Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
|
|
|
Nov 15, 2014 - 10:01pm PT
|
A young man aproximately the same age as myself....
|
|
Largo
Sport climber
The Big Wide Open Face
|
|
|
Nov 15, 2014 - 10:01pm PT
|
How can whatever Jim says be relevant to your life if you don't let it be so? Sounds to me like he has his hands full with his own life? Don't we all . . .
JL
|
|
j-tree
Big Wall climber
Typewriters and Ledges
|
|
|
Nov 15, 2014 - 11:20pm PT
|
Just ran into this post from ptpp on the WOEML thread,
'Pass the Pitons' Pete
Aug 31, 2004 - 10:10am PT
Chopping bolts on WOEML is so passé...
One wonders why Jim didn't go up Highway To Hell and fill in all the bat holes.
Now that Beyer went up the first part of HTH for his new Hummus route link-up on El Cap, does anyone know if the bat holes are on the sections he went through?
|
|
clinker
Trad climber
Santa Cruz, California
|
|
|
Nov 16, 2014 - 09:31am PT
|
All of this is the result of too much climbing and little to no sex. Unhealthy lifestyle.
|
|
Mark Hudon
Trad climber
Hood River, OR
|
|
|
Nov 16, 2014 - 09:39am PT
|
How can whatever XXX says be relevant to your life if you don't let it be so?
Such a powerful thought, John. This is an awesome mantra to live with.
|
|
Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
|
|
|
Nov 16, 2014 - 10:22am PT
|
"Parole officer," "anger management sessions"
 does anyone know if this literal truth? Or is it poetic license?
|
|
Gobie
Trad climber
Northern, Ca.
|
|
|
Nov 16, 2014 - 12:23pm PT
|
you gotta go checkout his topo for hamas fights for freedom. classic beyer. it has a social statement at the bottom of the rack list. i guess to climb at this caliber for this many years you need to be really pissed at some entity the entire time.
|
|
Jaybro
Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
|
|
|
Nov 16, 2014 - 12:56pm PT
|
Link to Hamas topo?
Edit; MP, classic Rabid fare
|
|
ms55401
Trad climber
minneapolis, mn
|
|
|
Nov 16, 2014 - 06:48pm PT
|
heavy bread for the peanut gallery: topo was almost certainly written tongue in cheek. But if pillory is your thing, then it's your thing.
frankly, the most incendiary aspects of the topo are not the names of certain pitches but their ratings. As I wrote upstream, I find the political stuff mildly amusing. I was, and still am, much more curious as to whether someone witnessed the route going up and could thus substantiate the asserted direness of the climbing.
|
|
The Larry
climber
Moab, UT
|
|
|
Nov 16, 2014 - 06:57pm PT
|
Lots of armchair climbing on the Taco.
|
|
Kalimon
Social climber
Ridgway, CO
|
|
|
Nov 16, 2014 - 06:58pm PT
|
Ratings in general are highly subjective and difficult to perceive from the ground. Beyer certainly gets after it though . . . the guy has been putting up routes for a long time.
|
|
donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
|
|
|
Nov 16, 2014 - 07:15pm PT
|
Aid ratings, it seems to me, are more nebulous and subjective than free climbing ratings.
Free climbing ratings are a function (ideally) of the physical difficulty of the climb. Free climbing ratings are also more subjected to a consensus rating because they usually get numerous repeats.
Aid ratings are skewed by technological advances in equipment and many aid climbs receive few repeats.
Keep in mind that free climbs are all subjected to the same limitations of human physical capabilities while aid climbs can benefit immensely with advances in the equipment used for ascent.
One is limited by human physical ability (advances in equipment and technique play a lesser part), the other by technology and know how.Obviously the evolution of technolgical devices progresses much faster than the evolution of the human body.
Additionally, free climbing ratings are based on the likelihood of failure at a particular grade by a particular climber. I.E. a 5.11 climber will likely fail to do a 5.12 climb without falling.
Aid climbing grades are based on the PRESUMED likelihood of equipment failure and a
resulting fall at a particular grade. It is also presumed that good aid climbers will use their
equipment more effectively and have a higher chance of avoiding equipment failure
The incidence of failure by a particular climber at a particular grade in free climbing is extremely common and the high incidence of said failures confirm the validity of the grade.
The incidence of failure of the equipment placed by a particular aid climber at a particular grade is scant. There doesn't seem to be a sufficient population of failures to confirm aid ratings at any level....especially A5.
When something is lacking in objective confirmation criteria the door is open to subjective shenanigans.
edit: The above bs could only have come from a mind severely compromised by seaonal affective disorder,
|
|
Captain...or Skully
climber
in the oil patch...Fricken Bakken, that's where
|
|
|
Nov 16, 2014 - 08:05pm PT
|
Heading for Oblivion had some dumbshit randomness on it. Pick a method and use it. Duh?
The shenanigan pitch was named that, by us, for a reason.
|
|
Andrew Barnes
Ice climber
Albany, NY
|
|
|
Nov 16, 2014 - 08:16pm PT
|
I'm surprised that nobody has referenced the aid rant yet (in this thread), so here it is:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=boQHYBhlOcs
More seriously, I think it makes sense for a climber to stay away from an aid-climb until he/she is adequately prepared for it. The moment one takes out a drill or chisel (on something the first ascent party climbed without), it is the end of the story - it is not an ascent, it is a failure. Honesty demands that the climber go down, not up, and definitely not claim an ascent.
|
|
Andrew Barnes
Ice climber
Albany, NY
|
|
|
Nov 16, 2014 - 08:27pm PT
|
Listening to the aid rant again: I notice a serious and interesting comment
immediately after the 5 minute mark. It's about climbing with a drill. He's
basically saying that climbing with a drill reduces the aid climb to a
guaranteed outcome.
Then he goes on to reinforce my point about admitting defeat if one fails to
climb honestly (e.g. takes out the drill) - the mountain won. But this
Messner-type message is too hard on large egos.
|
|
Kalimon
Social climber
Ridgway, CO
|
|
|
Nov 16, 2014 - 08:34pm PT
|
it is currently an acceptable practice on aid climb to drill bolts, rivets or bat hook holes for progress
This practice has been in vogue on many of the "modern" El Cap routes . . . many of them not so current.
|
|
WBraun
climber
|
|
|
Nov 16, 2014 - 08:56pm PT
|
the mountain won
It can never ever be defeated ever.
Only embraced ....
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!