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SalNichols
Big Wall climber
Richmond, CA
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Aug 28, 2013 - 10:29pm PT
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CrAnkster,
That's exactly the kind of input I need. Thanks.
Nick
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SplitPants
Social climber
LA
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Aug 28, 2013 - 10:31pm PT
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SalNichols
(FYI) I sent you a PM
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crankster
Trad climber
South Lake Tahoe, CA
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Aug 28, 2013 - 10:50pm PT
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Suggestion:
I've been following this thread for almost a month. I still don't have a clear timeline of Matt's activities while he was in Mammoth (could be just me), what he did with his friends and what he did on his own. I know the basics, but it seems like all pertinent information is being given to the MLPD, SAR & some others via phone calls, etc. I'm not sure all that is known has been given here. If it has, I'd suggest it be condensed into a list.
The reason is, again, to establish any possible patterns and try to predict as much as possible what he might have done on July 17th. I'm aware climbers can be totally spontaneous, too.
Can we get a daily accounting of his activities, calls, texts, climbs? I know his laundry was clean and he had apparently been in town on the 16th. Seeing everything in chronological order would be helpful, I think. I'm not suggesting the family is not sharing information.
Like this (example, not actual facts):
July 6: took car to shop. Hiked to XYZ Lake with friends
July 7/8: V-Notch with John
July 9: rest day, library
Etc...
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SplitPants
Social climber
LA
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Aug 28, 2013 - 11:08pm PT
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Crankster & All,
We have been working on this behind the scenes so as to not cloud up this thread. I am going to attach what we have so far, but please understand it is still a work in progress(draft) and it is being validated by several people behind the scenes. Which means subject to change. I will follow with separate posts because it won't let me load all of this under a single post.
CHARACTERISTICS
GEAR
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SplitPants
Social climber
LA
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Aug 28, 2013 - 11:09pm PT
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Timeline (sorry about the copy/paste format, I dont have time to tweak right now)
The following is a chronological timeline from when Matt arrived in Mammoth Lakes until he went missing on July 17, 2013. This page also contains important facts not tied to specific dates.
Notes:
1. For phone and text message information: text message times posted as ET and PT conversion has been added. For phone calls the times posted to the forum are PT and ET conversions have been added. Phone and text information posted by Tiffany.
2. Posts to summitpost.com -The server is 8 hours ahead of PDT, not 7. Suspect someone else also made an error due to daylight saving as the server appears 1 hour ahead of GMT. Be advised to confirm post time directly with summitpost.com
3. Items shaded in yellow is to draw attention to the comment/fact.
4. Items in red font are those that require confirmation/unknown
5. Historical weather reports were checked for dates 7/14 through 7/21. Nothing of significance was found except some precipitation on 7/21.
Climbs done in the area prior to 7/13 [as reported by Tom Davidcock, Jill & John]
(6/29) Rock climbing Crystal Crag with Jill & John
(6/30) Rock climbing Clark Canyon with Jill & John
(7/1) Rock climbing Iris Slabs with Jill & John
(7/2) North Peak via North Coulior with Jill & John
(7/3) Rock climbing Gong Show Crag with Jill & John
(7/4) Rock Climbing Benton Crags with Jill & John
(7/5 & 7/6) V notch route on polemonium and peak Palisades v Notch with Jill & John
Hiked in 7/5 in the evening, camped and got an early start on 7/6
Per summitpost on 7/8 by Matt "Did the V-Notch on Saturday, July 6th. We easily crossed the schrund via a snow bridge at the far left side. We studied the route well for signs of rockfall before committing, and only had one baseball sized rock rocket down during our ascent. Tons of rocks were falling down the U-Notch, though." See detailed timeline below for link and screen capture of post.
(7/7) Hiked to Emerald Lake to Mammoth Crest with Jill & John
(7/8) Reigeluth Minaret (solo)
Per Jeg/Jill on 8/27 from when she checked her husbands text from Matt "the reigelhuth minaret took less that 6.5 hrs r/t to hike and climb but was scary and the Dana couloir was easy but fun and had the best ice of the trip." As far as we know he didn't climb Michael minaret.
