Cerro Torre, A Mountain Consecrated - The Resurrection of th

this entire thread just puts climbing and its community into a bad light.
americans vs. italians/swiss is what it looks like here . of course that's not even the case, but the dumb arguing is shameful.

it's sad that some climber compares the bolts on the the Torre to the Berlin Wall, and it even gets rewritten by KK and then R&I and Alpinst cite that bullsh#t. It makes climbers look like stupid idiots!

Americans are great

...accordingly adjusted his choice and accomplished his outstanding goal.

Certainly I want to congratulate for the ascent of Kennedy and Kruk and even more to David Lama for free. On removal of Maestri's bolts I absolutely disagree.
A route opened in 1970, when El Chalten not even existed and Patagonia was not accessible as it is today, I certainly did not approve the methods used then and I do not approve them either today, still this route deserves respect for its historical value. This route is in fact, along with controversy and the pages of literature inspired by it, a piece of history, history consists of beautiful and ugly things, nevetheless those things are representative of those years of mountaineering.
Maestri put bolts in 1970, but others did the same, just think of bolts placed by Lama with subsequent removal by Garibotti. We state clearly that among the climbers of Cerro Torre no one has ever be consistent. Maestri's bolts and belay anchors have been used by everybody. The certainty of a fast-descent has helped many, including some famous openers, to try until the last. Others have used the last pitches to complete the new lines. I would point out that the only independent lines that get to the top are Maestri's with Bridwell ending and ours.
For sure now the possibility of climbing Cerro Torre is closed to many.
Certainly in the Alps these routes symbol of an outdated Mountaineering style have been considered and treated differently. Maestri's and other routes, such as in Minussi Lavaredo, were free climbed, but no one has ever assumed the right to erase the historical value by removing the original pitons.
Obviously for Cerro Torre is not so, the charm of being involved in a controversy with the big and unknown passionate more than ascents themselves, and so Kennedy and Kruk will be remembered not because of their beautiful ascent, but again because of Maestri and the controversy over his decision to more than forty years ago. In this sense, they should at least thank him.

Mario Conti

Constable Garibotti just sent me an email asking for my support in the chopping of Maestri's bolts. A little late, don't you think?

Different climbers have different reasons for enjoying their mountain experience. It would be worth debating how much rights the elite have to prune the peaks so the "Unworthy" are denied.

Deux bouteilles d’aspirine. Oui, deux…

Ça m’a pris deux bouteilles d’aspirine, cette semaine, pour digérer toutes les inepties lues sur les forums anglo-américains et français à propos du Cerro Torre et de la Voie du Compresseur.

Passe encore que certains n’apprécient pas ma prose. Passe encore que certains ne saisissent pas mon argumentaire. Mais de là à ne pas saisir le fond de l’histoire, à ne pas être capable de voir les tenants et aboutissants de l’affaire, à ne pas apprécier la dérive qu’une telle action peut provoquer… et bien je remercie Bayer de l’aide apportée par leur produit vedette!

Résumons : deux grimpeurs ont escaladé le Cerro Torre ‘’ by fair means’’ mais en utilisant – selon leur dire – deux ou cinq ancrages déjà en place. Qui peut jurer, ici, que ce n’est que cinq ancrages et non pas dix ou vingt ou trente? Il n’y a que leur parole qui en fait foi… c’est l’usage en alpinisme.

Ces deux grimpeurs avaient l’intention de déboulonner la voie du Compresseur avant leur départ. Et ils ont conservé les ancrages ce qui est étrange pour des artefacts qui n’ont pour eux aucune valeur. Cette action fut faite en dépit d’un consensus chez les grimpeurs et les locaux argentins. Je ne crois pas qu’on accepterait, en France, que des Argentins décident de ce qui s’équipe ou se déséquipe dans le pays…

Certaines personnes, des alpinistes célèbres et d’autres qui le sont moins, ont déclaré que la Voie du Compresseur n’était pas historique et que, de ce fait, les ancrages ne sont que des déchets. Le nettoyage est un réalignement visant à redonner à la montagne sa pureté d’antan. Pourquoi ces alpinistes n’ont pas fait eux-mêmes le ménage bien avant reste un mystère. Pourquoi applaudir maintenant au lieu d’agir il y a dix ans?

Moi, les montagnes, je n’en fais pas une religion. Ce sont d’intéressants blocs de roche et de glace qu’il peut être plaisant de grimper. La beauté d’une montagne et sa pureté ne sont que des élucubrations occidentales et je considère que le Cerro Torre est aussi ‘’beau’’ que le Crapaud de Mer, un tas de caillou de 10 mètres grimpable à marée basse. Je suis un sceptique et un athée.

