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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Order of post: NAFTA, continent, Mexico
Coz, why pick on just Clinton, Bushie Sr was also for it apparently.
From that outstanding research site (with a pinch, or is that grain, of salt): Wikipedia
Following diplomatic negotiations dating back to 1986 between the three nations, the leaders met in San Antonio, Texas, on December 17, 1992, to sign NAFTA. U.S. President George H. W. Bush, Canadian Prime Minister Brian Mulroney and Mexican President Carlos Salinas, each responsible for spearheading and promoting the agreement, ceremonially signed it. The agreement then needed to be ratified by each nation's legislative or parliamentary branch.
Before the negotiations were finalized, Bill Clinton came into office in the U.S. and Kim Campbell in Canada, and before the agreement became law, Jean Chrétien had taken office in Canada.
So, Coz, if Bushie Boy Sr was (re-)elected over Clinton, NAFTA still would have been signed. Clinton inherited the politico part from the previous generation.
As for what defines a continent – there are five models/definitions – one seven continent model, two six continent, one five continent and one four continent. But in all of those models, Central America is still part of North America (and I think that Europe is just a panhandle of Asia, hence Eurasia).
Now back to Wikipedia (if it seems I make disparaging comments about the site, it is a great place to start researching something, but - especially with contentious, controversial and contemporary issues – much of the content should be questioned (ie given a second opinion, I suppose, by another source).
Okay: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continent
The seven-continent model is usually taught in China and most English-speaking countries. The six-continent combined-Eurasia model is preferred by the geographic community, Russia, the former states of the USSR, and Japan. The six-continent combined-America model is taught in Latin America, and most parts of Europe including Germany[citation needed], Greece[citation needed], Italy[citation needed], Portugal and Spain. This model may be taught to include only the five inhabited continents (excluding Antarctica)[20][21] — as depicted in the Olympic logo.[22]
So, depending on where and how you were educated all five models make sense.
But to the thread topic, I read about the cartel (and other) atrocities in Mexico and shed a tear for the country. So much mayhem and death it seems.
Media bias? (Remember I’ve been a journo for some 37 years in five countries, and I have no illusions about the “profession”). Most of my news comes from the Irish media, BBC, CNN, International Herald Tribune Forbes occasionally (for business), sometimes Christian Science Monitor and Wall Street Journal, various US paper websites. How much bull and spin am I being fed? That is why I do try various news sources. I have even watched Faux news, it reminds me of the old Saturday Night Live show.
I have no solutions for Mexico, the Middle East, Afghanistan (where my nephew/godson is at the moment with his Marine unit), Mexico drug cartels, nor for other conflicts further from US shores that receive less media treatment, such as Central Africa (Congo etc – kidnapping young children and turning them into “soldiers”), Sudan, and despot regimes like Burma.
I have my ideas, and beliefs, my politics on such issues but solutions? Unfortunately, none.
As for alcohol, I have now seen first hand its damaging effects - Korsakoff's Syndrome (Psychosis) (also Vitamin B1 Thiamine deficiency) on my most loved one. However, the damage has been stopped and now the process of hoping to reverse it.
And it amazes me how some people, even some health/medical professionals, think that alcoholism is a lifestyle choice. It is an addiction, an illness. Perhaps I learned that much too late and should have kept the other half more from the bottle than I did (BIG guilt trip there). Now the hard work of recovery begins. It has also hit our finances hard, as I am now her full-time carer, though the local health board is giving me some relief.
(Perhaps some of the above is better on another thread or new one.)
Am I off topic?
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Interesting Coz, I was actually starting to write that Clinton must have liked NAFTA too in order to sign it into law but I deleted that point. I guess I should have left it.
Of course there is little difference between Bush, Clinton and Obama US policy wide, much the same as since the end of WW2, in fact arguably since the Spanish-American War, if not earlier.
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Thanks Sully, but on a regular basis countries such as Finland and the Czech Republic are rated heavier drinkers than the Irish, but yeah, but there is some truth in part of the stereotype. I had a couple of beers starting when I was like 12 or so, with older brothers or family approval. I never turned it in to an addiction and illness.
But kids nowadays, at least in Ireland, are bingeing starting at the age of 11 or so. A couple of beers once or so a week when an adolescent back home in Cali, under supervision is one thing (or wine, my friends in Provençe that I worked for at Chateau Montaud, used to water down wine for their kids, but not much wine. Moderation is the key.
Bingeing on a naggon of spirits (vodka usually, with some Red Bull or such), as well as drinking five or six beers at a time and several times a week plus? At 13-18? But it is not only a problem that Ireland has.
Now back to the Mexican Drug Wars. Next...
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Patrick Sawyer
climber
Originally California now Ireland
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Thanks Jeff, she is slowly healing.
But what about Doug MacArthur as well with those other two?
