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Happiegrrrl2

Trad climber

Jun 11, 2014 - 10:29am PT

some women like to look hot and most men like looking at them.

But does one need to post pictures to appreciate an attractive person?
No... The posting pictures is to "pass her around" to your buddies.

I spent two years on and off hanging around with a male friend who is a "10" on the 1-10 attractiveness scale by pretty much anyone who saw him. Not only that, he is beautiful inside - kind, considerate, polite, smart, sophisticated, good sense of humor, intelligent, and it seems he is also fairly well to do. The whole package, so to speak.

It would never - NEVER - occur to me to post pictures of this man online as if I was dangling a bauble for others to admire. It would be insulting to him as a human being, to present him s worth something only because of his beauty.

John M

climber

Jun 11, 2014 - 10:46am PT

It would be insulting to him as a human being, to present him s worth something only because of his beauty.

You appear to be saying that one should never post a picture of someone simply because we think that person is attractive. Is that true? I think that I get where you are going Terri, but you also appear to be saying that we can never celebrate a persons physical beauty. You also seem to be saying that if I post a picture of someone because I see that person as beautiful and want to share that beauty with others, then that is also saying that I don't recognize that there is more to a person then their physical features.

Happiegrrrl2

Trad climber

Jun 11, 2014 - 10:50am PT

I am fairly certain that I would never take a picture of a person who I didn't know because I thought they were attractive.

I suppose I might take a picture of a person with some amount of fame, like a president of a country, the Pope, a (musician) rock star...though living 20 years in NYC and seeing famous people quite regularly I never felt inclined to take a picture of them.

John M

climber

Jun 11, 2014 - 11:10am PT

Gotta run. I think more needs to be said on this subject as I'm not sure that I understand Happigirl's point, but I have to go. So forgive me if I don't answer right away.

For now..

I have never taken a picture of a person just because I thought that they were attractive, but I have posted pictures that I took from the internet of people that I thought were attractive. I fully appreciate that there is more to a person then the physical, but at this point I fail to see how sharing pictures of attractive people is 100 percent wrong. The way I see it is that there is a line of decency. The problem is that that line is different for everyone.

Is Legg's objectifying herself when she posts selfies that focus on her attractiveness? Sometimes she posts selfies that focus on a climb, or a place or an activity that shows more of her personality, but sometimes she posts pics that focus on her beauty. Is that objectification and is that wrong? If I appreciated her beauty without knowing her would that be wrong ?

HighTraverse

Trad climber

Bay Area

Jun 11, 2014 - 11:31am PT

The whole objectifying vs appreciating conundrum.
So much depends on the personalities of the observer and the observed.
I think there are also differences due to the way the photo is posed (or not)
I see a lot of women's pics on climbing magazine covers that I consider objectifying.

The classic pic of Lynn Hill high on the Nose in short sleeved shirt and shorts I think is not objectifying. We can be pretty certain she didn't dress for the photo and we know she approved of it's publication. I'd love to know her take on that pic so many years later.

And she is pretty "hot" in that pic. It's the beauty of a strong, fit human pushing her limits which are WAY beyond mine. Pushing everyone's limits. Like an Olympic runner or rower, male or female.
It's also true that it raises different emotions for me whether it's Lynn Hill or Dale Bard. There's the beauty of it in both cases but Dale isn't "hot" to me.

So am I objectifying Lynn? Dale? both? neither?
In the end is how you behave towards people.

skcreidc

Social climber

SD, CA

Jun 11, 2014 - 11:38am PT

Well said High Traverse.

looks easy from here

climber

Ben Lomond, CA

Jun 11, 2014 - 11:40am PT

Do I count?

granite_girl

Trad climber

Oakland

Jun 11, 2014 - 11:50am PT

Thanks for deleting your picture, Survival. I wish others would do the same for this particular thread. And the photos of the hot "climber" dudes that were posted are definitely hilarious.

