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squishy
Mountain climber
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New photo of Folsom Lake from the air, take yesterday.
It's looking a little better than before, but it's still pretty bad.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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The san joaquin valley gets like 12 inches of rain a year. If you captured 10% of that over the entire valley, you are talking an inch or so of recharge whereas the groundwater has falled up to several hundred feet. The Sierra gets up to 80 inches of water (at least historically). It really is about moving mountain precip south.
Also water that is captured isn't available for downstream use. So the upside is limited. In LA it would make sense to capture instead of putting it in a concrete channel and sending it to the sea. But in many areas it would be robbing Peter to pay Paul.
Beyond any doubt, you're right----solutions have to be local, and oriented to the local conditions.
In LA, San Diego, Orange County, San Francisco Bay Area, San Jose (which make up most of the population of the State), all of them import huge volumes of water from distant places, but once there, the water is used ONCE, then is converted into a problem of disposal.
In all of those locations, if they did as Israel did, and recycled the water, the total water needs would be greatly reduced, and have no impact on anyone else (except to free up water for others!), because they are the end users.
Those strategies still work for Fresno, Bakersfield, Sacramento, etc, but the rainwater harvesting concepts might not work so well, because they are not the end users.
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Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
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We don't get 12" a year. We'll get 4" one year, and 34" the next.
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August West
Trad climber
Where the wind blows strange
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Regulating ground water pumping is the next big tsunami for CA water poltics. Dams are a side show.
Yes and the state of CA hasn't even been able to get ground water pumpers to report how much they are pumping let alone "regulate" it. In 50 years when the regulations are fully implemented and the legal appeals exhausted, the groundwater will either be depleted or will have fallen so low (that makes it really expensive to pump up to the surface) that Ag might not be able to make any money by pumping it.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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The san joaquin valley gets like 12 inches of rain a year. If you captured 10% of that over the entire valley, you are talking an inch or so of recharge whereas the groundwater has falled up to several hundred feet. The Sierra gets up to 80 inches of water (at least historically). It really is about moving mountain precip south.
pre agricultural development the San Joaquin valley was one big tulle swamp, that is what wasn't a shallow seasonal lake.
Now it grows something more productive than mosquitoes. Never fear though, one repeat of 1861 and ground water levels will substantially recover.
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raw
Mountain climber
Malibu
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Except for subsidence. Aquifer storage is permanently lost when the alluvium compacts.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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I have to admit, the concept of figuring out how to replace the 15 TRILLION Acre-Feet of overdraft in the Central Valley, just blows my mind.
You get into such issues as lets say you build a dam, using tax dollars. Who owns the water? you infiltrate the water into the land, who owns it then?
The sheer volume of water involved is mind-boggling.
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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if everybody urinates outside, you will save toilet water and add ground water at the same time,
buy deodorant, skip showers, live 3rd world style, need an earthquake to drop population,
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The Chief
climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Nov 6, 2015 - 08:45pm PT
I have to admit, the concept of figuring out how to replace the 15 TRILLION Acre-Feet of overdraft in the Central Valley, just blows my mind.
You get into such issues as lets say you build a dam, using tax dollars. Who owns the water? you infiltrate the water into the land, who owns it then?
The sheer volume of water involved is mind-boggling.
What is even more mind boggling is you posted this after eating your dinner. That dinner must have consisted of fresh veggie's, whether organic or not, that were grown and watered in the SJ Valley or any other California growing field that is watered with all the mind boggling water you speak of.
Just love the hypocrisy and ironee in most of the opinions posted here regarding the ground water thievery due to agriculture.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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must be a little bug making noise......
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The Chief
climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
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Well KEN M, them "little bugs" will still be here on planet earth living and making lots of noises long after you and your intellectual human race are gone.
So I would not be making such condescending remarks towards them "little bugs" that are most assuredly in them Trader Joe's fresh fruits and vegies you eat daily that are grown with all that mind boggling water you keep whining about.
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John M
climber
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What is even more mind boggling is you posted this after eating your dinner. That dinner must have consisted of fresh veggie's, whether organic or not, that were grown and watered in the SJ Valley or any other California growing field that is watered with all the mind boggling water you speak of.
of course we eat food from there. That isn't the point. The point is how the growing is done. Such as Crops that aren't fitted to the environment and use too much water. Or growing crops for export when we have a water problem. Its a balance thing. Especially since we are drawing down the aquifer and causing subsidence, which destroys some of the aquifers ability to refill.
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The Chief
climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
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John M...
Appears most here do not want to disrupt the flow of natural run off. They don't want the agi coalition to drain any more ground water. BUT, they all want their fresh cake totally uninterrupted from coming to their dinner plates.
So, what is the ultimate answer, John M.
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John M
climber
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BUT, they all want their fresh cake totally uninterrupted from coming to their dinner plates.
well, I know people who have quit eating beef because it is a resource hog. So I wouldn't say everyone wants their cake and to be able to eat it too. I have lived for years using less water then most, and I bet many on this forum have too. We don't live in the days anymore where everyone can do whatever they want wherever they want. We have to be more conscious of how our actions affect everyone else. If everyone can't raise their consciousness, then we have to legislate actions. That means such things as devising a way to regulate ground water use, so that we don't destroy the aquifer. What exactly those rules should be, I don't' know. I'm not an expert.
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The Chief
climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
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Unfortunately YOU John M and many here are the MINORITY when it comes to having your cake uninterrupted.
The MAJORITY don't care and want it all NOW.
Oh yeah, have you ceased buying and eating fresh fruits and veggies from your local store, John M? If NOT, you are just as much a part of the problem as all others that want that cake, NOW!
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John M
climber
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Oh yeah, have you ceased buying and eating fresh fruits and veggies from your local store, John M? If NOT, you are just as much a part of the problem as all others that want that cake, NOW!
Chief, I stopped eating. LOL..
yep.. I consume water. Oh the horror..
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On a more serious note, I have never said one should not consume any water. But it is important what choices you make. It is again, not a black and white issue. So no.. I am not as big a problem as the person who has a huge lawn.
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The Chief
climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
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Plenty of water in my neck of the sage brush. And the weather, well, appears it's going to be a tad bit wetter than normal the next six or so months. Hope ya'll on the westside got some... Dingy's.
Yesterday...
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The Chief
climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
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The ground under it has been sucked too dry.
Got lots of Mud around here too.... deep deep mud. Maybe it's time ya'll think about moving to wetter "Higher" ground.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
Shetville , North of Los Angeles
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Dingus...The Chief might be moving ...? The CC+Rs are getting to him...Maybe he will make you a good- guy deal on the White Mt. Estates compound..? Make sure the disclaimer includes the Claymore sites...
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