Forum comment/observation from [High Fructose Corn Spirit] on 8/28 regarding this new information "So apparently Matt did not climb the SE Face on the 11th or 12 but some variation on the East."
(7/9) Dana Coulior (solo)
See comment under Reigeluth Minaret
(7/11) Clyde Minaret-verified with registry signature (solo)
Per Jeg/Jill on 8/27 "I looked back at my husband's text from Matt and he said he did" a fun and absolutely classic scramble up the 5.5 direct variation of the rock route on the Clyde minaret"
(7/12) Mammoth Crest (solo)
(7/13) Unicorn Peak (solo)
JUNE 28TH TO JULY 17TH TIMELINE DETAILS
June 28th (Friday)
Matt arrived in Mammoth and met up with friends (Jill and John who were with him up until July 7th)
Friends indicate Matt’s car was in and out of the shop since he arrived in Mammoth (thermostat replacement etc…). He knew driving to mammoth something was wrong with his car and dropped it off at the shop the first day. They tried changing the thermostat twice but when Matt would test drive it, he knew it wasn't fixed. He finally took it in for the 3rd time on July 5 and was told it was the head gasket. He was told they couldn't start working on it until July 9.
Matt was staying at the Shady Rest Campground
Campground payment was made day-to-day and in advance
Credit card charge Norco Service Center in the amount of $152.92
Post to summitpost.com http://www.summitpost.org/phpBB3/post927240.html#p927240
Matthew Greene summitpost
June 29th (Saturday)
Rock climbing Crystal Crag with Jill & John
June 30th (Sunday)
Rock climbing Clark Canyon with Jill & John
Credit card charge for Vons in the amount of $37.37
July 1st (Monday)
Rock climbing Iris Slabs with Jill & John
Credit card charge for Chevron in the amount of $46.47
July 2nd (Tuesday)
North peak via north coulior with Jill & John
July 3rd (Wednesday)
Rock climbing Gong Show Crag with Jill & John
July 4th (Thursday)
7/4-Rock Climbing Benton Crags with Jill & John
Matt’s car (Subaru) broke down (head gasket issues) around the 4th. Matt had to wait for the holiday to pass to get the car into the shop. Car left with Norco Goodyear repair shop with plans to stay behind and wait for the repair. Plans to meet up with friends in CO down the line. Was planning on being back home in PA on 8/18 at the latest.
Car repair was due to be completed on July 18th at which point Matt was planning on leaving town
July 5th and 6th (Friday and Saturday)
V notch route on polemonium and peak Palisades v Notch with Jill & John
Hiked in 7/5 in the evening, camped and got an early start on 7/6
Per Matt's post to summitpost.com on July 8th (see 7/8 for screen capture) "Did the V-Notch on Saturday, July 6th. We easily crossed the schrund via a snow bridge at the far left side. We studied the route well for signs of rockfall before committing, and only had one baseball sized rock rocket down during our ascent. Tons of rocks were falling down the U-Notch, though"
July 7th (Sunday)
Hiked to emerald lake to mammoth crest with Jill & John
Hiking companions/friends Jill and John left the Mammoth Lakes area
Credit card charge for Rite-Aid in the amount of $12.18
July 8th (Monday)
Reigeluth Minaret (solo)
Per Jeg/Jill on 8/27 from when she checked her husbands text from Matt "the reigelhuth minaret took less that 6.5 hrs r/t to hike and climb but was scary and the Dana couloir was easy but fun and had the best ice of the trip." As far as we know he didn't climb Michael minaret.
Forum comment/observation from [High Fructose Corn Spirit] on 8/28 regarding this new information "So apparently Matt did not climb the SE Face on the 11th or 12 but some variation on the East."
