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Greg Barnes
climber
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Topic Author's Original Post - Oct 4, 2003 - 08:57pm PT
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I know this seems dumb, but a number of friends of mine have been blowing it on small gear selection using Supertopos because of the small Camalot numbering scheme vs. the Supertopo crack size descriptions. Especially for those who don't climb all the time in Yosemite (i.e. have Aliens) and those newer to the sport (micro Camalots were just introduced a couple years ago), here's some tips:
Camalot size versus crack size by Supertopo description:
0.1 = 0.4" crack
0.2 = 0.5" crack
0.3 = 0.6" crack
0.4 = 0.75" crack
0.5 = 1" crack
0.75 = 1.25" crack
1 = 1.5" crack
2 = 2" crack
Anyway, after several friends brought 0.4 Camalots along because the Supertopo says 0.4" crack, and got stuck with no blue aliens/0 TCUs/0.1 Camalots, I figured a reminder is in order.
Of course, this is similar to the confusion with the original Friends being sized by the completely-open size versus the actual crack size for an optimal placement...
Greg
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Wade Icey
climber
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I'm not too new to the sport, I have aliens, and climb in the ditch fairly often but I'm also confused fairly easily and often. Are you referring to crack size on the topo, i.e. 'many .5"-1.5", or Cam size on the rack list for the topo, i.e. "Cams- 2ea. .04" , or both?
The Cam size Comparison Chart in the Big Walls book seems pretty accurate. Although none of my camalots are pink (Mike, is that CMYK, RGB, DIC, or mayhaps, KGB color?).
More dazed than confused,
Wade
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Greg Barnes
climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 5, 2003 - 12:34pm PT
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Crack size on the topo.
e.g. 0.6" crack = green alien, 1 TCU, 0.3 Camalot, 0.5 Friend, etc.
e.g. 1" crack = red alien, 3 TCU, 0.5 Camalot, 1.25 Friend, etc.
Greg
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Apocalypsenow
Trad climber
Cali
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I don’t know guys... it is this type of “beta” that makes me wonder where climbing is headed. I know, I know...we don’t have to read it, hear it. And this isn’t an attempt to slander. Just wondering?...
I suppose if it is a climb that is really pushing my abilities I will go light on the rack, but otherwise...why not just carry the whole thing?
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Wade Icey
climber
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"it is this type of “beta” that makes me wonder where climbing is headed. I know, I know...we don’t have to read it, hear it. And this isn’t an attempt to slander. Just wondering?... "
Just my opinion but i don't think this type of beta really has any effect on where climbing is heading, at least not where my experience of climbing is heading. I've always been a gearhead, so am fascinated by comparisons and trivial details of routes I've done or want to do. I've always sought info that will lighten my rack (or make room for one more OE in the bag). It's pretty cool (IMHO) to have exactly what i need to do a route, not one biner more or less. Plus, as a slightly OC type I enjoy the research, racking, sorting, packing, and sawing toothbrushes in half aspect of climbing. It may seem over the top but I also have gear lists for most of the routes I've done over the last two decades. That way i have an inventory in case of thievery and if i do a route and don't use something, or need something, I edit the list accordingly. Knowledge is power (and laziness is motivation to lighten that rack ). I've never felt that beta diminished the adventure factor one bit or having the right gear 'tainted' an ascent. Even the old green Roper guide gave rack info and the meyers guide evolved from notebooks passed around camp. I don't see how the new topo on the block is any different, except, like gear the quality of the info has evolved. If anyone is yearning for the good old days I'll make xerox's of the green guide. It has the pin rack for Serenity ( '25 pitons, including a 2"bong. Many 1" and 1.5" angles are necessary').
Now you've got me wondering Apocalypse. Where do you think climbing is headed and how does beta figure into the equation? just curious. Beats arguing about bolts, eh?
Wade
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Apocalypsenow
Trad climber
Cali
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I guess I picture myself getting ready to climb with someone new, throwing my rack over my shoulder and my new partner saying,”aren’t you going to remove some of those pieces you aren’t going to need according to this topo?”
My response...naaa... it makes me a stronger climber to carry a little extra gear.
Guess it was one of the reasons I don't really care for my grade climbing, 5.10, at The Creek. I like to really have to think about what gear to place. The climbs all seemed like sport/gear climbing, placing the same piece as I went.
And... I would enjoy doing Serenity with steel. I don't think it would go over to well (I have the Green Guide).
Just my opinion.
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Rich the Brit
Trad climber
San Ramon, CA
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Any advice as to what to wear?
Lycra leggings or baggy cargo pants, tank tops or turtle necks, stripes or hoops, lavender or sky blue...
I'm at a loss. I won't feel prepared for that climb unless I know that I am wearing the "correct" attire.
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NeverSurfaced
Trad climber
a place I love/hate to live
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Glad to hear I’m not the only one corn-fused. I was discussing this very thing with a baddy light night while re-racking. I didn’t know if the cam size “small to 2” referred to the open & active (approx 80-90% engaged) measurements of the cam. Everyone I know, including myself tends to reference all other cams by camalot sizing (i.e. we call a #4 Metolious a .75). I know I’ve seen comparison charts in a few different guides, but the whole topic’s always been a bit fuzzy to me.
I don’t really feel that rack info is ‘diluting’ the ‘sport’ of climbing. Now if the guidebook included someone who’d place the gear for you, that’d be different. Like Apocalypsenow, I tend err on the side of taking too much (i.e. larger rack) to the ridicule of some partners who like to ask where the portaledge is.
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