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jstan
climber
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Dec 29, 2013 - 06:38pm PT
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I would propose a fundamental metric.
Each thread needs to show what percentage of the posts to date on that thread are due to Mr. Anderson.
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BASE104
Social climber
An Oil Field
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Dec 29, 2013 - 09:37pm PT
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An intuitive personality is good if you are a scientist. It helps you see the forest for the trees. A more accurate description is you see relationships in dense data, and that intuitive imagination helps you come up with ideas.
We call prospects "ideas" in petroleum geology. I will be working an area with 20,000 wells, each of which has a number of data points. The light bulb goes off now and then.
Some sedimentary features are visible from log signatures. An example is a prograding shelf giving you a coarsening upwards sequence. I rarely pull out the calculator and do quantitative log analysis anymore. I've been looking at a hundred wells per day for 25 years. I can just look at a log and see it. Kind of like looking at The Matrix in code: blonde, brunette, redhead....
It looks like squiggly lines at first. This log is a series of carbonate cycles. Each sequence is the result of high and low stand of sea level. Climate change is one of the main drivers of where and how rocks are deposited. Changing sea level causes sequences of prograding shorelines. These match with changes in the Earth's orbit. Sea level rises and falls depending on how much ice is tied up in continental ice sheets.
Ed would dig this. This log uses a radioactive source for 3 of the curves.
edit: What I want to get at Ron, is that radiation is constantly being measured at numerous sites around the world. Why don't you google that stuff up, and perhaps with a little help from Ed on the interpretation, go to the source for the answer.
That is what is so messed up on these science threads. People are afraid to participate. Anyone can be a scientist. Most people are scientists without even being aware of it.
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tuolumne_tradster
Trad climber
Leading Edge of North American Plate
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Dec 29, 2013 - 10:03pm PT
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Another possible explanation for some of the radiation observed on the beach in Pacifica is the presence of naturally-occurring radioactive minerals in the beach sand and sediments that make up the uplifted terrace.
For example, Uranoan Thorite is one of many "heavy minerals" that contain gamma ray emitting radionuclides (e.g., U & Th) and occur in beach sands along the central California coast. Monazite is another common heavy mineral in beach sand that contains Th.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thorite
These photos were published by C. Osborne Hutton in Stanford University publication titled "Mineralogy of Beach Sands between Halfmoon and Monterey Bays, California.
Note the Th and U oxide compositions in this table compares Uranoan Thorite from Ano Nuevo beach to Tuolumne River sand near La Grange CA. The source of much of beach sand along the Central California coast is granitic rocks exposed in the "Salinian Block" in the Coast Ranges.
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BASE104
Social climber
An Oil Field
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Dec 29, 2013 - 10:50pm PT
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Have any of you taken the Myers-Briggs personality test?
I've been a science geek my whole life and scored in the NT group. High in intuition. The type is a very small part of the population, but about half of my friends are identical.
Weird how we bump into each other and become friends over a lifetime.
As to the Fukushima event, it can be measured. It can all be measured, and I'm sure it is. You will have to read what is out there, and try to find the good work while ignoring Ann Coulter types.
The trick is finding good science and recognizing bad science. That Carl Sagan book is really good at identifying bad science.
I don't want to pick on you, Ron, but you should read that book. I see you parroting bad science. Apparently because you have a pre-conceived stance and then you pick and choose the data to fit your position.
This is not anything new. Everyone must struggle with that. One of the easiest ways to step on your dick is to ignore data that shoots down your pet theory. You have to be detached, and ready for your precious idea to go down in flames. I admit that it is hard sometimes, but you have to do it. Nobody is easier to fool than yourself, it seems.
Cherry picking data is keeping the hits and disregarding the misses. You can't do that. All data must be explained.
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
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Dec 29, 2013 - 11:21pm PT
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Haha! I was too harsh on you Bruce! I thought it important to encourage Ron, since, unlike in the CC thread, he appeared to be looking for guidance and is sincerely concerned about Fukushima. I don't think what people post links to should be used as a way to put them down, as much as incentive to show them better information. In the case of Fukushima, good info seems hard to come by. The situation is clearly out of control, and if dilution of the contaminated water is such a great 'solution', then why all the pretense of putting it into tanks?
I thought Ron pointing out that we all pay attention to different things was important too. Why would an AGW person not believe, for instance, hook line and sinker, that our fish are contaminated? I believe the World Trade Center buildings were blown up yet I am not a Climate Change denier. They are two very different things of course, when CC and Fukushima have more in common. All three though are buried in various propaganda. In terms of prejudice, I see examples of it in regard to 911 more than anywhere. A single photo of 911 can show that the buildings were blown up, but CC and Fukushima are more complicated. I hate to bring up 911 but we are LITERALLY reminded of it every day by the media, less so for CC and especially Fukushima. We should applaud Ron for not dismissing the dangers Fukushima represents, and for not taking a lap dance from Ann Coulter, unless I am completely missing his drift. There is hope for Ron. I was totally surprised he did not eat that biscuit after shooting it - I would have!
