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steelmnkey
climber
Vision man...ya gotta have vision...
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Topic Author's Original Post - Nov 17, 2006 - 02:23pm PT
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Thinking this thread will suffer a quick death, but I'll give it a try...I didn't want to hijack Sooze's thread.
Concerning the "slandering" of the mags...
ha-ha wrote in another thread:
i don't know, but i think it's so core to talk sh#t on the mags.
"oh dewd bro i haven't even looked at one in ten years. so core brah. i got totally whipped on this 5.8 the other day but then i went on the internets and slandered the mags so it all evens out."
so effin core, bra
"so core"? WTF is that? (I know what a bra is...)
ha-ha, your post sort of makes you suspicious of being employed at one of the rags in question...and maybe taking the criticism here personally. If you truly work for one of the mags, then you should get rid of the anonymous handle and come right out and ask the climbers what they would find cool to read or look at. What better place to get direct feedback?
I think when a mag is drawing criticism from the community like has been seen here (and other climbing forums as well), then maybe it's time to address the issue from the source (the Mags themselves in this case). Rather than spewing sarcasm at the abusers, maybe it's time the rags get a little more in touch with their (potential) audience. Seems like Alpinist has a pretty praiseworthy thing going, so might be time to emulate them a little more (R&I already did this partially by beefing up their mag footprint to Al-penis size). In any case, I think it's time for the rags to note the public opinions and get creative.
Put your suggestions down here people. The rags have to be perusing this and other forums...maybe they'll listen and improve. I know some folks on this forum are "way past" bothering with reading the rags, but I can remember when I started climbing and really looking forward to the latest issue, 'cause if I wasn't climbing it helped to at least be reading about it.
Anyways...
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Melissa
Gym climber
berkeley, ca
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Nov 17, 2006 - 02:43pm PT
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I think 'the mags' have to pick between praise from the grand poobahs and maximizing their profit.
R&I and Climbing are aiming for a broader audience, and as such they'll have entire issues that focus on aspects of climbing that I'm not into, but big parts of their paying readership are.
The Alpinist always focuses on a couple of slices of the climbing universe that appeals to the Supertopo crowd.
In praise of R&I though, when I have a proper address again, I'm going to subscribe just for the Tuesday Night Bouldering (which isn't necessarily about bouldering if you haven't read it). Brah-vo.
I've only heard people say "core" when they're making fun of someone else. But I have heard people say "brah" in all seriousness. I'm neither.
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andanother
climber
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Nov 17, 2006 - 02:48pm PT
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Magazines aren't written for those 'in the know'. They are written for the casual climber/skier/biker/etc... that has an interest in a certain sport, but not a ton of knowledge.
Those with a decent amount of knowledge don't buy magazines, no matter what is printed inside them. And the magazines know this. They know who their target audience is. If they change the content to be more savvy, then they won't sell any magazines.
Why do you think climbing mags continually run reviews on things like climbing shoes?
That information doesn't actually benefit anyone, but it sells!
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Zac 817
climber
New York City
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Nov 17, 2006 - 03:08pm PT
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regarding Tuesday Night Bouldering, Melissa I totally agree. I get the magazines often and sometimes I am pleased with interesting articles and photos, other times I'm turned off by unoriginal or weak content or stuff that just isn't geared to my specific interests. in other words, it's a bit of a crapshoot.
BUT TNB is one of the few constantly awesome things that I find in the mags. For a while now I've been meaning to write a letter to them giving them (Andrew Bisharat sp?) props for that column.
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ryanb
climber
Seattle, WA
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Nov 17, 2006 - 03:09pm PT
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The best thing i ever got out of a climbing magazine was some excercises for preventing shoulder pain. That said, I might start reading them again if they had more and better quality topo's. Not supertopo style but the kind put together by the asscending party to give some idea of what is involved in the rout and a touch of humor.
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Crimpergirl
Social climber
St. Louis
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Nov 17, 2006 - 03:11pm PT
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Agree wholeheartedly with DMT...
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Ed Hartouni
Trad climber
Livermore, CA
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Nov 17, 2006 - 03:26pm PT
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I do like the pictures... so Mountain and Alpinist rank highly in my scheme.
Climbing, etc., used to have a lot of "trip reportage" to new places. The climbing scene has changed from the old days because back then, we were many separate communities, often unaware of each other. That is less true these days, we know the climbing scenes now, at least in this hemisphere.
That there is less and less new is part of the maturing of the sport...
Personally, I spend a lot of time on the net connecting to people, and less time looking at the mags... unless it's Alpinist, then I just drool over the pix... if that doesn't do it for me, I get out an old copy of Mountain and reignite old passions.
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Melissa
Gym climber
berkeley, ca
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Nov 17, 2006 - 03:30pm PT
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One thing that I have noticed several times in the magazines over the last couple of years (and I'm presently only an avid Borders peruser) are quips about the lameness of internet climbing chats and those who post to them.
Us: "You're lame."
Them: "No, you're lamer."
Us: "No, you're lamer."
etc...
