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reddirt
climber
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Mar 23, 2010 - 02:30pm PT
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What an ignorant poseur you two are, Reddirt and...
please state your evidence for the sake for your own credibility. Thank you.
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taorock
Trad climber
Okanogan, WA
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Mar 23, 2010 - 02:31pm PT
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Rok,
Calm down. You are bouncing all around.
I've mined many materials both precious and industrial and I've seen huge waste due to lack of imagination and or innovation. Maybe you can relate to this since you live in an area that gets cold. Say you have a real bad wood stove and no insulation in your home and you need to crank through 8 cords of wood per winter. Using your imagination you get rid of the drafts, insulate the place and fix up the stove. Next thing you know your using half the amount of wood.
People who don't use their imagination tend to be the ones who stridently proclaim that everything comes from exactly this or that.
Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you everywhere - Albert Einstein
And BTW, you don't know me and your little fit and name calling is BS.
tao
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reddirt
climber
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Mar 23, 2010 - 02:32pm PT
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I just put ten thousand words into a row on this issue. What have you done?
quality, not quantity. this goes for mind altering substances as well, just a tip.
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reddirt
climber
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Mar 23, 2010 - 02:52pm PT
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I realized long ago that it is pointless to argue with an idiot, and skip over your long winded rants.
whew! confirmation. thanks. another permanent addition to the ignore pile.
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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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Mar 23, 2010 - 03:04pm PT
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whew! confirmation. thanks. another permanent addition to the ignore pile.
Yeah, but if you had ignored him from the start, we wouldn't have found out that you're a serial cervical dislocater (I'm married to one). So something good has come out of this discussion after all.
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reddirt
climber
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Mar 23, 2010 - 03:24pm PT
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grammar won't get you any further once you;ve alienated people by attacking/accusing them by name w/o evidence.
edit: bonus point for correct spelling of poseur, however.
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taorock
Trad climber
Okanogan, WA
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Mar 23, 2010 - 03:33pm PT
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I've been around ranchers who didn't much worry about predation, but they did have well thought out herds and land-use practices. That is not to say that things can't get out of balance with something as described above with wolves. I don't know. I'm not on the frontline here like Brokendownclimber.
What I do know is that it is worth examining the whole ecosystem (or for those computer types on the taco, taking a system view) and this does, in my view, include humans.
As this planet continues to increase in human population we need more ways to look at these problems than immediately passing judgement as if it is truth. Rural people (of which I've been most of my life) aren't immune from changing practices and adopting.
Ranchers, miners, farmers all have to deal with the bad ecological practices of their ancestors even if at the previous time they weren't considered to be bad practice.
Taking the whole system into consideration certainly improves quality of life. Just get behind some 60's V8 and inhale the fumes and compare that to a modern car and you will thank the likes of innovators who paved the way for the Clean Air Act.
Anger is a very cheap emotion and doesn't solve much, not that I think much gets solved on these boards, but I do enjoy the broad range of ideas and experience I read here. It takes time and process to figure these things out or even to frame the debate.
tao
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reddirt
climber
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Mar 23, 2010 - 03:35pm PT
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Wolves KILL. thats all they do. They do not contribute in the modern world.
ALL killing is bad? No killing is good?
don't think on that one too long else you'll refute some of your previous statements.
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reddirt
climber
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Mar 23, 2010 - 03:42pm PT
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the Canadian wolf will continue to spread until stopped. Certainly very soon into Washington, maybe later into Utah.
can SOMEBODY ANYBODY provide an educated & semi-logical or logical citation from anything semi or fully credible or somewhere in between?
I am not out west & have never heard of this threat but am (foolishly, skeptically) curious.
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taorock
Trad climber
Okanogan, WA
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Mar 23, 2010 - 03:43pm PT
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BTW, I heard a canadian wolf the other day while bouldering. It is different that the american ones that go: "ow-ow-ooooh" it was going "ow-ow-ooooh - eh"
Be careful out there.
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reddirt
climber
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Mar 23, 2010 - 03:44pm PT
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OMG I'm skeered!
Do they have wolves in Ballard or Fremont? How do I prepare for that?
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taorock
Trad climber
Okanogan, WA
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Mar 23, 2010 - 03:46pm PT
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Ballard for sure. I think they are the male equivalent of a cougar
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reddirt
climber
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Mar 23, 2010 - 03:50pm PT
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I think I know how to act too cool fer skool so that'll ward either off. if not I'll just get some tats. and piercings.
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coondogger
Trad climber
NH
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Mar 23, 2010 - 03:57pm PT
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My deepest sympathy for the family.
Temple Grandin has written an excellent book "animals in translation" a very fast read with pertinent information for folks who are posting with an argument of why it happened and what is too blame for the loss.
We have 60 million pet dogs in this country and thousands each year inflict a bite which needs professional care. An average of 15 deaths each year in this country occur from fatal dog attack.
67% occur from purebred dogs which account for less than 30% of all dogs in our country.
Dogs present a much greater risk to our general safety than wolves. Unfortunately she was running by herself in the very wild state of Alaska. I can only guess that many are motivated to move to Alaska for its wild untamed areas which include predators. It was a known and expected risk.
It is our responsibility to manage and understand the risks when we are in these places.
Peace be with you
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Studly
Trad climber
WA
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Mar 23, 2010 - 03:59pm PT
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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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Mar 23, 2010 - 04:17pm PT
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Do they have wolves in Ballard or Fremont? How do I prepare for that?
No. Well, not any more. There were wolves here at one time, but the saber-tooth tigers have eaten them all. Except for the ones killed by the black mambas and cobras.
So no worries about wolves.
Edit: Hmmm. Maybe we shouldn't have re-introduced the saber-tooth tigers...
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Brokedownclimber
Trad climber
Douglas, WY
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Mar 23, 2010 - 04:19pm PT
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It has taken only 3-4 years for the "Greater Yellowstone Ecosystem" wolves to migrate 350 miles to our little valley here is SE Wyoming. I have no doubts whatsoever, that there are ALREADY WOLVES IN UTAH!
They are already in Idaho, which is only about 78 miles wide across I-90, well on their way to E. Washington.
Wolves are an epidemic, left unchecked. I just learned that the 3 injured horses of the neighbor all had to be "euthanized," (a more PC word for killed, for the liberals out there).
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atchafalaya
climber
Babylon
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Mar 23, 2010 - 04:21pm PT
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"I would rather have the company of ten smart ranchers, than a hundred of the people who support taking the control of those honest mens lands..."
Don't you mean the state and federal lands that ranchers are destroying by overgrazing, and which they pay almost nothing to use for their benefit? We should take control of "our" lands and stop letting them graze their cows.
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xkyczar
Trad climber
denver
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Mar 23, 2010 - 04:25pm PT
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Forget wolves. Let's get back to the Pleistocene Megafauna. I want to have to negotiate Elephant herds on my desert tower approaches while riding my Bactrian camel. And those Canadian and Mexican wolves might think twice about entering Utah once the American Lions are back!
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