La Voie du Compresseur a été grimpée en 1970, l’époque des Directissimes, l’époque de la fin de l’alpinisme, l’époque des grosses expéditions nationales, l’époque où l’on considérait encore que certaines parois ne pouvaient être grimpées. Ou elles l’étaient à grand renfort de moyens, en artificiel, et c’était considéré ‘’by fair means’’.

La Voie du Compresseur est une voie historique. Elle a fait couler beaucoup d’encre depuis 1970 et je ne connais pas beaucoup de lignes qui ont justifié un livre ou deux par Messner, un film culte, des articles dans les journaux nationaux, des mentions dans tous les livres sur l’alpinisme, quarante ans de polémique… bref, clamer haut et fort que ce n’est pas une voie historique, c’est mentir pour la galerie.

Encore plus, la Voie du Compresseur, de par sa notoriété, a généré quantité de vocations alpines et nombre de grimpeurs connus l’ont gravie sans songer à la déséquiper. Et nombre d’inconnus auraient bien aimé la faire un jour. Cela est maintenant impossible pour cause de pureté. Cette voie était plus qu’une simple échelle de points fixes : en fait, on parle de 1200 mètres d’un rocher à faire rêver qui restera maintenant le fief d’une élite sponsorisée.

Si elle avait été déséquipée deux ans, cinq ans après sa création… mais non… aucun grimpeur ‘’célèbre’’ n’a accepté cette mission malgré les critiques. Maestri lui-même voulait couper les ancrages à la descente mais le mauvais temps et ses compagnons l’en ont dissuadé. C’était sa ligne et il était dans son droit.

La Voie du Compresseur a maintenant 42 ans …. Et elle n’est plus qu’un rêve que plusieurs se chargeront de nous faire oublier.

Je suis réputé et détesté dans mon patelin pour avoir déséquipé un site entier. Disons 75 voies en deux jours. Or ces voies étaient les miennes, des voies dont j’avais payé en entier tout le matériel à partir d’un salaire de misère et que j’avais équipées en un temps record. Je sais donc bien de quoi je parle!

Ce qui m’a donné l’idée de demander à celui qui a équipé la Voie du Compresseur ce qu’il en pense. J’ai donc téléphoné à Cesare Maestri!!!

Oui… j’ai contacté Maestri. En cela, j’ai fait preuve de plus de cœur que les conquérants de l’inutile qui ont liquidé la Maestri/Claus/Alimonta. Car c’est le nom officiel de la Voie du Compresseur, vous le saviez?

Je vous épargne les civilités d’usage :

"Je tiens à vous rappeler que, ces dernières années, j'ai décidé de ne plus parler du Cerro Torre.

Les raisons qui m'ont conduit à prendre cette décision sont doubles : il y a la controverse soulevée par ceux qui veulent m’humilier et détruire la merveilleuse histoire de l'alpinisme, mais essentiellement je sais qu’en reprenant la polémique, je jette de l'essence sur le feu et je me fais complice de leur sale jeu.

En ce qui concerne la "Voie du Compresseur" (que je préfère appeler la «Maestri-Claus-Alimonta" sur l'arête Sud-Est), je peux dire que je considère que c’est une voie incroyable que nous avons affronté pour rendre encore plus évidente la déconfiture de ceux qui ont été forcés de battre en retraite après avoir été stoppés à quelques centaines de mètres du sommet, des grimpeurs considérés comme les meilleurs au monde, incapables d’aller au sommet et dont l’échec signifiait naturellement que j'avais menti en 1959 quand j'ai déclaré à avoir fait le sommet avec Toni Egger.

La vérité que je voulais prouver sur l’arête sud-est est la suivante:

Il n’y a pas de montagnes impossibles à gravir mais seulement des grimpeurs incapables de le faire.

De plus, au fil des ans, je suis encore plus convaincu que mettre en doute la parole d'un grimpeur signifie mettre en doute l'histoire entière de de l’alpinisme depuis Balmat.

Si je pouvais avoir une "baguette magique", je voudrais effacer le Cerro Torre de ma vie."



Ceci est une traduction libre mais respectueuse du message original. Et j’espère bien avoir un jour la chance de rencontrer Cesare Maestri dont la feuille de route m’impressionne beaucoup plus que celle de la cordée canado-américaine qui a déboulonné la Maestri/Claus/Alimonta.