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maculated
Trad climber
San Luis Obispo, CA
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Nov 17, 2006 - 03:31pm PT
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Think about the mass appeal of any of the mags out there that really win: Maxim, Sports Illustrated, Cosmo, etc. I used to have a subscription to Fitness until I realized EVERY issue said the same thing in different words. Same with the dog magazines - in the end it all recycles.
I don't think magazines get their subscription base from long termers, but from the cycle of newbs. How anyone could subscribe to Cosmo for years is beyond me. There are only so many ways to improve your sex life, find out what your guy is thinking, and get fit for (insert holiday or season).
There's got to be a reason for that. It's the reason I didn't ever get into magazine journalism. There are only so many ways to write a story. And then there's the stories you have to write that aren't stories at all.
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caughtinside
Social climber
Davis, CA
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Nov 17, 2006 - 03:32pm PT
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haha, so true!
I remember reading one issue of climbing a year or so ago, and 3 of the articles talked extensively about 'online climbing forums' and one entire multipage article was about how some Boulder climber created a couple troll identities and trolled online.
fascinati...zzzzz.....
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Melissa
Gym climber
berkeley, ca
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Nov 17, 2006 - 03:35pm PT
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Has Cosmo ever published anything that was truly dirty/shocking? Their headlines are all one big bait and switch!
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caughtinside
Social climber
Davis, CA
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Nov 17, 2006 - 03:35pm PT
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you mean there's really no new, previously undiscovered, sex position?
how disappointing.
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Mungeclimber
Trad climber
one pass away from the big ditch
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Nov 17, 2006 - 03:40pm PT
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Mel, subtle post. nice.
Twould be cool if the topos were all funked out style.
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Russ Walling
Social climber
Out on the sand, Man.....
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Nov 17, 2006 - 03:42pm PT
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The only mag read these days is Hot Belayer Magazine.
It is core to the nuts brah.... dudes the mac and full of the shiznits shizzle to the wizzle every issue and stokes a hella read.
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Euroford
Trad climber
chicago
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Nov 17, 2006 - 03:48pm PT
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yeah but everybody just loves ripping on stuff. mags suck, rc.com sucks, bush sucks, sport climbing sucks, n00bs suck, sucks, suck, sucks ect ect ect.......
i just don't think i'm the target audience.
except i jump up and down like a giddy schoolgirl everytime i get Alpinist in the mail. thus far, i've only been letdown by the Font. article. french bouldering sucks.
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dirtineye
Trad climber
the south
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Nov 17, 2006 - 03:53pm PT
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I don't think it would be too hard to have a good climbing mag that would appeal to people in my age group, but I wonder if it could sell enough issues to be worth doing.
As for slamming the current mags, hah, they have nothing worth reading, but plenty worth making fun of.
Anyone want my free subscription? I never bothered sending it in.
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steelmnkey
climber
Vision man...ya gotta have vision...
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 17, 2006 - 04:17pm PT
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"...entire issues that focus on aspects of climbing that I'm not into, but big parts of their paying readership are."
Seems like if you enough of those sorts of issues, you sort of insure that your only remaining readership is interested in whatever you've focused on, eh? Everyone else goes bye-bye sooner or later.
Like if I had a golf magazine and I solely focused on miniature golf, eventually I'd only have subscribers that were into minature golf? (never thought about comparing miniature golf to bouldering, but hmmmm...it's sort of miniature climbing) :-)
Locker style edit (whatever that means):
Above, someone says the mags are for the casual crowd... then how come they only have super hard stuff in them? I think it's sort of funny that every once in a while, they will have a "moderate" issue and make a big stink about how they're truly serving the moderate climbers as well. Then within a couple of issues, all you can find is V12, 5.14 and oter EXTREEME stuff!!! I like looking at that stuff as much as the next guy, but it's way more fun to be checking out stuff you might actually climb some day. I realize that's just my personal take on it.
Truth be told, I'm probably like Dingus...just burned out on it.
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steelmnkey
climber
Vision man...ya gotta have vision...
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Topic Author's Reply - Nov 17, 2006 - 04:27pm PT
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Dang Russ, that reminds me...it's about time for another issue of Hot Belayer to hit the stands...
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G_Gnome
Boulder climber
Sick Midget Land
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Nov 17, 2006 - 04:34pm PT
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I think part of that community spirit that is now missing is because the community is soooo different. 30 years ago there were only a couple hundred of us in a few scattered areas around the country. Now there are hundreds in every town. Back then if someone wrote in an editorial you probably knew him/her and also knew the people who replied. That is all LONG gone. So now we hunt out smaller groups of people to interface with on this here internet. I think that is part of why most of us at ST don't like RC, there are too many people we don't know there. Where as this is a nice smallish group and we can slander each other ruthlessly knowing that no one will take it too seriously.
Also serious long-term climbers don't tend to be the hero-worshiping type of people, unlike all the noobs that show up for a year or three before getting scared and moving back to the couch. The mags are aiming at them because they need heroes in their scared little lives.
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Melissa
Gym climber
berkeley, ca
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Nov 17, 2006 - 04:38pm PT
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"Also serious long-term climbers don't tend to be the hero-worshiping type of people,"
I totally disagree. Many of y'all just worship a different crowd than is presently getting a lot of press in glossyland.
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