So, here's the thing, if y'all want to have threads with half-naked women, well, this is the internet, so as long as it's ok with the site owner (CMac), go for it. But out of respect for those of us who don't like looking at that sort of thing while thinking about climbing, please keep it out of the other threads. And especially keep it out of threads talking about why women avoid supertopo. The contradiction is too hard to take.

Anyway, I've said my piece, now carry on.

Edited to add: Survival, I meant to say that I really like the photos you posted on the first page of this thread. Those women are all clearly people first. They are attractive not because of how they look, but because of who they are and what they do. Bring on more like that!

Lollie

Social climber

I'm Lolli.

Jun 11, 2014 - 12:01pm PT

What's up with the naked climbers, Dingus? I assume you want to say something with them, but I'm not sure what, as it could be several different things.

I understand what you, John M, and others are saying. It's not really all that easy. I don't mind nudity and I like beauty. I like looking at men, (even though photos of men doesn't do anything for me). I don't mind photos of naked people climbing for instance, even if my only reaction so far has been that they mostly look so artificial and god, how I would hate to scratch MY breasts against rock like that. There's arty photos of nudity which are absolutely great.

I have other objections than the images, even if I do have objections against the other kind of images and how they pop up in places where they have no place to be. When I cannot choose if I want to see a photoshopped pouting Lolita pulling at her panties while I read about something interesting. Those are not about someone liking an attractive body, those are meant to be degrading and intimating, telling women to stay put in their place. Like rape is not about sex, it's about power. It's a message.

What I object against is the, not only patronising, but downright brutal attitude from some members whose comments show a view towards the female half of the population that we're not really humans, we're supposed to be one way just to please him. When comments are derogatory purely because it's about women. It's the final fight for white men's supremacy. But as I see it, real men secure in themselves don't have that need to put down women to feel better themselves.

Both women and men comes in all kinds, as#@&%es and angels. And everything in between. That's what it boils down to, in a community like Supertopo, people. Persons. Not gender, not colour or creed or anything.

ladyscarlett

Trad climber

SF Bay Area, California

Jun 11, 2014 - 01:14pm PT

Mmmm

Nice pics Dingus...wherever do you find them?

Interested Ladies want to know!

hehehehe, after those pics, I have no idea what this thread was for...

:)

Cheers

LS

RyanD

climber

Squamish

Jun 11, 2014 - 01:23pm PT

hehehehe, after those pics, I have no idea what this thread was for...

Yes I had almost forgotten this was a silly copycat thread title play on words thread based on Avery's lack of class thread.

It was supposed to be a joke.

Michelle

Social climber

1187 Hunterwasser

Jun 11, 2014 - 02:04pm PT

Lollie

Social climber

I'm Lolli.

Jun 11, 2014 - 02:23pm PT

Scary, huh?
Serious people! What an affront.

Norton

Social climber

the Wastelands

Jun 11, 2014 - 02:54pm PT

Lollie

What I object against is the, not only patronising, but downright brutal attitude from some members whose comments show a view towards the female half of the population that we're not really humans, we're supposed to be one way just to please him. When comments are derogatory purely because it's about women. It's the final fight for white men's supremacy. But as I see it, real men secure in themselves don't have that need to put down women to feel better themselves.

thebravecowboy

climber

in the face of the fury of the funk

Jun 11, 2014 - 04:45pm PT

Lollie

Social climber

I'm Lolli.

Jun 11, 2014 - 04:53pm PT

"It's the final fight for white men's supremacy"...

Interesting to me that RACE has been brought into the equation...

Try to hold the Taco to a standard of logic and fact and you'll be disappointed every time.

LOL!!!!
Ain't that the truth...

granite_girl

Trad climber

Oakland

Jun 11, 2014 - 09:04pm PT

Great photo, Cowboy! Your climbing partner looks like an awesome person! She's climbing barefoot while hanging out with her toddler in a beautiful place. I hope I can be as cool as her if I have kids.