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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jul 18, 2005 - 12:50am PT
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HowDumbBush, well being the Capitalist you are than we can suppose you along with all the other neocon, corporate apologists here must really have your painties in a twist when it comes to the Chinese playing the "game" and wanting to buy a U.S. oil company. Oh my god, why they'll be going to the moon next (and no doubt hurtling Maytags down on us from orbit)!!!
Trust me, I really do feel your pain...
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jul 18, 2005 - 12:51am PT
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Ah, mute in the face of reason as suspected...
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Matt
Trad climber
places you shouldn't talk about in polite company
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Jul 18, 2005 - 03:30am PT
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good lord lois-
you claim to not have the free time in your oh-so busy life to actally read a real book or learn anything substantive about the crap you hear about on fox news, but you sure seem to have the time to post all weekend on supertopo.
you sound like the type of person i would expect to find in one of those rent-an-RV things in the valley, nothing wrong w/ such folks, just don't personally expect to understand them.
so have you ever climbed anything, ever? or did you just show up to ptretend to know nothing about anything?
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jul 18, 2005 - 03:48am PT
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Lois,
Glad to hear you are the typical good person just doing whatever it takes to get the job done. I have to admit I personally find you a bit of a puzzle that as a woman, professor, nurse you choose to vote a straight Republican ticket. One can only assume you party affiliation has more to do with social/religious beliefs than what you observe at work. I find it a bit disturbing you so readily buy into the neocon's "clash of civilizations" fantasies, their lies and smear campaigns, and their support for laws that relentlessly undermine health care for the average citizen (outside of the NRA which only passed as it largely benefited "red" states and was political suicide to oppose).
In some respects you and fellow nurses pay a very unappreciated price for Republican policies that effect healthcare in this country. As an educator you've already told us what you see in the way of education coming your way and yet the Republicans at both the State and Federal level would rather pour money into corporate larders and ridiculous fantasies like the B-2 and "Star Wars" than fund a higher teacher/student ratio in our schools. We squandering $300 billion down a hole and accomplishing nothing more than establishing a breeding ground for rats that wasn't there before we started this war. Any idea what $300 billion would buy in the way of schools, roads, teachers, nurses, or pretty much anything productive and useful? Plenty.
It's a mystery to me why you would support these criminals...
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jul 18, 2005 - 03:52am PT
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"HowDumbBush:
...unsubstantiated hysterical blabbering..."
There is nothing unsubstantiated about the [non-]service records of the cowards listed in my post above - their draft status is a matter of public record. This is getting embarrassing to the point of being no fun if that's really your response...
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Patrick Sawyer
Mountain climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Jul 18, 2005 - 08:41am PT
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Jeez, this is kind of fun, reading you people going on. think I'll join. Well said Werner on the spiritual issue (you probably don't remember me - Patrick Sawyer - as I only climbed with you once, down at Reed Pinnacle around 1976).
I've been out of the US for a while so the internet is handy for keeping up to date with events - climbing and otherwise - although the Net is so full of disinformation, misinformation and lies masquerading as facts. However, since I have followed Glasgow Celtic since 1969, growing up in the Bay Area it was tough to find out the football scores from Scotland, unless I went across the bay to the city and visited an Irish pub on Geary Street or in the Sunset district to find out the scores from Irish ex-pats. Now, with the internet, I can find out the scores of the 49ers and Raiders as well as other stuff, such as reading Link's reports from the Valley.
Is it true that shortly before coming governor, Arnie signed a deal to be an executive editor on a couple of fitness/muscle building mags, where is remuneration is 1% of the advertising (about $1m as I understand it). However, about 70% of the ad revenue comes from health 'food' supplements, as I understand it, and since becoming governor the Terminator has terminated, oops, vetoed legislation to tighten up the health supplement sector. Kind of sounds like a conflict of interest on his part, doesn't it? BTW, fellow Californians - and blow ins as well - how is Arnie doing as guv?
Unions? There are good and bad. When I was a journalist in London, belonging to the National Union of Journalists had its benefits, but it depended on the father/mother of chapel (shop steward so to speak) on how effective a certain branch was. When I was a news editor on a weekly, I had a big disagreement with my editor and she tried pushing me out (as she did my previous two predecessors). One of my reporters, Simon (ex-British Army and a real decent bloke) helped me to keep my sanity, and the father of chapel, Mike, helped me to exit the job with my pride intact and £9,000 payment. So there the union was helpful.
In Ireland here, I now belong to Irish Actors Equity, which is a pretty useless union. When I return to the States someday, I'll join the Screen Actors Guild (of which I am eligible), but I really do not know how good of union that is personally, just what I read.
My oldest brother recently retired from the Teamsters. He worked hard for his people and was president of his branch in Vallejo for years, besides being a top negotiator who the union flew around the States to negotiate contracts. BTW, my brother was a good Teamster, yes there are such a thing.
So unions are good and bad. Sort of like politicians - okay maybe not. Anyway, my lunch break is almost over (it's 13:40 in Dublin) but I do enjoy reading some of the stuff in this thread.
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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Jul 18, 2005 - 09:35am PT
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Wow, this thread has been busy!
LEB: "I really don't think too many Mexicans are coming up to take my job..."
Not a single illegal immigrant has ever taken an American's job. Some company GAVE that illegal the job. Don't try to deflect the blame from where is truly belongs.
Howweird, you have attacked labor unions here, and LEB went after some guy who swept floors for a steelmill.