Credit card charge for Vons in the amount of $14.48
Posted to summitpost.com http://www.summitpost.org/phpBB3/palisades-conditions-t65093-30.html
Matthew Greene summitpost
July 9th (Tuesday)
Dana Coulior (solo)
July 10th (Wednesday)
Rested (per Jill)
7/10 4:59 PM ET / 1:59 PM PT 15 Peak -- (parents)
7/10 5:26 PM ET / 2:26 PM PT 3 Peak
Credit card charge for Vons in the amount of $23.53
July 11th (Thursday)
Log does not show any voice or text messages
Took the shuttle and climbed Clyde Minaret (confirmed) -solo
[ddsstyle] "I am a maintenance worker at Devils Postpile NM. I ride the shuttle bus every day from Mammoth to work at the Postpile. My birthday is july 16th. I was on the first bus of the day at 7:15 that morning. I think there is a possibility that I saw Matthew that morning. There is also a possibility this interaction occurred on the 11 or 12 of july. The person I spoke with fits his description very well. He was wearing glasses on the bus and told me about how his subaru blew a head gasket. He said he had been in Mammoth for several days. He had a medium sized day pack. No gear was attached to the outside. I believe he said he was from the east coast. maybe PA or NY... We spoke about doing Ritter, Banner, Clyde, and the cross country hike between Ediza, Iceberg, Cecile, and Minaret lake. He was unclear of his itinerary for the day when he got of the bus at Devils Postpile. Can anyone confirm any info for me such as his hometown, if he wore glasses, and if he did indeed drive a subaru? There is also a possibility that this interaction occurred on the bus a few days prior, like on july 11 or 12. The reason that I feel the interaction may have happened a few days prior to the 16th is that I think I recall talking about how I was going to do Middle Palisade on the 14th...I just cant be sure when the interaction took place, which is killing me right now... I am leaning more towards prior to the 16th. Can anyone say if he had been day tripping into the reds meadow valley in the days prior to his disappearance? His photo and physical build jumped right out at me. The fact about the car also jumped out at me. My gut and the facts presented tells me Matthew is the person I had this interaction with, and that is occurred prior to the 16th. I just cant place the exact date. I have been in contact with the Mono County Sheriff... sending good vibes to all his family and friends..."
[ddsstyle] "I just saw the pic posted above. I am certain my interaction was with Matthew... again I just cant place the date...the more I think about it, the more I remember talking about DOING middle palisade on the 14th. The more I think, the more I feel our interaction happened prior to my bday on the 16th. I think I am just conflicted on dates because since it was my bday, it is jumping out at me for some weird reason. again I have contacted the Mono County Sheriff and hope to god this turns out good."
[TeddyKGBee/Tom] Later confirmed it was 7/11 that Matt took the shuttle.
This same day he talked to a local maintenance worker at Devils Postpile NM (via shuttle ride) about Ritter, banner, and the cross country hike between Ediza, Iceberg, Cecile, and Minaret Lake.
July 12th (Friday)
Mammoth Crest (solo)
7/12 8:10 PM ET / 5:10 PM PT 2 Peak -- (repair shop)
7/12 8:13 PM ET / 5:13 PM PT 1 Peak -- (repair shop)
Credit card charge for Rite-Aid in the amount of $15.19
July 13th (Saturday)
Unicorn Peak (solo)
7/13 7:15 PM ET / 4:15 PM PT Text Sent
7/13 7:21 PM ET / 4:21 PM PT Text Received
7/13 7:41 PM ET / 4:41 PM PT Text Sent
Credit card charge for Vons in the amount of $39.22
July 14th (Sunday)
Hiking/climbing/rest activity is unknown for this day per Jill
7/14 5:13 PM ET / 2:13 PM PT Text Received
7/14 5:24 PM ET / 2:24 PM PT Text Sent
7/14 5:50 PM ET / 2:50 PM PT Text Received
