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crankster
Trad climber
No. Tahoe
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Nov 23, 2015 - 09:10pm PT
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A fan, HFCS? I'll say this, he's to my left but an interesting voice and has been since the 60's. Anyone on Nixon's enemy's list is all right by me.
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Loco de Pedra
Mountain climber
Around the World
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Nov 24, 2015 - 01:17am PT
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When you think is peace and safety:
A sudden destruction.
Collective security for surety, ye-ah!
Don't forget your history;
Know your destiny:
In the abundance of water,
The fool is thirsty.
Rat race, rat race, rat race!
Rat race!
Oh, it's a disgrace
To see the human-race
In a rat race, rat race!
Prophet Bob Marley
[Click to View YouTube Video]
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dirtbag
climber
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Nov 24, 2015 - 06:01am PT
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We never win when we let fear and prejudice dictate our actions.
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EdwardT
Trad climber
Retired
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Nov 24, 2015 - 09:35am PT
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Anyone else catch Obama's weaksauce address?
Lots of tough talk. Hollow rhetoric.
Sounded like something written by Jack Handy.
"We're strong enough. We're tough enough. And gosh darnit, we're gonna beat those Isil guys".
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crankster
Trad climber
No. Tahoe
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Nov 24, 2015 - 09:37am PT
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I thought the opposite. Good speech and message.
You don't get credit for the attacks you prevent. We are no less safe here in the U.S. than before Paris.
Trump talks tough. You can have him. Or any of the Republicans. Not a leader in the bunch. They are making us the laughing stock of the world.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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Nov 24, 2015 - 09:40am PT
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Obama hater listened to Obama and got mad.
Obama lover listened to Obama and got happy.
News at 11.
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crankster
Trad climber
No. Tahoe
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Nov 24, 2015 - 09:42am PT
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Happy? No. Just happen to support the president. You don't? Tell me who could handle this better then.
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HighDesertDJ
Trad climber
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Nov 24, 2015 - 09:46am PT
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I'm just pointing out that both of you appear to have gotten out of the speech what you went into it with. It's like a perfect little microcosm of our current political discourse. I'm not criticizing you for liking it or Ed for hating it, just observing how predictable both of those things were.
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crankster
Trad climber
No. Tahoe
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Nov 24, 2015 - 10:05am PT
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The president answered specific questions at the press conference. Maybe he should have held off posting here and listen instead.
Righties have the complaining down cold. Offering specific solutions, not so much.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Nov 24, 2015 - 10:20am PT
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Nov 24, 2015 - 10:25am PT
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Righties have the complaining down cold. Offering specific solutions, not so much.
I'm no lefty, but I'm sure as hell not a righty either. And, unlike The Chief, I don't pretend to know all the solutions in Syria.
But I do know and understand the difference between conventional troops and unconventional forces. I even know what a regiment is (in "normal" and British and Russian parlance BTW) and how it differs from a demi-brigade (which is a uniquely French military unit). I can think for myself too, instead of parroting the "anger-of-the-day" while pissing on everyone else who posts if their opinions are different by any scintilla at all.
As western ground intervention in Syria begins to seem conceivable, one wonders how it would play out. Here's a scenario that I believe is possible as one element of such an intervention. In part I base these ideas on the article in The Atlantic already described above:
"What ISIS Really Wants" by author Graeme Wood.
Here's the link again:
http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/03/what-isis-really-wants/384980/
I am a civilian. I don't have any special connections in the military, I have no contacts with or access to classified information. I've never lived in the Middle East. I don't have any unique way to judge the quality of this article, other than decades of studying history, emphasizing military history. I am so shallow in my interests that two thirds of all the reading I do is non-fiction, military history.
Based on these non-qualifications, my feeling is that Wood's article is very accurate in it's analysis. He certainly put a lot of work and thought into it.
Key in for a moment on the following comments from Wood's article:
For certain true believers—the kind who long for epic good-versus-evil battles—visions of apocalyptic bloodbaths fulfill a deep psychological need.
The Islamic State has attached great importance to the Syrian city of Dabiq, near Aleppo. It named its propaganda magazine after the town, and celebrated madly when (at great cost) it conquered Dabiq’s strategically unimportant plains.
It is here, the Prophet reportedly said, that the armies of Rome will set up their camp. The armies of Islam will meet them, and Dabiq will be Ro“Dabiq is basically all farmland,” one Islamic State supporter recently tweeted. “You could imagine large battles taking place there.” The Islamic State’s propagandists drool with anticipation of this event, and constantly imply that it will come soon. The state’s magazine quotes Zarqawi as saying, “The spark has been lit here in Iraq, and its heat will continue to intensify … until it burns the crusader armies in Dabiq.”
Now that it has taken Dabiq, the Islamic State awaits the arrival of an enemy army there, whose defeat will initiate the countdown to the apocalypse.
There's a lot more in the article, but this is the internet, and no-one reads longer excerpts (hell, no-one is going to read this anyway; just this is too long for the internet).
If Wood's take on this city of Dabiq is accurate, western forces should accommodate ISIS. We should insert western ground forces into Dabiq ("take it back" in a manner of speaking). At minimum this would humiliate ISIS. At maximum they would "have" to take it back again themselves. And they can't take it back without using conventional military tactics. At least mostly conventional tactics.
What could work better to kill ISIS? "Make" them come to us, attack us. We wouldn't have to root them out.