Je ne suis pas un groupie. Je ne vénère personne. Mais nous sommes tous des nains juchés sur les épaules de géants et, si l’on tue les géants, il ne reste que des nains. On ne s’agrandit pas à détruire l’œuvre d’autrui après tout ce temps même si elle est discutable selon les normes de notre époque. Réécrire l’histoire et jeter aux ordures le patrimoine n’est pas digne de la tradition de l’Alpinisme. Un mensonge potentiel, un suréquipement, valide-il une destruction après un demi-siècle? Ce n’est pas l’esprit de la Montagne.

C’est un dangereux précédent qui ouvre la porte à toutes les dérives et à tous les intégristes de la pureté originelle.

Quand la cordée canado-américaine aura le palmarès partiel ci-dessous (réalisé, bien entendu, avec l’équipement de l’époque), je pourrai considérer une révision de mon jugement. Ceci tiré de Wikipedia en italien mais vous comprendrez sans doute le terme ‘’solitaria’’ :



Le sue prime imprese di rilievo risalgono al 1951, quando salì in solitaria la via Detassis-Giordani al Croz dell'Altissimo, e per primo effettuò la discesa in solitaria dalla Paganella. Nel 1952 diventa guida alpina. Da allora si susseguirono numerose imprese, principalmente sulle Dolomiti; tra queste ricordiamo:

la via Dibona al Croz dell'Altissimo (1952)

la via Comici al Salame del Sassolungo (1952)

la via Solleder in Civetta (1952)

la via delle Guide sul Crozzon di Brenta (1953)

la via Trento (Detassis) alla Brenta alta (1953)

la via Soldà al Pilastro sud della Marmolada di Penia (1953)

la traversata dalla Cima d'Ambièz alla Bocca del Tuckett concatenando in solitaria 16 cime della catena centrale in meno di 24 ore (1954)

la via Vinatzer al Sass de Luesa (1955)

la via Oppio al Croz dell'Altissimo (1955)

la via delle Guide al Crozzon di Brenta in discesa (1956)

lo spigolo nord del Cimon della Pala in prima solitaria invernale (1956)

la via Micheluzzi al Piz Ciavazes (1956)

la via Solleder al Sass Maor (in discesa), la via Buhl e la via Maestri - Baldessari (in discesa) alla Roda di Vael, le nuove vie aperte tra il 1964 ed il 1966 in Brenta su Cima Grostè, Cima Campiglio, Cima Massari.

Tutte queste imprese furono realizzate in solitaria.



J’ai bien besoin de deux aspirines ….

Two bottles of aspirin. Yes, two ...

It took me two bottles of aspirin, this week to digest all the nonsense on the forums read Anglo-American and French about the Cerro Torre and the Way of the compressor.

Passes though some do not like my prose. Passes though some do not understand my argument. But to not understand the whole story, not to be able to see the ins and outs of the case, not to appreciate the drift that such action may cause ... and I thank Bayer the assistance of their flagship product!

To sum up: two climbers have climbed Cerro Torre''''by fair means but using - as they say - two or five anchors in place. Who can swear here that only five anchors, not ten or twenty or thirty? It is only their word that proves it ... use in mountaineering.

Both climbers intended to debunk the path of Compressor prior to departure. And they kept the anchor which is strange for artifacts that have no value for them. This action was made despite a consensus among local climbers and Argentina. I do not think you would agree, in France, as Argentines decide what equips or unequip the country ...

Some people, famous climbers and others who are less so, said the compressor was not the road history and, thereby, anchors are just a waste. Cleaning is a realignment to restore its purity in the mountains of yesteryear. Why are these climbers did not clean themselves well before remains a mystery. Why cheer now instead of doing ten years ago?

Me, the mountains, I am not a religion. It is interesting blocks of rock and ice that can be fun to climb. The beauty of a mountain and purity are only Western fantasies and I consider that the Cerro Torre is''good''Toad the Sea, a lot of rock climbing walls 10 meters at low tide. I am a skeptic and an atheist.

The Way of the compressor has been increased in 1970, the era of Directissimes, the time of the end of mountaineering, the era of big domestic shipments, when it was considered that some walls still could not be climbs. Or they were with a lot of ways in artificial, and it was considered''by fair means.''

The Way of the compressor is a historic road. She was much written since 1970 and I do not know a lot of lines that justified a book or two by Messner, a cult film, articles in national newspapers, all references in books on mountaineering, Forty years of controversy ... in short, loud and clear that this is not a historical path is lying to the gallery.