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
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Dec 30, 2013 - 04:09pm PT
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Trust but verify! Hehe. You know what actor said that! Thanks Bruce, and thanks Jim for the 'love them to death' bit. When I want to leave a thread, but still feel like I need to say something, I start to feel really stuck, and images of tar pits come to mind. I'm trying to remember what the childhood cartoon was that I was subjected to. Happy New Years!
from; tar pit cartoon images.
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rockermike
Trad climber
Berkeley
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Dec 31, 2013 - 07:08pm PT
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We can't solve problems by using the same kind of thinking we used when we created them.
Albert Einstein
The Scientists have been running the world for 200 years. Theyve brought us electric lights, a cure to small pox, and Fukishima. The verict is still out in my mind..... :)
A million premature deaths attributed to Chrynoble.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chernobyl:_Consequences_of_the_Catastrophe_for_People_and_the_Environment
And someone up thread says nuclear better than fossil. And there is no alternative to the two? A typical 4 bedroom suburban house has 50 lightbulbs. I think we can do better. I think we better do better....
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
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Dec 31, 2013 - 07:10pm PT
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Scientists, one way or another, have always 'run' the world. Can't give up on them now. Can't stereotype them like that anyway. Scientists have a way of rising out of the muck......it's in the nature of the beast. There are many other 'types' that get in the way of scientists. THAT can be a good AND bad thing.
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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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Dec 31, 2013 - 07:23pm PT
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A million premature deaths attributed to Chrynoble.
COUGH BULLSH#T COUGH
As the wiki clearly states
The book was not peer reviewed by the New York Academy of Sciences.
Been a while since I researched it but I seem to recall very few direct deaths and much less cancer than you might expect.
The area is not as radioactive as most think either.. not probably good for kids but not really bad for older folks.
Chernobyl was terrible, Fukushima is not good, but both together still pale in comparison to the effects of the two biggest threats to humanities future.
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
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Dec 31, 2013 - 07:41pm PT
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but both together still pale in comparison to the effects of the two biggest threats to humanities future.
and those are.......? Giant asteroids and aliens?
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rockermike
Trad climber
Berkeley
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Dec 31, 2013 - 07:42pm PT
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selective reading dude.... you seem to be proving (everyones point) - our prejudices get in the way....
The primary author, the biologist Alexey V. Yablokov, is a member of the Russian Academy of Science, and was deputy chair of the commission of ecology of the USSR' Parliament (1989-1991), councillor on ecology and public health to the President of the Russian Federation (1991-1993) and chair of the state commission on dumping of radioactive wastes in seas surrounding the Russian Federation (1992-1993)
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Reviews
Two expert reviews of the book were commissioned by the Oxford journal Radiation Protection Dosimetry.[8] The first, by Dr. Ian Fairlie,[9] generally endorses the book's conclusions. Dr. Fairlie, a radiation biologist, was a scientific secretary to UK Government’s Committee Examining Radiation Risks from Internal Emitters [10] and one of two authors of the TORCH report commissioned by the European Green Party.[11] He greets the book as a
... welcome addition to the literature in English. The New York Academy of Sciences [is] to be congratulated for publishing this volume. [...] In the opinion of the reviewer, this volume makes it clear that international nuclear agencies and some national authorities remain in denial about the scale of the health disasters in their countries due to Chernobyl's fallout. This is shown by their reluctance to acknowledge contamination and health outcomes data, their ascribing observed morbidity/mortality increases to non-radiation causes, and their refusal to devote resources to rehabilitation and disaster management.
so the scientists are in disagreement. big surprise there....
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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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Dec 31, 2013 - 08:13pm PT
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so the scientists are in disagreement. big surprise there...
That is their discipline. But there is no discipline in this quoted book regarding a proper peer review panel. Does that mean it's wrong.. maybe not. But it is not a very good source at best. WHy couldn't this guy do an actual paper and get it published? That seems a worthwhile point of inquiry. Not one I'm interested in pursuing in depth I guess.
2 biggest problems.
Overpopulation and rapid climate change due to the massive energy needs of modern overpopulation.
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
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Dec 31, 2013 - 08:30pm PT
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Thanks, you left me guessing. That sounds about right regarding the 2 problems, if it can be narrowed down so ( to me anyway! ).
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
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Dec 31, 2013 - 08:32pm PT
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Well, I'm not moving!
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
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Dec 31, 2013 - 09:13pm PT
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OK - maybe I will have to move!
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McHale's Navy
Trad climber
From Panorama City, CA
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Dec 31, 2013 - 09:53pm PT
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That movie may have been made before workers started removing fuel rods from at least one of the reactor storage pools last November. What a mess - melting cores and the potential for storage pool collapse during an earthquake. The rod removal is supposed to take a year.
(By 'that movie' I mean the one linked just above, not the OPs movie )
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NutAgain!
Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
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Ed, thank you for being a source of straight-forward analysis on this and a variety of topics.
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tuolumne_tradster
Trad climber
Leading Edge of North American Plate
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You can't conclude anything meaningful from that video. Certainly not that "Fukushima Radiation hits San Francisco."
Check out the response by RW in the comments section posted 6 days ago below the video. RW provides an informed assessment of this video in terms of radiation measurement and risk.
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