Again, at minimum such occupation would highly embarrass "the Caliphate." At minimum this would establish an operating base in the country for further, western, anti-ISIS operations.
Those who know their military history might find the scenario (especially if the French Foreign Legion is used, which it should be) similar to Dien Bien Phu in 1954. But only the concept's start is similar. Unlike 1954, the west would have virtually unlimited, highly accurate fire support, and unlimited logistics support. And this enemy is no Viet Minh (limited ability to re-arm, many fewer troops and weapons, and very different terrain).
Negotiating with ISIS won't work. Killing them will be necessary if we decide to intervene. Taking this "holy" city might work as a way to make them come out of the woodwork and attack us (it seemed to work nicely at Kobani).
If I had the choice, I'd put in one French battalion equivalent, one British battalion equivalent and two US battalions, with supporting troops (for example, to receive logistics, some armor, military police to work with civilians and the like). And, although the main "killing" would be by defensive operations, offense would also be used (from patrols on up).
We live in interesting times.
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The Chief
climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
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Nov 24, 2015 - 10:35am PT
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I even know what a regiment is (in "normal" and British and Russian parlance BTW) and how it differs from a demi-brigade (which is a uniquely French military unit)
Yup, you sure do know about the difference don't you MTNYOUNG..
3e Régiment étranger d'infanterie, 3e REI... is an infantry regiment of the French Foreign Legion. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/3rd_Foreign_Infantry_Regiment
13e Demi-Brigade de Légion Étrangère, 13e DBLE... mechanized infantry demi-brigade of the French Foreign Legion. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/13th_Demi-Brigade_of_the_Foreign_Legion
BTW FWIW: Neither is unique to ONE specific nations defense force.
Regiment is a permanent unit of an army typically commanded by a colonel and divided into several companies, squadrons, or batteries and often into two battalions.
Brigade is a subdivision of an army, typically consisting of a small number of infantry battalions and/or other units and often forming part of a division.
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Nov 24, 2015 - 10:38am PT
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The Chief, without reference to the internet, correct your earlier mistake in calling both of the French units you describe above "regiments."
I can make this correction and describe each of these formations and each of the formations described in my post too.
My points? You know a lot less than you think you know. I know more than you think. And yet you're a jerk to everyone. I'm only a jerk to people who earn it (and you've worked very hard to earn it).
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Nov 24, 2015 - 10:42am PT
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The Chief, from memory, describe all of these units types and their history within the US, Russian, British, French and German armies.
You can't.
You know a little, not a lot. You throw phrases around to make it sound like you know what you're talking about.
You can't/don't even differentiate between conventional and unconventional operations.
Is this a problem? Nope, never, not if you approach the issues calmly and fairly. Not if you're nice to others. But you're incapable of that, "know-it-all."
Critique my actual idea now.
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The Chief
climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
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Nov 24, 2015 - 10:43am PT
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MTNYOUNG... You're right. I mistyped.
REGI... DEMI, whatever.
One is bigger than the other. BFD. Bottomline, they are BOTH composed of a bunch of ruthless Mercs.
EDIT
You know a little.....
Have you EVER actually operated with either or any FFL org for that matter, MTNYOUNG?
I have, with the 13th out of Djibouti when doing NSA etc extractions out of Eritrea back in the early 90's.
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Nov 24, 2015 - 10:47am PT
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The Chief can "copy/paste."
From memory, The Chief," how do/have the British and Russians use the word "Regiment" differently from other western armies?
What is a "demi-brigade" and what's it's history?
I wouldn't be picking on such tidbits, The Chief, other than to prove that you throw phrases around that you don't understand.
Again, I have no problem with people who do this, per se. I do have a problem with people who do it and then treat others like crap for doing the same types of things. You do the latter.
Clean up your act and I'll stop picking on you (since, if you'd take the time to read your posts and mine, you and I agree on many of these issues).
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The Chief
climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
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Nov 24, 2015 - 10:50am PT
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Clean up your act and I'll stop picking on you
Priceless.
So, answer my question MTNYOUNG, have ever actually operated with any "entity" of the FFL, Regi, Demi or whatever, yes or no.
Simple answer.
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Nov 24, 2015 - 10:51am PT
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MTNYOUNG... You're right. I mistyped.
REGI... DEMI, whatever.
One is bigger than the other. BFD. Bottomline, they are BOTH composed of a bunch of ruthless Mercs.
Wow, an almost-admission of fallibility. That's fair.
Again, the details aren't the point here. The point is that you have no basis and no right to condescend to so many others here.
Rejoin the conversation as an equal and I'll forgive that you don't know a demi-brigade from a regiment, from a British regiment, and from a US battalion :)
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The Chief
climber
Down the hill & across the Valley from......
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Nov 24, 2015 - 10:53am PT
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Will Mtnyoung have you ever personally operated with DEMI or REGI, either or any FFL entity, Yes or No.
as an equal ...
Not unless you have actually operated with any entity of these ruthless mercs know as the FFL.
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Nov 24, 2015 - 10:55am PT
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So, answer my question MTNYOUNG, have ever actually operated with any "entity" of the FFL, Regi, Demi or whatever, yes or no.
Simple answer.
Gimme a second to get back to it. I've got a cold, and, nitwit or not, you're fast as hell on the keyboard.
Nope, never served.
I've studied military history passionately since I was 10. I own and have read thousands of books on all aspects of military history. I stay current on current events from all types of sources (even from Supertopo links provided by you and others - thanks for that).
And I've got an open mind.
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