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Ksolem
Trad climber
Monrovia, California
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Topic Author's Original Post - Sep 26, 2009 - 03:35pm PT
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I apologize for the OT topic, but I know a lot of the climbers on this site are also responsible shooters, so here it is…
The California legislature has passed AB962. It is now up to the Governor to veto this bill or let it pass.
This bill mandates the following changes in the way you buy ammunition:
1) It will prohibit the sale of ammo in a manner that allows the ammunition to be accessible without the help of an employee. In other words, you’ll have to stand in line and have to wait to be shown the ammunition you may want to purchase.
2) It will require the dealer to ask for you ID each time you buy handgun ammunition and the dealer will record the following personal information:
a. A thumbprint
b. Your CDL #
c. Your home address and telephone number
d. The brand and type of ammunition that you purchased
e. Your date of birth
3) Additionally, it would be illegal to buy ammo via online or mail order methods, so if a local store can’t find you older, hard-to-get or obsolete ammunition, you won’t be able to get it via the internet.
Also the bill makes it a crime for anyone who is not a registered ammunition seller to transfer (give) or sell more than 50 rounds total per month, so if I want to take a few friends to the range and give them each a box of rounds I’m now a criminal.
This bill will drive up prices, make criminal the regular activities of law abiding citizens, and further stimulate the black market in ammunition which is the source for gang bangers and criminals.
Californians - please contact the Governor today and let him know your position on AB962.
You can contact him at 916-445-2841 and do an auto-vote as follows:
Listen to the recorded message and press in the following order:
1 (English)
2 (legislation)
2 (AB962)
2 (against) or 1 (support)
If it is busy – keep trying, and it is easier to get through after hours. It is all automated.
I was in Utah a few weeks ago and stopped in a local sporting goods store. I was able to grab some boxes of .357 off the shelf, take my basket to the friendly cashier, pay and leave.
This is America folks, not 1933 Germany. Wake up.
BTW, this law will effectively shut down the federally mandated Civilian Marksmanship Program too as they frequently transfer quantities of ammo without face to face contact.
http://www.gunnewsdaily.com/index.php/article-archives/117-californias-ammo-bill-ab962-end-federal-cmp-program
http://leftcoastconservative.blogspot.com/2009/03/ab-962-internet-ammunition-sales-to-be.html
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Sep 26, 2009 - 04:05pm PT
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Where'd you go in Utah?
50 rounds a month???
Ha ha, what a bad joke.
It'd take me a year just to save rds for ONE trip to the range.
Kalifornia!!!
Love it or leave it, its too late to change.
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Ksolem
Trad climber
Monrovia, California
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 26, 2009 - 04:43pm PT
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My wife, the infamous UberBabs, went to Gym Jones in Salt Lake for a few days, worked with Maximus and Twight. Then we hit up the City of Rocks in Idaho for a week.
Twas nice.
To be clear, you can buy more than 50 rnds at a time from a registered ammo retailer (all their employees will have to pass bg tests etc.,) but you as an individual you cannot transfer more tha 50/month even among your friends.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Sep 26, 2009 - 04:47pm PT
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Wow, thanks for the head's up! I was not even aware of this bill.
I'll do my best to make sure the Governor knows I support the bill and law changes contained within.
Interesting reasoning, to try to NOT support your local ammo dealer, who does everything to support shooters, and would be happy to find any obscure ammo that you'd want.
Thanks, again!
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Ksolem
Trad climber
Monrovia, California
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 26, 2009 - 04:54pm PT
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I figured we'd see a variety of opinions, and Ken M that is an interesting take on it.
My experience is that I can go to my local dealer and pay over $1/round for 8mm Mauser, or I can order military surplus online from Czeck Republic in 1200 rnd "sardine cans" for .30/round.
I'm all about supporting the local retailer, but in my area they have been crushed.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Sep 26, 2009 - 05:58pm PT
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I suppose that if I absolutely HAD to that I could live with limiting my ammo distribution to friends at 50/per friend per month.
(They shoot up too much of my ammo as is.)
But in no way could I live with a limit of "distributing" 50 rounds per month at my enemies!
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Ksolem
Trad climber
Monrovia, California
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 26, 2009 - 06:27pm PT
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I agree with your comments except of course for the "brain ratio" thing.
The problem here, to a great extent, is that we have a legislature which does not represent the people due to artful gerrymandering of districts. Arnold tried to undo that, to put districting into the courts, and got shut down hard by guess who? The friggin' legislature.
The whole bunch of them need to go. Hey! There's an election coming up.
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Ksolem
Trad climber
Monrovia, California
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 26, 2009 - 06:37pm PT
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" ...The bigger the state, the harder for a candidate to rise up who is NOT in the pocket of big money... "
yep.
Meg Whitman is running for governor now. She's a tough cookie. We'll see.
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Ksolem
Trad climber
Monrovia, California
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 26, 2009 - 07:26pm PT
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I read your link. Pretty biased and no proof of claims, but whatever.
