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Chicken Skinner
Trad climber
Yosemite
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Topic Author's Original Post - Aug 14, 2009 - 01:52pm PT
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I am curious as to what other Parks have a litter problem besides Yosemite and to whether it is directly related to attendance or other factors. What other Parks need some tender loving care? Thanks.
Ken
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SteveW
Trad climber
The state of confusion
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Aug 14, 2009 - 01:55pm PT
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Ken
In my travels over the years, I'd say we should add
Yellowstone, Grand Canyon, and Rocky Mountain national
parks.
Unfortunately it seems visitors bring their bad habits
with them.
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Chicken Skinner
Trad climber
Yosemite
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 14, 2009 - 02:06pm PT
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Thanks Steve.
How about a list of the top ten? What are the biggest problems? Is it micro-trash, fast food containers, toilet paper or something else?
Ken
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jstan
climber
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Aug 14, 2009 - 02:32pm PT
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Fascinating list.
Because we sense litter in proportion to its density the parts of parks that will appear to have the largest problem will be those areas where visitation minutes per square foot is the highest. Turnouts for example. This will be affected by factors such as the pleasure associated with actually throwing the trash. There is a reason we talk about throwing things away, especially when we can throw them a larger distance downhill. I have wondered if we can not turn this to our advantage by placing a dumpster with a bullseye painted on it on our roads. Big downside of course. We might offset that downside by arranging for return fire using stinger missiles. Just a thought.
At least along Route 120 in Yosemite, my specialty, cigarette butts are now the problem most numerous followed by toilet paper. Both can be solved very easily. Including faster acting carcinogens in tobacco is an obvious answer though coloring the butts florescent orange would be very helpful. At park entrances we also need to provide each visitor with a small package of sticks and stones. Recycled of course. Why we do not do this is beyond my understanding.
During the years I was visiting the Tetons and walking in horse pukey around Jenny lake I was tempted to get into the business of retailing #10 corks. However I decided their use would entail some dangers associated with explosion. Then we would have to figure out how to fish all the bridles out of the tree tops.
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Brian Hench
Trad climber
Laguna Beach, CA
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Aug 14, 2009 - 03:12pm PT
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NOT littering is a learned behavior. Littering is the default for city folk.
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GDavis
Trad climber
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Aug 14, 2009 - 03:17pm PT
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The most disgusted I have ever been in a national park was the warm April day that I hiked to the saddle of Angles Landing. The 4 (FOUR) trash cans were full, overflowing, and littered all around them were so many bottles, plastic bags, food bits, broken glass that it made me honestly sick. I am a conservative guy, not the first one to harp on environmental issues, but this was BAD. Often when I'm out hiking if I see a beer can or an MRE wrapper I'll throw it in my pack. I looked at the massive pile, probably enough to fill 2 full size dumpsters, and looked at my 10L pack... nope, not this time.
Then I went over to the restroom to take a leak. No paper, and the ground was covered in newspaper peices torn up and 'used' creatively. I've been in bathrooms in Tijuana that looked like the Awahnee after that.
Maybe it was because the park staff was short that week, or maybe it was just before the trash man showed up... but that killed that experience for me.
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Fletcher
Trad climber
Shivasana
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Aug 14, 2009 - 03:41pm PT
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As a docent-naturalist at a local nature center, when I am leading walks I carry a small trash bag with me. If I see trash I just pick it up. But everyone sees (kids and adults)... it sinks in eventually. As the leader, all eyes are on me.
I do the same when camping/backpacking. I usually reserve a special pocket for trash. Though once, when backpacking in a bowl on the far backside of Kirkwood Ski area, I found an out of bounds sign on a long bamboo pole that had travelled far from home. About 8 foot. I still have it in my garage!
Eric
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blahblah
Gym climber
Boulder
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Aug 14, 2009 - 04:03pm PT
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"NOT littering is a learned behavior. Littering is the default for city folk."