7/14 11:03 PM ET / 8:03 PM PT 1 Off-Peak -- (voicemail)
July 15th (Monday)
Was seen on Yarts bus going to Toulomne to climb some domes??? per Jill [unconfirmed]
7/15 8:04 AM ET / 5:04 AM PT 2 Off-Peak
7/15 9:01 AM ET / 6:01 AM PT 2 Peak
7/15 3:21 PM ET / 12:21 PM PT Text Received
7/15 7:44 PM ET / 4:44 PM PT Text Sent
7/15 7:46 PM ET / 4:46 PM PT 1 Peak -- (voicemail)
7/15 8:49 PM ET / 5:49 PM PT 2 Peak
7/15 9:34 PM ET / 6:34 PM PT 1 Peak -- (voicemail)
7/15 9:35 PM ET / 6:35 PM PT 7 Peak
7/15 9:46 PM ET / 6:46 PM PT 1 Peak -- (voicemail)
7/15 10:34 PM ET / 7:34 PM PT Text Received
7/15 10:36 PM ET / 7:36 PM PT Text Sent
7/15 10:38 PM ET / 7:38 PM PT Text Received
July 16th (Tuesday)
7/16 11:12 AM ET / 8:12 AM PT 1 Peak -- (voicemail)
At about 2:45 PM (Pacific Time?) Matt posted to summitpost.com via the local library
http://www.summitpost.org/view_object.php?object_id=408661&type=vote_comments&discussion_id=473067#473067
7/16 6:00 PM ET / 3:00 PM PT Text Sent
7/16 6:06 PM ET / 3:06 PM PT 24 Peak -- (parents)
From 8:12 AM to 3:06 PM cell phone registered:
Lat 37.638167 Lon -118.961611, 1601 Meridian Blvd, Mammoth Lakes, Ca.
Directly south of the library. Directly north a mile or two from where Matt was camping.
7/16 7:29 PM ET / 4:29 PM PT 1 Peak -- (repair shop)
7/16 7:35 PM ET / 4:35 PM PT 2 Peak -- (repair shop)
From 4:29 PM to 4:35 PM cell phone registered:
Lat 37.630528 Log -119-033078, 5920 Minaret Rd, Mammoth Lakes, Ca, top of Mammoth Mountain.
This is the last phone call from Matt’s phone (per MLPD no more pings after the 16th of July at 4:35 pm)
7/16 7:40 PM ET / 4:40 PM PT Text Sent
7/16 8:57 PM ET / 5:57 PM PT Text Received
7/16 9:13 PM ET / 6:13 PM PT Text Sent
7/16 10:38 PM ET / 7:38 PM PT Text Received
7/16 10:52 PM ET / 7:52 PM PT Text Received
7/16 11:09 PM ET / 8:09 PM PT Text Sent
7/16 11:34 PM ET / 8:34 PM PT Text Received
Stayed at the campsite and also paid for next day’s stay (the 17th)
Credit card charge for Rite-Aid in the amount of $16.13 [needs follow up]
Purchase detail could provide valuable clue(s). Video may show glasses and/or clothing and/or someone with Matt.
From the clothing Matt was wearing taking into the clothing he left behind close friends may be able to determine what he may have been wearing when he went missing.
Per MLPD Verizon re: text message retrieval. Verizon only holds that information for about 3 to 4 days. Per Verizon too much time has passed by.
Credit and debit card(s) were NOT used after 7/16/13
Earthquake activity: http://volcanodiscovery.com/mammoth_mountain-earthquakes/archive/2013-jul.html
July 17th (Wednesday)
07/17 5:53 AM ET / 2:53 AM PT Text Received
Family traced who sent that last txt message and made contact but unfortunately the individual does not remember what he'd said and it's no longer on his phone.
Per MLPD: 2:48 pm, July 17, 2013, 39 Pinecrest, Mammoth Lakes, Ca, Verizon building and tower. This address is the main Verizon building/tower in Mammoth Lakes. There is no activity after the 16th of July, as indicated on my Verizon emergency request re: Greene’s cell phone, his phone was turned off/powered off. The 2:48 pm is not a ping, because there is no Lat & Lon indicated.
Per MLPD: Verizon nor any other cellular service provider ping text, it pings the telephone when the telephone is on, not turned off.
Per MLPD: From July 17, 2013 to July 30, 2013, 39 Pinecrest, Mammoth Lakes, Ca
Earthquake activity http://volcanodiscovery.com/mammoth_mountain-earthquakes/archive/2013-jul.html
ADDITIONAL FACTS (WITHOUT SPECIFIC DATES) & INFORMATION
Matt removed pages 369 to 398 (Chapter 12) from a book he had called The Hugh Sierra by R.J. Secor Third Edition
The Lyell pages were untouched. Ritter/Banner were the only snow routes in the area of torn pages and Matt was geared for snow.
