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TradIsGood
Half fast climber
the Gunks end of the country
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Topic Author's Original Post - Oct 17, 2007 - 07:49pm PT
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That's right.
What if tomorrow nearly 7 billion humans suddenly started competing with all of the herbivores?
Would the rabbits be better off, or worse?
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Oct 17, 2007 - 07:53pm PT
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Jeez.
Aren't there enough people in Vegas already?
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Jaybro
Social climber
The West
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Oct 17, 2007 - 07:57pm PT
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Really, I had a car stolen there, no way I'm going, 'Their way.'
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TradIsGood
Half fast climber
the Gunks end of the country
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 17, 2007 - 07:57pm PT
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Would we have to slaughter livestock initially?
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climbrunride
Trad climber
Durango, CO
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Oct 17, 2007 - 08:11pm PT
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They wouldn't taste nearly as good as the free-range humans.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Oct 17, 2007 - 08:16pm PT
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Oh. I get it now. Herbivores.
But what other excuse would we have for shooting animals?
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Riotch
Trad climber
Kayenta, Arizona
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Oct 17, 2007 - 08:22pm PT
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We could shoot only herbaviors
 and vegans...
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TradIsGood
Half fast climber
the Gunks end of the country
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 17, 2007 - 08:26pm PT
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yeah Ron, Rabbits and herbivores, not rabbis and herebefores.
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Oct 17, 2007 - 08:34pm PT
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"What if tomorrow nearly 7 billion humans suddenly started competing with all of the herbivores? "
Like we are competing with the carnivores now? Let's put you in the stadium with the lions and see who has meat for dinner.
Of course, we feed the animals we eat using land we could be growing food for ourselves so why don't you tell us your real agenda for this thread and eliminate the guesswork
Not a vegan but respect them and anyone else who sacrifices their own pleasure for the sake of others
Peace
Karl
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mojede
Trad climber
Butte, America
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Oct 17, 2007 - 08:40pm PT
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One might encounter difficulties when presenting this idea (veganism) to the indiginous people(s) of the planet.
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Jobee
Social climber
El Portal
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Oct 17, 2007 - 09:08pm PT
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Go Vegan!
Man is a pliable animal, a being who gets accustomed to everything. -dostoyevsky
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TradIsGood
Half fast climber
the Gunks end of the country
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 17, 2007 - 09:10pm PT
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Now, Karl, there you go again....
This is not about me. Just wondering what the alternative would look like. Would it be a wash? I doubt it.
Certainly we can't eat what the ungulates eat and survive, can we? How would the vegetation on the planet change? What would the impact on the environment be?
So instead of "signing peace", and spoiling for a fight, maybe just try to figure out how the ecosystem would change if suddenly 7 billion people quit eating meat, fish, and eggs.
Or just hang out and see if anybody really does care to speculate on how agriculture would have to change, and what the impact would be. Remember pesticides? Nobody tried to predict the impact that they would have before it happened except with respect to the increase in crop yields.
Could we eat more or less local than we do today? This is a serious question, though perhaps describing an unlikely scenario.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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Oct 17, 2007 - 09:24pm PT
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"Not a vegan but respect them and anyone else who sacrifices their own pleasure for the sake of others"
WTF???? Karl, is that a troll?
Oh, I get it, vegans are more noble than carnivores...sorry. Excuse me while I go barf up some meat.
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happiegrrrl
Trad climber
New York, NY
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Oct 17, 2007 - 09:24pm PT
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What is the purpose of posing speculations on scenarios that are absolutely not going to occur? If you actually was thinking of a comeback that includes some form of "it could happen - please do enlighten me as to what events you envision occurring that would be the catalyst.
This thread just seems like a big time waster to me. Must be nice to have a life that runs so shallow and smoothly that this sort of thing would occupy center stage for more than a passing moment.
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TradIsGood
Half fast climber
the Gunks end of the country
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 17, 2007 - 09:31pm PT
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Time waster she says in her post.
Happie has a great sense of humor and irony.
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Donny... the OHHH!- Riginal
Sport climber
Wal-mart's Happy Isles
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Oct 17, 2007 - 09:33pm PT
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Veganism is devolutionary....as is pacifism.
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Karl Baba
Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
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Oct 17, 2007 - 10:49pm PT
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""Not a vegan but respect them and anyone else who sacrifices their own pleasure for the sake of others"
WTF???? Karl, is that a troll?
Oh, I get it, vegans are more noble than carnivores...sorry. Excuse me while I go barf up some meat."
Animals like to live. Pigs are smarter than dogs, and yet the same people who are horrified to see a dog eaten by the Chinese, or a squirrel hit by a car, laugh at the idea of vegetarianism. Personally, I eat fish and dairy products but my bottom line is that if I wouldn't kill it face to face with my bare hands or a knife, I won't eat it.
Now the fact is, that livestock are fed tons of grain and corn that could be fed to humans, and much of the land to grow other feed could be used to grow food for people, so the vegans make the argument that creating all that meat high on the food chain is an inefficient use of resources. Theoretically, if food ran short on the planet, we could feed more people as vegetarians than as meateaters.
Read "Diet for a small planet" for data on the environmental implications of meat eating.
Peace
Karl
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TradIsGood
Half fast climber
the Gunks end of the country
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 18, 2007 - 12:11am PT
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Karl, are you one of those non-believers in evolution?
Btw. Try living on corn or grass for a while. Not really - it would do bad things to you.
And this post is not about whether one person could do it, but what the effect on the SYSTEM would be if everyone were doing it.
Humans, like your pigs and bears, are omnivores. Perhaps, evolutionarily that advantage is a couple millenia old. Evolution takes lots of generations to work.
Sharpen your pencil. Calculate a diet for average planet human (or just do it for the USA if you like). I know sounds like work. Once you have the diet, figure out how to grow it on the planet or the country. Figure out what it would displace. What other changes would occur. Calculate their impact on insect, bird, etc. life. What transportation changes would occur? Sociological and economic, ...
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climbrunride
Trad climber
Durango, CO
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Oct 18, 2007 - 12:33am PT
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"Humans, like your pigs and bears, are omnivores"
Not me. I'm an opertunivore. Or a freegan. I'm still not sure which one.
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Tarbuster
climber
right here, right now
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Oct 18, 2007 - 12:33am PT
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Lois,
Thanks for catching up with me on the B12 absorption. Yes, lack of intrinsic factor in some few of us.
What about diminishing amounts of stomach acid, as we age, inhibiting B12 uptake?
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