I have one question for my Republican friends:
Why do Republicans have such little regard for the work ethic? There are people who work 40 hour per week jobs and cannot afford food, clothing and health care without government subsidies, and the GOP thinks this is good. I don't get it.
Please advise.
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Chefclimber
Trad climber
Northern Nevada
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Jul 18, 2005 - 12:18pm PT
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Lois:
ne-o-con: a neoconservative: An intellectual and political movement in favor of political, economic, and social conservatism that arose in opposition to the perceived liberalism of the 1960's. "The neo-conservatism of the 1980s is a replay of the New Conservatism of the 1950s, which was itself a replay of the New Era philosophy of the 1920s" (Arthur M. Schlesinger, Jr.).
Did that help?
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Chefclimber
Trad climber
Northern Nevada
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Jul 18, 2005 - 02:07pm PT
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No problem Lois. I agree with you about sharing information. As my sign on name implies, I work in the culinary field, pastry to be specific. Baking is a science and can be challenging to the novice. I love to share my knowledge with novice bakers.
Since we are on the topic of work, you are right Howeird. I recently decided to make a career change, for more money and to do something I enjoy. I quit my job, went to culinary school and went back to work. I now have one full-time and two part-time jobs; about 65 hours a week, without government subsidies.
"Why do Republicans have such little regard for the work ethic?"
I don't think so. I didn't like my old job, so I took it upon myself to make it better.
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dirtbag
climber
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Jul 18, 2005 - 03:33pm PT
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Good link Matt. You can probably do the same kind of analysis in states like California. Red counties tend to receive more government money than blue counties like San Francisco.
You can now call the red states "Welfare States." :-)
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jul 18, 2005 - 03:37pm PT
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HowDumbBush,
And what is it you do, how did you come to do it, and exactly how deep is your snout in the trough...?
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Jul 18, 2005 - 04:08pm PT
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Matt, you really shouldn't embarrass HowweirdDean like that. Be a bit kinder to the poor lad and let him have his delusions, don't muddle up his confused brain with facts.
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dirtbag
climber
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Jul 18, 2005 - 04:08pm PT
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"Whatever, quit looking for some handout from the government."
Yeah Jody, I agree, I also wish the red welfare states would quit taking handouts from the blue states.
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Spinmaster K-Rove
Trad climber
Stuck Under the Kor Roof
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Jul 18, 2005 - 04:15pm PT
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Yeah...stop looking for handouts from the government. Leave that to defense contractors and security scam...er..consultants. I mean good Amercicans like the men and women of the Republican party are more your 'ask what you can do for your government' type of people. Not those needy 'what have you done for me lately' kind of people. That's why they give freely of their money to the GOP and never EVER expect anything back for it.
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Jul 18, 2005 - 04:18pm PT
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Rokjox, that last bit reminds me of an advert that I saw in a Toronto paper. Well actually, a Canadian journalist I was working with here in Dublin had an e-mail copy of it and showed me. If I can find it I'll post it or e-mail it to you. But the advert (about a 1/8 page or so display ad) went something along these lines: Entrepreneur and executive looking for job, plenty of experience in logistics, bookkeeping, running a drug smuggling operation, employee managment. Have served eight years (or something like that) in prison and now looking to use the skills I gained as a global drugs dealer to good and legitmate use etc etc etc.
I wonder if he ever found a job or went back in to business for himself.
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Jul 18, 2005 - 04:20pm PT
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Rokjox, when I referred to the last bit, I meant from your post of 12:37.
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Jul 18, 2005 - 04:22pm PT
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Y'all, excuse the typos, I should know better.
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Gary
climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Jul 18, 2005 - 05:41pm PT
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Howard said:
"Maybe a bunch of floormoppers and hamburger flippers can live together to pay the rent. Whatever, quit looking for some handout from the government."
You see, Dr. Dean, you don't get it! You truly have no respect for honest labor. Recieving a livable wage for honest work is NOT a handout from the government.
Perhaps because of your Republican leanings you are confused. Those who bankroll the modern GOP DO receive enourmous government handouts. Do not confuse that with honest work.
LEB complains about welfare chislers. How about this? The Walton family is one of the wealthiest families on this planet. Worth biliions and billions of dollars. Yet, as part of their employment package, they hand out advice on getting government assistance with food stamps, rent, medicine, etc. See how this works, LEB? Since Wal-Mart does not pay a wage that can support life, the taxpayers, you for instance, subsidize their workforce. Meanwhile the Waltons are filthy rich! Cool, huh?
That is how the capitalism that you so heartily support works. Wealth is produced, and then extracted from those who produce it and transferred to the parasite, oops, I mean Capitalist, class.
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Matt
Trad climber
places you shouldn't talk about in polite company
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Jul 18, 2005 - 05:59pm PT
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oh gawd, please don't try to explain walmart to lois, she is so happy in her bubble.
hey lois-
what should society do?
should we cut those mom's off?
will the kids starve? is that ok w/ you? what will hapen then? will they turn to crime? sell drugs? steal? (all this in your community? or in someone else's backyard?) and what would be the relative costs of policing greater crime and keeping more people in prison?
or should we take her kids away?
where would they go? who would pay for their up-bringing and education? would they do better or worse in that environment?
should we "fix" such people?
who decides who gets that treatment? (maybe the liberals should get "fixed" too?)
you got issues, and you have gripes, but you have any better ideas? not.
tell you what your republican friends fight against, availability of reproductive education and family planning services services, such as contraception. think all of those women want 6 kids? think they don't want to be in a stable family unit? think they deserve their own plight? your party does.
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