fat guy on a couch somewhere without a dog in the fight?)
i know, i know, "STFU general mccaffrey..."
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dirtbag
climber
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Dec 13, 2006 - 01:55pm PT
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Karl, it is pathetic when you and I as laypeople know more about this issue than one of the very top Congressional leaders.
It then becomes a situation where powerful but unlearned and incurious people rely almost entirely on advisors to form their opinions on Iraq, and we all know about the dangers arising from that approach.
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monolith
Trad climber
Albany,CA
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Dec 13, 2006 - 02:11pm PT
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Matt, Fatrad does have a dog in this fight, a big dog: Israel.
Zionists and Neocons make good bedfellows.
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UncleDoug
Social climber
N. lake Tahoe
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Dec 13, 2006 - 03:13pm PT
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"Zionists and Neocons make good bedfellows."
I wonder which one will be wearing the strap-on tonight?
Probably fattrad, since he's been taking it in the ass lately.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
Arid-zona
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Dec 13, 2006 - 03:21pm PT
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Most of the neocons in the Pentagon that pushed this war ARE jewish.
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Dec 13, 2006 - 03:33pm PT
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What I would like to see Fattrad properly and truthfully explain, is why does Israel feel the need to be ambiguous about them having nuclear weapons? We all know they do, why don’t they just fess up to it?
Hey Fattrad, I wrote this at 12:14pm December 12, perhaps you didn't see it. But then, the next post after mine was yours at 12:24pm, so it looks like you haven't an answer, because you surely must have seen my post, asking you this question.
No answer?. Then I really am beginning, by your constant rhetoric of killing and nuking, to think that you may truly be psychotic.
You aren't a psycho, are you Fattrad?
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UncleDoug
Social climber
N. lake Tahoe
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Dec 13, 2006 - 05:16pm PT
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"Most of the neocons in the Pentagon that pushed this war ARE jewish."
DJ you are correct!
But you could probably get thrown in jail for that statement.
Somehow that will get linked to you denying the holocaust and you will pay the "price".
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UncleDoug
Social climber
N. lake Tahoe
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Dec 13, 2006 - 05:23pm PT
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Patrick,
There is no way in hell fatty will give a logical reply.
He knows that the "nuclear ambiguity" issue is a no-winner for him.
If Israel were to openly confirm, not a slip of the tongue, the existence of their nuclear arsenal they would then be in direct violation of several US laws and cause the U.S. and Israel to be in direct violation of the NNPT.
How could Israel continue to nail Iran on it's nuclear program if the world were to finally confirm what has been known for a long time, Israel has nukes, will not abide by international law and the US will be complicit in the crap.
Plus he ignores people who tahe him directly to task in a no-holds manor that uses logic to attack him directly. He likes to fire back at Matt and Whitey but has dropped me like a grenade with the pin missing.
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atchafalaya
Trad climber
California
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Dec 13, 2006 - 05:35pm PT
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I didnt read all the posts in this thread. Can anyone tell me, did the pro-war crowd admit it??? A simple yes or no answer would have sufficed...
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atchafalaya
Trad climber
California
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Dec 13, 2006 - 05:46pm PT
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possible UN sanctions, weapons inspections, and invasion from the US?
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bob d'antonio
Trad climber
Taos, NM
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Dec 13, 2006 - 05:59pm PT
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Uncle Doug wrote: "Most of the neocons in the Pentagon that pushed this war ARE jewish."
DJ you are correct!
But you could probably get thrown in jail for that statement.
Somehow that will get linked to you denying the holocaust and you will pay the "price".
You are right...look at what they did to Jimmy Carter for telling the truth in his last book.
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dirtbag
climber
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Dec 13, 2006 - 06:05pm PT
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"I didnt read all the posts in this thread. Can anyone tell me, did the pro-war crowd admit it??? A simple yes or no answer would have sufficed... "
One person I know of admitted it; perhaps one or two others. Most didn't.
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Hawkeye
climber
State of Mine
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Dec 13, 2006 - 09:08pm PT
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undoug said, and i thought it was worth repeating,
"Zionists and Neocons make good bedfellows."
I wonder which one will be wearing the strap-on tonight?
Probably fattrad, since he's been taking it in the ass lately.
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Dec 13, 2006 - 09:15pm PT
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Matt wrote
"http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/12/12/AR2006121201392.html
general barry mccaffrey (you remember him, the guy who made up the war plans for the invasions of afganistan and iraq?) blames rumsfeld, then suggests that we investigate and impeach... "
I didn't see anything about impeachment there, nor even investigation but I did see the blame for Rumsfeld.