Even more, the Way of the compressor, because of its reputation, has generated much vocations and many Alpine climbers known to have climbed unequip it without thinking. Number of unknowns and would have liked to do it one day. It is now impossible because of purity. This way was more than just a scale of fixed points: in fact, talking about 1200 meters of rock to dream that now remain the stronghold of an elite sponsored.

Déséquipée if it had been two years, five years after its creation ... but no ... no climber''Celebration''has accepted this mission despite the criticism. Darling himself wanted to cut the anchors on the way down but bad weather and his companions have dissuaded. It was his line and he was within his rights.

The Way of the compressor is now 42 years .... And it is no longer a dream that many will take care of us forget.

I have known and hated in my hometown unequipped for an entire site. Say 75 tracks in two days. But these tracks were mine, I had channels and pay in full all the material from a pittance and had equipped in record time. I know so well what I mean!

What gave me the idea to ask the person who has equipped the way of what he thinks compressor. So I phoned Cesare Maestri!

Yes ... I contacted Maestri. In this, I showed more heart than the conquerors of the useless who liquidated the Maestri / Claus / Alimonte. For it is the official name of the Way of the compressor, you know?

I'll spare you the courtesies:

"I want to remind you that in recent years, I decided not to speak of Cerro Torre.

The reasons that led me to this decision are twofold: there is the controversy over those who want to humiliate and destroy the wonderful history of mountaineering, but basically I know that taking up the controversy, I throw in gasoline on the fire and I'm complicit in their dirty Thurs

As for the "Compressor Route" (I prefer to call the "Maestri-Claus-Alimonte" on the ridge south-east), I can say that I consider it an incredible way that we have faced for make it even more obvious the failure of those who were forced to retreat after being stopped a few hundred meters from the summit, climbers considered the best in the world, unable to go to the top and the failure of which meant of course I lied when I said in 1959 to have made the summit with Toni Egger.

The truth that I wanted to prove on the southeast edge is:

There is no mountain impossible to climb but only climbers unable to do so.

In addition, over the years, I am even more convinced that to doubt the word of a climber means to question the entire history of alpinism from Balmat.

If I could have a "magic wand", I would delete the Cerro Torre in my life. "



This is a free translation, but respectful of the original message. And I hope to one day have the chance to meet Cesare Maestri including the road map impresses me far more than the Canadian-American roped who debunked the Maestri / Claus / Alimonte.

I'm not a groupie. I do not worship anyone. But we are all dwarfs perched on the shoulders of giants, and if you kill the giants, there are only dwarfs. We can not grow to destroy the work of others after all this time even though it is questionable according to the standards of our time. Rewrite history and heritage take the garbage is not worthy of the tradition of mountaineering. A lie potential, an oversupply, it validates destruction after half a century? This is not the spirit of the Mountain.

This is a dangerous precedent that opens the door to all the excesses and all the fundamentalist original purity.

When the rope has the Canada-US Partial ranking below (made, of course, with the equipment at the time), I may consider a review of my trial. This taken from Wikipedia in Italian but you probably understand the term''solitaria'':



The premium imprese sue di rilievo risalgono al 1951, quando dirty in the solitaria via Detassis al-Giordani dell'Altissimo Croz, e per primo effettuò discesa in the solitaria dalla Paganella. Nel 1952 diventa mountain guide. Da Allora if susseguirono imprese numbers, principalmente sulle Dolomiti; work ricordiamo quest:

Via Dibona al dell'Altissimo Croz (1952)

Via del Sassolungo Comici Salame al (1952)

Via Solleder in Civetta (1952)

Via delle Guide Crozzon sul Brenta (1953)

Via Trento (Detassis) went Brenta alta (1953)

Balance Via della Marmolada South Pilastro al di Penia (1953)

the traversata dalla Cima Ambi went Bocca del Tuckett concatenando top 16 in solitaria della catena in central meno di 24 ore (1954)

Via al Vinatzer Sass of Lues (1955)

Via Oppio al dell'Altissimo Croz (1955)

Via delle Guide Crozzon al di Brenta in discesa (1956)

lo Spigolo Cimon della Pala del North in prima invernale solitaria (1956)

Via Micheluzzi al Piz Ciavazes (1956)

Via al Solleder Sass Maor (in discesa), via e Buhl Via Maestri - Baldessari (in discesa) Roda di Vael went, the work he nuove life aperte 1964 ed Brenta in 1966 he knew Grostè Cima, Cima Campiglio, Cima Massari .

Tutte quest imprese furono realizzate in solitaria.



I really need two aspirins ....

Jean Gurtorju -- "It took me two bottles of aspirin, this week to digest all the nonsense ..."

There is a certain granola crowd, mostly over 50...