Matt would text his friend John every few days up until July 13 and would give him an update on his car and what climbs he did (this is how the list of previous visits was compiled).
Matt was staying at the Shady Rest Campground site #164.
Upon inspection of Matt’s camp site everything was laundered, neatly folded and organized like he'd just done laundry. No doubt preparing to leave town.
Camp host did not speak to Matt on or near date he went missing.
Matt paid for his camp site daily and a day in advance. He had paid for the site through the 17th since his car was supposed to be ready on the 18th upon which time he was planning on leaving.
The camp host did not report Matt missing when he never returned, even though he paid for that night in advance.
The camp host placed Matt’s his tent into storage when Matt never came back and failed to call the police.
MLPD talked to the campers who camped on each side of Greene’s camp site 164. It was a family that paid for camp site 163 & 165. They left a few days prior to the 16th of July, and didn’t relay converse with Greene. They had no information.
MLPD indicated they only requested cell tower pings for calls not text messages. Per MLPD Verizon can’t ping a text just calls or if your phone is currently on.
Hospitals were notified of Matt's disappearance, as well as homeless shelters and hostels in the area - not sure how far that notification stretches though [dates of notifications unknown].
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SplitPants
Social climber
LA
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Aug 28, 2013 - 11:13pm PT
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Matts climbs (confirmed)
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Mtnmun
Trad climber
Top of the Mountain Mun
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Aug 28, 2013 - 11:32pm PT
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//The Muir route on Ritter or the 4th class now 5.8 on Banner, would have made for an easy day trip. Easy for Matts accomplishments but crazy exposed if he slipped.
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crankster
Trad climber
South Lake Tahoe, CA
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Aug 28, 2013 - 11:34pm PT
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Wow, wow, wow, SplitPants, the treasure trove of information! I'll need to read it a dozen times (and will) to absorb it.
First impressions:
Matt flat got after it. Didn't take rest days and go to the hot springs, etc. He was maximizing his climbing time there. No way he just went for a little hike on the 17th. I think he was going big on his last full day in Mammoth; a classic he'd had his eye on.
He knew public transportation and used it at least twice to go to Tuolumne to climb Dana and Unicorn, I speculate. These would not be fun hitch's, I'm thinking he took YARTS. No CC receipts of trips, so he paid cash. Might have gone farther afield on the 17th than I had thought. He liked Tuolumne.
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Crazy Bat
Sport climber
Birmingham, AL & Seweanee, TN
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Aug 28, 2013 - 11:36pm PT
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I was told about a cave rescue a couple of years ago. A group, who had never been in the cave, was trying to go from one entrance to another. They had a map of the cave.
The first rescue group to go in had along a guy who had never been in the cave before. He took the map and tried to follow it. He led them straight to the lost party.
Could someone, who has never been to the area, take the guidebook missing pages and try to retrace his route to the most likely destination?
Folks who know the area wouldn't make the same route finding mistakes, unless they were very common mistakes that SAR deals with all the time.
Just my thoughts after following this post.
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LAhiker
Social climber
Los Angeles
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Aug 28, 2013 - 11:37pm PT
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@SplitPants, your latest compilation of information and especially those timelines in tabular form are great!
Are you still thinking of up putting it all on a separate website, or will you simply post updated versions here?
@Crankster and Alli, I don't know whether you know that SplitPants has put an earlier version of all this info in PDF and Word format. But it sounds like she's almost ready with the updated version...
@Crazy Bat -- interesting idea. The problem is that Matt cut out 30 pages of Secor -- I think they included the whole Banner/Ritter range -- not sure what else!
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SplitPants
Social climber
LA
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Aug 28, 2013 - 11:38pm PT
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Ok.............question everyone.
After you all read the draft information I posted. Think............If I was Matt and had one last day in Mammoth where would I go that I could do in a day?
