Fischer Towers difficult new route A...+

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Messages 1 - 8 of total 8 in this topic

HMS

Trad climber

Topic Author's Original Post - Aug 31, 2009 - 05:19pm PT

Found this on Desnivel.com:

http://desnivel.es/object.php?o=18894

TKingsbury

Trad climber

Aug 31, 2009 - 05:29pm PT

some discussion here

http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.html?topic_id=943613

donini

Trad climber

Ouray, Colorado

Aug 31, 2009 - 05:35pm PT

A6+ hmmmm.....? I have a problem with the "new" aid ratings. Talk about subjectivity- with free climbing ratings there is a "physical" difficulty component at work where pure difficulty/endurance can be somewhat quantified. I recall that the the definition of A5 was a pitch that could be completely zippered with serious injury or death as a possible consequence. In the entire history of aid climbing how many deaths have resulted from such a fall? Precious few. With A5 hard to quantify how can anyone justify going to A6, A6+, A7 etc. ? What measuring rod is being used?

dee ee

Mountain climber

citizen of planet Earth

Sep 1, 2009 - 12:27am PT

A6+?

If you rip, people 20 miles away die?

Clint Cummins

Trad climber

SF Bay area, CA

Sep 1, 2009 - 12:55am PT

I think they were just making fun of Jim Beyer's A6 rating, which nobody except him has accepted anyway.

Jensen and Smith already debunked the A6 concept. If the idea is to put a belay at risk, then it is contrived, because you could just use a longer rope. If the idea is "you fall, you die", then just lead the pitch with a tag line (to clean gear for multipitch) and do not clip it to the gear.

My problem with supposed redefined aid ratings is that they are trying to combine the difficulty (will placement hold) with the danger (consequences of fall, previously rated R/X). I thought we learned not to do that when rating free climbs. And like Jim Donini said, few if any such "death falls" have actually been taken.

If people wanted to experience an original A5 route with dangerous mandatory free climbing, and where several aid falls were taken on the FA, they could go try Arches Direct. But nobody tries it.