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Jingy
climber
Somewhere out there
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wow... bluey admitting he knows little about this subject...
good call Bluering.
Nice map too.
I ponder a question: How many billion $$ industry is this?
Let's call it 50 billion to be on the safe side.
Now I ask: How do they get that product into the country?
If I believe my newspaper, of media, I'd believe that it comes in on the backs of Illegal immagrants who are coming to do the jobs americans won't do... 50-80 lbs at a time...
Then I think "Wait... that don't make sense... 50 billion.. on the backs... of .. still don't make sense..."
Then I think back to NAFTA...
Now there is a machine that can get some work done..
Businesses in the US can now send trucks over the border, pick up some shirts made in south america.. hide a few thousand pounds of "product" and then turn around and get it back into the US, without to much of a problem....
That would add up to the 50 billion, on the safe/short side...
Then I look at the real #'s.. way more than 50 billion, as far as I've been told....
you do the math... Is it really 50-80 pounds at a time? or would you be more apt to believe trcuk loads at a time?
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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I thought Clinton signed NAFTA into existence?
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Gene
Social climber
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As an addenda to DMT's Hershey story.......
Modesto and Oakdale are in Stanislaus County which happens to be one of the world leaders in the production of almonds. Hershey liked almonds. It liked lots of them. The almond trade here got its boost with bunches of $$$ sent to the US of A by the late great Mohammad Reza Pahlavi, aka, the Shah of Iran and King of Kings. His henchman purchased a gazzillion acres on the county's east side with the Shah's tainted bucks. It was a way for the Shah et al to allow a smooth landing if things went bad, however, the plan did not work out as well as they expected.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 10, 2010 - 11:20am PT
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Cool video Juan!
An update;
http://rantburg.com/poparticle.php?ID=305235&D=2010-09-10&SO=&HC=1
I found this interesting;
Two unidentified men were found early Thursday morning an area usually used by organized crime to dump their victims, according to Mexican news reports. The find was made in a vacant lot near the intersection of Vicente Guerrero and Bermudez where the victims were found nude with plastic bags tied around their heads, and messages on their person. One message read "For selling heroin to children", while the other read "For working with the old". In a related development, a message was scrawled on a wall near a nursery near the intersection of calles Children Heroes and Panama which warned for the return of a kidnap child, or else. Reports do not say who has been kidnapped.
Vigilantes???
An apparent kidnapping attempt was thwarted by an alert woman in her 60s who shot one armed suspect to death and wounded another. The abduction attempt took place at a residence on calle Ramirez Calderon, where the woman upon seeing the two suspects walk into the house, pulled a .32 revolver and fired at them repeatedly, killing one suspect and wounding the other.The surviving suspect fled the area and was later caught with a 9mm pistol by Juarez police units. The woman's husband, the presumed intended abduction victim, was hit in the shooting as well.
Nice shootin', Mom!
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BrianH
Trad climber
santa fe
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A government that criminalizes behavior that millions of its citizens engage in, risks its legitimacy. A government without legitimacy will eventually lose the ability to govern effectively and in the overall public interest.
This drug war is an attack on legitimacy.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Feb 24, 2011 - 05:57pm PT
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Easy to conflate and confuse drug killings and kidnappings, though, as both are common and sometimes happen at cross purposes. But straight kidnappings that have nothing to do with the drug war are incredibly common across the region for the same economic reasons as in the Gulf of Aden.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 16, 2011 - 07:40pm PT
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Global Hawk surveillance over Mexico. Sweet! These babies can loiter at 60,000 feet altitude and gather lots of intelligence without your even knowing they're there.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/americas/03/16/mexico.us.drones/#
These are also being used in Japan for the humanitarian mission after the big quake.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 16, 2011 - 08:00pm PT
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Makes you feel all fuzzy inside; don't it, Bleuy?
Oh, you betcha! Don't you?
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 16, 2011 - 08:09pm PT
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Amazing that those little things can fly all the way to South America, and still accomplish absolutely nothing.
Maybe you haven't been following the drug wars. Zetas are going down on a daily basis. The transit routes go through Mexico, through the hands of all the different cartels, including the most powerful and deadly, Zetas.
No need to fly to the sources if you can intercept them in Mexico. We are only flying the GH's over Mexico and relaying the intel, as well as probably montoring the situation if the Federales don't act.
Charlie Sheen better find a new source.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Mar 16, 2011 - 08:19pm PT
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GH's are strictly surveillance. No arms that I know of. Mexico would never allow that anyway.
Glanton, I'm not sure what cretanous behavior of mine is worthy of this discussion.
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ontheedgeandscaredtodeath
Trad climber
San Francisco, Ca
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Mar 16, 2011 - 08:44pm PT
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Result? Not one iota of change in transportation of drugs into the US.
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