I'm not endorsing Meg Whitman - just saying it's going to be interesting. If I could pick our next Governor, it would be Tom McClintock. Oh well...
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Ksolem
Trad climber
Monrovia, California
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 26, 2009 - 07:29pm PT
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Radish, While I agree that the crimes listed in your link are horrible, would you please explain how this bill would have any effect to reduce such crimes?
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Radish
Trad climber
Seki, California
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Sep 26, 2009 - 07:41pm PT
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I really can't explain and I don't know if I support the bill. I just thought I"d post this info about the almost 600 killings this year. Where do they get all the ammo?? I know its them killing them but I'm still in a mystery where the ammo comes from....Big 5, Walmart??
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Sep 26, 2009 - 07:43pm PT
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Forget it Jake. Its Chinatown.
(people like radish start with a conclusion and then go seeking "evidence" to support it)
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Radish
Trad climber
Seki, California
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Sep 26, 2009 - 07:52pm PT
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Hey Now.......I'm just asking questions. I don't have a gun but that don't mean I wouldn't get one for christmas. I agree with making the bill for bigger cities that have bigger crime. I work in areas where everyone has a gun but me........
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Ksolem
Trad climber
Monrovia, California
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 26, 2009 - 07:53pm PT
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Actually I think Radish poses a valid question.
And yes, ammo does come from retail stores like walmart.
Will restricting those over the counter sales reduce gang/gun crime?
Not by one round.
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Nor Cal
Trad climber
San Mateo
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Sep 26, 2009 - 08:18pm PT
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I've called the Govonators office twice from two different phones and I've sent an email to him urging him to veto this bill.
This will only affect law abiding citizens. I mean come on- how many crooks mail order ammo?
I go into walmart to buy ammo (I was lucky to get 6 boxes last week) and I only see people who appear to be law abiding citizens purchasing ammo at the stores I go to.
I am happy to show my ID to purchase, but I don't want my purchasing limited to 50 rnds a month. I can shoot 50 rnds in a few minutes.
This law is the first step to taking away our second ammendment rights? What is next? Can't buy pepper spray? No pocket knives? Cops raiding my home for my legally owned guns and taking time to play my wii?
I went climbing last week. While I was gone my wife got a strange phone call late in the night. She called the cops (the caller tried to identify himself as a cop) and they said it was a telemarketer. She got off of the phone and went to make sure she could still open my California approved gun safe. Inside is a 9mm with a tactical light and laser- she won't miss her target. We pratice atleast twice a year and I make sure that she knows what she is doing. So when I am gone climbing I know that my wife is able to defend herself if she needs to. And I know that she appreciates that she has access to the gun.
Please, do your part and tell Arnold to veto this bill!
BTW if Arnold does nothing the bill will pass...
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adam d
climber
closer to waves than rock
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Sep 26, 2009 - 08:39pm PT
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Got my call and email in.
This bill is absurd. Is it a misguided attempt to solve the problem of gun violence, just a symptom of an irrational fear of guns, or an outright way to F with law abiding citizens? Whatever, it needs to be vetoed.
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adam d
climber
closer to waves than rock
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Sep 26, 2009 - 08:45pm PT
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Arnold did veto a different ammo regulation bill in the past (2005) which could bode well.
http://www.gov.ca.gov/pdf/press/vetoes_2005/AB_996_veto.pdf
To the Members of the California State Assembly:
I am returning Assembly Bill 996 without my signature.
This bill is unnecessary because there has been no documentation of a problem with the theft of ammunition from retail establishments. In addition, I have just signed SB 48 by Senator Scott into law which will ensure those underage will no longer be purchasing ammunition.
Requiring retail ammunition sellers to store any handgun ammunition offered for sale in a manner inaccessible to the purchaser would impose more regulation in California without a corresponding benefit to public safety. It is not clear how requiring store employees to obtain and hand customers ammunition instead of letting customers choose their own ammunition will curb crimes committed with firearms. For these reasons I am unable to sign this bill.
Sincerely,
Arnold Schwarzenegger
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Sep 26, 2009 - 08:56pm PT
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BITD when Pro-Arms was still open I'd see off duty cops cruising the ammo aisles walking right past the homeboys who were buying "bullets fer crimz" casting nervous glances at each other.
The homeboys tended not to use the range there for practice though.
Nowadays criminals have to steal their ammo because of scarcity/cost.
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pyrrhonota
Trad climber
Davis, CA
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Sep 26, 2009 - 11:39pm PT
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Thanks for posting, at one point I liked Arnold, but he is really making a lot of bad moves.
Don't just email. Send a PAPER LETTER. They listen to the good ole fashion snail mail a lot more than the emails!
If your wrote an email already print it out and send to:
Governor Arnold Schwarzenegger
State Capitol Building
Sacramento, CA 95814
Seems like an overly short address but it came from: http://gov.ca.gov/interact#contact
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