Still, I think McCaffrey is dreaming. He's basically saying, let's first train 250,000 Iraqi troops while gradually withdrawing.
They've been emphasizing training these damn troops since day one. Why haven't they? If it hasn't been done yet, what are they going to change. They can't change the fact that every Iraqi is Kurd, Shiite, or Sunni with primary allegence to his own clan, tribe, and religion before "national Iraq" and especially before a government they see as collaborating with invaders.
We're screwed there. The only question is how many die on our attempt at salvaging the unsalvagable. (cause we don't dare give other Islamic countries the role they might play in salvaging Iraq and even that might lead to disaster.)
What do you do when it's too late to do something that works?
Peace
Karl
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Hawkeye
climber
State of Mine
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Dec 13, 2006 - 09:16pm PT
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matts washingtonpost artilce is interesting.
kind of ironic.
we destroy their military.
now we need to spend 10 billion per year rebuilding it.
i can assure you that where that kind of money comes into it, all kinds of fraud and abuse comes too.
i was not pro-war iraq, but i was pro war afghanistan. clearly, from a financial point of view, we blew it. unless you are a defense company ceo or an oil ceo.
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WoodySt
Trad climber
Riverside
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Dec 14, 2006 - 12:02am PT
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Fattrad,
I said before that Israel would hit Iran; that would be their logical approach, and I hope they do it, and hard. I'm beginning to wonder, though, that their present leadership has, after the recent screw-up in Lebanon, lost heart. I see the trends leading to a major war, but the details are impossible to predict; there are too many crosscurrents in play.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Dec 14, 2006 - 12:32am PT
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Keep an eye on whether noise doesn't start developing about the 5th fleet pulling out of Bahrain and relocating to a port with a less Shiite-dominated population. It's another place we really don't want to see Islamic democracy in action and so help suppress it. If there starts to be significant attacks on the island it will mean Iran is putting things into a higher gear...
I think it is easy to say how the Sunni-vs-Shiite religious war could go. It will be Iran putting Iraq, Syria, Lebanon, and Bahrain into full play. Iraq will splinter with Turkey moving against the Kurds and the Saudis backing the Arab insurgents. Kuwait will once again be threatened - this time by Shiites. Lebanon will erupt in a civil war; with forces attempting to put the Palestinians in play at the same time. The Saudis will make an under-the-table alliance with the Israelis as both will need to be aligned against Iran. The Israelis will hit the Iranian nuke facilities (and maybe their Naval ports for us); but will lose a significant number of flight crews doing it because of the recent delivery of advanced Russian mobile, anti-aircraft missle batteries which will piss them off. And the Russians will be hard pressed to not provide on-going support to the Iranians or risk losing ground there to the Chinese who, meanwhile, will be busy using this massive distraction to gain increasing economic and policital ground in the SE Asia, the Middle East, Africa, and South America. North Korea will throw several more hissy-fits to remind everyone they are being ignore again. After a year or two of everyone having their eye off the ball the Chinese will start leaning hard on Taiwan to "normalize" relations (or else).
It's all quite messy, but I suspect it shouldn't last all that long. The winners will be the oil / arms companies and the Chinese, we will look even more clueless and impotent than we do now and will not be in a position to significantly influence the course of these events or their eventual outcomes. This scenario would be the direct and unavoidable consequence of the invasion of Iraq, a complete vacuum of foreign policy, and the fact that Moe and Curly will be in office for just long enough to insure no one with half a clue is in a position to do anything to prevent it all. Just a guess anyway.
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beer
Social climber
Nevada City
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Dec 14, 2006 - 12:52am PT
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Save your words for arctic walls Matt. . .put your head on lead instead of shitting opinions in a climbing forum. Maybe you need to belong, need a few pats on the back do ya Matt? Join a support group.. . .Need To Be Accepted Anonymous.
Have you any clue of what it is to fight in a war? Do you know what the f*#k your saying...or ya just a bewildered student bottom trolling for social hype? Got it. . .message loud and clear! You're a young idiot.
Get out of the house more dude, go die a bit in a harsh land before you act so f*#kin bold.
Cheers fluffer!
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tooth
Mountain climber
B.C.
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Dec 14, 2006 - 01:11am PT
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Matt said stuff that made sense. "Terrorists" can stuff things down their pants and get it through security. To get mad at that really says that you are frustrated with your leaders weak attempts to make you safe at home, especially if indeed you did fight in the war. What beer says about fighting and all that is his right to be frustrated about it. Just because soldiers fight for something doesn't make it right. They do what they are told. They deserve respect. Those that don't agree with what they are doing need to take it up with their democratically elected government.
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