Look at the facts (e.g. no helmet, yet in every climbing pic he is wearing one), known to go off course (so means he might climb without a helmet)......etc.....
Post your "thoughts" and they will be captured for further analysis/questioning.
Thanks
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SalNichols
Big Wall climber
Richmond, CA
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Aug 28, 2013 - 11:39pm PT
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He bought Power Bars or something like that at CVS. I'd bet $1k on it.
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rottingjohnny
Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
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Aug 28, 2013 - 11:44pm PT
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Crystal Crag...?
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SplitPants
Social climber
LA
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Aug 28, 2013 - 11:51pm PT
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MGuzzy
LOL Not all the cat is out just yet.........now I am working on the other stuff......that is a little more difficult (sigh)
Hopefully this gives folks something to "chew" on for a bit.
-DRAFT-DRAFT-DRAFT-DRAFT
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granite_girl
Trad climber
Oakland
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Aug 29, 2013 - 01:47am PT
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In terms of potential routes, I would think the obvious route for Matt on his last day would have been the Southeast Glacier up Ritter, maybe via the Clyde variation, down Ritter's North Face on the opposite side, up Banner, then descent via the notch in the saddle between Banner and Ritter. Or the same trip in the opposite direction. A classic trip, and within Matt's capability. Though perhaps a bit long, particularly if he was taking the shuttle. But, Matt might have been okay with a late descent, and intended to hitch-hike back to his campsite that evening. Matt might have forgotten his helmet, or just felt that it was unnecessary on such an easy route (class 3/4). However, though the climbing is easy, a slip in many of those areas could be a disaster. Heck, just getting to the climb could be a disaster, if a boulder rolls the wrong way under your feet.
I'm not particularly familiar with this area. I assume that these are the areas that Cragman has been checking? Since Matt didn't sign either summit register, he probably never made it to the top of either peak.
Best wishes to Matt and his family.
EDIT: This is exactly the same route that GraniteHolyDog described. Backwards or forwards. I've heard of people doing it both ways.
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jeg
Social climber
center valley,Pa
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Aug 29, 2013 - 06:12am PT
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Also, group, keep in mind...
John and matt did more rock/crag climbing together that week b/c there were alot of potential thunderstorms, so they stayed away from the mountains.
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arickrock
climber
Charlotte, NC
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Aug 29, 2013 - 09:27am PT
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This forum and story although tragic has been an inspiration to follow.
In regards to the visions/dreams.....one common factor seems to be this blue diamond/crystal figure.
Just my observation from viewing the Flickr page and the discussion around the helmet.
All his climbing pictures show a Blue(in color) Black Diamond(brand) helmet.
I often try and read into my dreams but most of the time realize that its just my mind taking my experiences and distorting them in sometimes good and sometimes bad ways. The act of analyzing the dreams in itself I think is the beneficial process. It produces different angles of thought to look at the same problem through.
Just my 2 cents.....keep fighting the good fight folks! We have one awesome community to be proud of here.
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crankster
Trad climber
South Lake Tahoe, CA
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Aug 29, 2013 - 09:57am PT
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Jeg, the missing big boots, crampons, ice axe are leading everyone towards a climb involving snow/ice.
Was Matt commenting about the loose rock in the Minaret's? Cragman's TR's reiterate how dangerous the climbing is there. The Ritter Range is mostly volcanic rock, whereas Tuolumne is comparatively clean granite. With apologies to the Mammoth climbers on the post, I'd think a climber - after 2 ascents in the Minaret's- might be looking for more solid rock. He'd been to Tuolumne at least twice before.
Likely goals - Mt. Lyell or a repeat of the Dana Couloir. He mentioned it was great climbing.
He might have forgotten or not used his helmet when solo. The missing guidebook pages might have been in his pack from prior climbs.
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SplitPants
Social climber
LA
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Aug 29, 2013 - 10:10am PT
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Crankster +1
The only thing I have to add is it is my understanding (Jill/John can confirm) is the pages for Mt Lyell were left in the book and untouched.
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SuperTopo on the Web
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Let us know!