Haha--yeah those red necks, hill billies, and 3rd worlders are all so clean and tidy. I love seeing people's crazy biases--especially the ones that are basically the OPPOSITE of reality. I'm sure I have my own too.
As for RMNP--I've been to plenty of parks and haven't seen any more "dirt" (of the type I think the OP is talking about) there than anywhere else. Sure that's not another bias? I mean it's so close to Boulder/Denver, it has to be dirty, right, b/c of all those "bad" people?
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shakti
climber
Yosemite
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Aug 14, 2009 - 04:44pm PT
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Since I live and work in Yosemite and consider it my home I am truly amazed to walk around on a break, at lunch, or after work and see so much trash on the ground. I wonder if people think, "it is someones job to pick up trash so it's ok if I throw it on the ground." I would hope that is not the case... my optimistic outlook wants to believe it is an accident, a paper fell out here or there... I guess that doesn't really work for cigarette butts though. Why do smokers think it is ok to throw their butts on the floor??... the only butts I want to see on the ground are the ones connected to their bodies sitting down on it.
What kills me is when I walk into a restroom, I only go in the women's, and see toilet paper every where on the floor. It's like someone went into the stall, started pulling paper, and threw it up in the air with excitement. If ya drop the toilet paper on the ground... PICK IT UP... if you don't want to because it's "dirty" grab a small piece of fresh toilet paper and use that to pick it up.
It seems the best way to really show people littering is not ok is by example... not littering ourselves, and most importantly, picking it up when we see it. I encourage anyone and everyone who has the awareness to pick up any trash when you see it on the ground. If we all picked up just a little it would make a BIG difference. It seems like I can't walk more than 10 feet at times without grabbing trash, i'm talking about the litter on the ground, not the trash walking around the park... hehe.
my 2 cents... I think this is my 2nd post on the forum... though I've been a lurker for years.
peace
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Chicken Skinner
Trad climber
Yosemite
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 14, 2009 - 04:47pm PT
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Shakti,
Have we met?
Ken
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shakti
climber
Yosemite
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Aug 14, 2009 - 05:04pm PT
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Yep Kenny, it's Cher, Karin Hutchins sis. And a fellow trash picker-up'er. Just haven't been on the forum til now... I guess you could say I was pretty intimidated by all the banter on this site. But this is a great post. ;0)
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Chicken Skinner
Trad climber
Yosemite
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 14, 2009 - 05:08pm PT
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Hi Cher,
Welcome to the forum. Be here or be slandered.
Ken
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shakti
climber
Yosemite
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Aug 14, 2009 - 05:11pm PT
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Ya, no kiddin, more like "be here AND be slandered"... tis a tough crowd. But entertaining to say the least. ;0)
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Mighty Hiker
Social climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Aug 14, 2009 - 05:14pm PT
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"Be slandered (actually, libelled), whether or not you're here".
I liked jstan's post.
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Mark Not-circlehead
Boulder climber
Martinez, CA
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Aug 14, 2009 - 05:17pm PT
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This place is just like the deli.........I wish I had found ST years ago.
Ken, Pat Sullivan says hey.
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Fletcher
Trad climber
Shivasana
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Aug 14, 2009 - 05:19pm PT
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If everyone just picked up a piece of litter here and there as they went along, it'd set a good example, and help clean up as a giant perpetual facelift!
Eric
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Chicken Skinner
Trad climber
Yosemite
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Topic Author's Reply - Aug 14, 2009 - 05:21pm PT
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Howdy Mark,
Ken
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L
climber
Wrung through the paradox, broken into wholeness
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Aug 14, 2009 - 05:28pm PT
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Denali--hands down.
Those dang grizzlies leave their half-eaten 'boo and moose carcasses all over the place! Stink-O-Rama! And so unsightly!
And don't even get me started on the poo problem--you'd think those omnis had never seen an outhouse before...
;-)
(I'm waiting for a couple more posts before I talk about the tons of garbage on Mt. McKinley...garbage from climbers who did and didn't summit.)
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